Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westministenders: Boris is reminded of the Munich Post.

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 07/02/2017 11:36

The Munich Post was the 1930s German Newspaper that refused to normalise. It refused to bow to the threats and intimidation of the Nazi State. It was to eventually closed but it defended the truth to the bitter end.

With Trump’s systematic attacks on the Press and Judiciary we should take heed. We must stand up for our journalists who seek to serve the public rather than serve their masters and only chase profit.

We must ask why, right wing extremists when they make attacks are too frequently labelled simply as lone wolfs who exist within a vacuum, when it is widely accepted by intelligence services that Muslim extremists are often the products of online radicalisation and any element of mental history is totally irrelevant because of their religion.

The PM hiring advertising agents to try and deal with a problem of increasing racial tensions rather than talking to the newspaper executives who she has close relationships with, is a deliberate missing of the point.

It is an abdication of responsibility and is wilfully ignorant.

It is about time we addressed the hole of hatred in our society that exists properly. From all angles and approaches, from all parts of our society. The blind spot in failing to acknowledge how the media’s role in this only serves to fuel the divisions. It has become normalised. Powerful lobbying groups like the Freedom Association continue to deny that populism has contributed to a rise in hate crime pointing to a dislike for how incidents are recorded. Their influence in Westminster is too apparent.

Some of the comments made in the houses of commons and to the media by Tory MPs have been worryingly close to comments made by Trump and his associates. They have been worryingly close to online trolls. They have been laced with too many ‘alternative facts’ and full of exaggerated language about immigrants. Language, its use and context are important and powerful.

These are elected officials with a social responsibility. Instead they are continue to stir things. We no longer need Farage and worry about UKIP. We have a whole bunch of them in the HoC and a quick trawl though Hansard reveals them in all their glory. To a privileged white man they are Trump apologists. During the debate over Trump’s visit to the UK, one even thought it appropriate to woof at a female MP. In 2017.

We might be very British in the way our alternative facts are being expressed but the same threats are very much present within British politics as they are currently in US politics. We might not have anyone quite as brash and brazen as Trump (with the possible exception of Farage), but this makes it more not less dangerous. People like IDS and Johnson add respectably to the thin veneer of hatred and xenophobia.

A50 is likely to pass the commons, without amendment as things stand. (I think we need to watch the Lords with interest) We are perhaps likely to enter a period where things might quieten down in the UK for a time. We must be vigilant and not accept normalisation and continue to make noise about how we feel about the future of this country or we will be dominated by the agenda of these individuals who have little respect for the interests of anyone who is not part of their boys club.

Theresa May may not be one of them, but like Trump she craves their approval and does share many of their values. She is happy to pander to them, and them to her as she makes their toxicity somehow more acceptable.

What women do next is crucial. Do we want to accept this vision of the future? Now is not the time to fall silence and accept that things are equal now. We know the reality. And it affects all of us, regardless of how we voted on 23rd June.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
RedToothBrush · 08/02/2017 00:10

When you have a lot of money it would be easy to cover up not being able to read simply because you can pay everyone to do stuff for you. Plus you can buy a degree if you want. I would hardly say that being able to become President was an achievement if you can't read if you have the money to deal with the situation.

Personally I think, that if Trump has issues with reading, whether though being illiterate or dyslexia, then due diligence would require him to make this known so that measures to assist him could be put in place. He should have this as a systematic way of dealing with his problems to ensure he was fully up to speed.

The fact he isn't reading EO is the point. He may or may not have reasons why he isn't. But if he's unaware of their contents then he's not using due diligence. Or someone is abusing this.

Either way, an admission that he is not reading EO is an admission he is a) not doing his job properly or is b) unable to do his job properly or c) someone is deliberately abusing their position in assisting Trump. Each possibility should result in an action yet nothing has been done.

Therefore Trump is failing in his duty as President one way or another and its difficult to find a way to excuse that or justify it.

OP posts:
MockTurtleSoup · 08/02/2017 00:15

Quite Red either way, its shocking.

mathanxiety · 08/02/2017 01:33

David Blunkett?
He was unable to read in the typically accepted way.
He was still able to do his job.

Among the many enormous differences between Blunkett and Trump is that Blunkett values reading and what can be learned from it, while Trump bypasses the matter altogether, and is therefore led by the nose by Bannon and before him the equally rabid right winger Roy Cohn, his lawyer.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Birch_Society

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_Cohn

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Goals_Foundation

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Goals_Institute

Motheroffourdragons · 08/02/2017 06:40

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ to protect the privacy of the user.

CeciledeVolanges · 08/02/2017 08:11

Goodness, this reminds me strongly of the rule in HoC about not accusing someone of lying in the chamber: www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/08/elizabeth-warren-mitch-mcconnell-silence-senate-debate-jeff-sessions-nomination

In the worst possible way

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 08:45

first sign of inconvenience or a sawn off shotgun..

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 08:59

CeciledeVolanges double posting, sorry!

BigChocFrenzy · 08/02/2017 09:10

Thanks for the great OP again, red Flowers
A very topical reminder that it is important to stand up against the state, even if you are very unlikely to win.
Especially when that state is becoming more oppressive - it only gets tougher to oppose if you wait until you are certain that the state has become autocratic, fascist / communist / theocratic etc

Also, the SNP and the MSPs were absolutely right in voting to show that Scotland's elected representatives oppose a particular course of action from Westminster, whether that be Brexit or rolling back the welfare state or any other fundamental change.
No point in having MSPs if they just accept everything Westminster orders, like a well-behaved colony.

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 09:15

Is there any Lindt left BCF ?Grin

Kaija · 08/02/2017 09:16

Thanks Red.

More on The Morning Post here and contemporary parallels (apologies if already linked):

lareviewofbooks.org/article/normalization-lesson-munich-post/

SemiPermanent · 08/02/2017 09:16

No point in having MSPs if they just accept everything Westminster orders, like a well-behaved colony.

Whilst I agree that it is right that the Scottish Parliament had a vote on Brexit, I did lol at the well-behaved colony line.

The SNP are the epitome of a well-behaved colony!
They are very tightly controlled as a group!!

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 09:16

@ProgressOnline
Look, I'm not saying it's time to panic, but democracy is over

Is today's HOC vote, Warren's shutdown in senate, judgement on Moslem ban choreographed?

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 09:25

Fortunately the Scots are taught about England's colonial past. The Highland Clearances and Culloden are seared into national consciousness.
The English invention of concentration camps in South Africa is not forgotten, and the Irish still have famine cottages standing, reminding them of the Great Famine, and in living memory Bloody Sunday. Twelfth century York burnt out all its Jewish inhabitants.
The English will find that these colonial incidents are remembered by many nations, even if they choose not to.

Motheroffourdragons · 08/02/2017 09:43

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ to protect the privacy of the user.

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 09:44

Thanks Jezza:
Golden Dawn will be in charge of security at Europe's back door:
www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/07/greece-debt-imf-split-bailout

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 09:51

So, remember this day.

February 8th 2017 is the day democracy died.

If you think state sponsored racism and sexism, vicious verbal and physical attacks, denial of natural justice and internment are bad now in Britain, wait till you see what's coming down the line.

Lots of work available as internment camp officers.

England can be proud it led the way.

BigChocFrenzy · 08/02/2017 09:51

I totally reject the idea that in a bad situation any change is for the good.

As a woman of colour, angry at discrimination and inequality, I wouldn't vote for the BNP or the Klu Klux Klan.
Supporting / voting for the far right, like Trump or Farage / Nuttall or LePen, to help the poor and vulnerable is comparable to that.
It is voting for the abusers,
those who are mostly responsible for the worst of the problems.

(from the Indie article) Shadow business minister Jack Dromey questioned Ms May's sincerity in protecting workers' rights.

"Under the Tories, Brexit risks making a bad situation worse," - exactly.
"I simply do not believe assurances that Theresa May will protect workers’ rights that are currently guaranteed by membership of the European Union."

On these threads, Remainers are continually criticising govt actions that make life worse for the most vulnerable, such as NHS cuts & privatisation, such as welfare cuts, such as women with a 3rd baby needing to provide evidence of rape to obtain the same benefits for them as for the first two (why on earth would Lexiters repeatedly defend the govt over the latter ?)

There should be a huge amount of centre & left common ground in opposing govt actions except for Brexit itself, but Lexiters seems to have rejected that in favour of unconditional cheerleading for a Brexit govt.

I totally understand Leavers who are of the Tory hard right, because they have always held social Darwinist values & aims which a hard Brexit would enable perfectly.
Trump and May represent their views well.
However, currently Lexiters and those rightwing Leavers seem joined at the hip. Hallo, Hoey.
Very difficult to tell the difference or to understand this alliance.

BigChocFrenzy · 08/02/2017 09:55

btw, when the UK is desperately seeking quick agreement to its WTO schedules, those former colonies have a once in a lifetime opportunity for payback for oppression, slaughter, famine.

woman12345 · 08/02/2017 09:57

However, currently Lexiters and those rightwing Leavers seem joined at the hip. Hallo, Hoey Very difficult to tell the difference or to understand this allianciances.
It was the National Socialist Party, in Germany. We all have to look to our consciences, including those on the left.

Peregrina · 08/02/2017 10:07

I don't think the old colonies will forget either. They weren't brought up on the fairytale about the wonders of Empire as we older ones were. They lived with the reality.

whatwouldrondo · 08/02/2017 10:14

To my certain knowledge one of the colonies looking forward to deflating the illusions of entitlement and superiority, and relishing the chance to even out the power in the relationship, is Australia, and they are not one of the colonies who have the most to be resentful about.....

RedToothBrush · 08/02/2017 10:16

Scottish independence voting intention:

Yes: 49% (+3)
No: 51% (-3)

(via BMG / 26 - 31 Jan)

Excluding DKs.
Changes with December.

OP posts:
RedToothBrush · 08/02/2017 10:19

Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
Betfair punters make it a 67% chance that Corbyn will go before GE following reports that he's given his "exit date" to close colleagues

Say what? What have I missed?

OP posts:
prettybird · 08/02/2017 10:19

I used to have some respect for Kate Hoey - she was against the Iraq War - but I think she is blinkered in her dislike of the EU and is actually letting down the very people she claims to support (if she is indeed left wing Hmm). Sleep with the rats, catch their fleas.

Swipe left for the next trending thread