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Brexit

Westministenders: Boris is reminded of the Munich Post.

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 07/02/2017 11:36

The Munich Post was the 1930s German Newspaper that refused to normalise. It refused to bow to the threats and intimidation of the Nazi State. It was to eventually closed but it defended the truth to the bitter end.

With Trump’s systematic attacks on the Press and Judiciary we should take heed. We must stand up for our journalists who seek to serve the public rather than serve their masters and only chase profit.

We must ask why, right wing extremists when they make attacks are too frequently labelled simply as lone wolfs who exist within a vacuum, when it is widely accepted by intelligence services that Muslim extremists are often the products of online radicalisation and any element of mental history is totally irrelevant because of their religion.

The PM hiring advertising agents to try and deal with a problem of increasing racial tensions rather than talking to the newspaper executives who she has close relationships with, is a deliberate missing of the point.

It is an abdication of responsibility and is wilfully ignorant.

It is about time we addressed the hole of hatred in our society that exists properly. From all angles and approaches, from all parts of our society. The blind spot in failing to acknowledge how the media’s role in this only serves to fuel the divisions. It has become normalised. Powerful lobbying groups like the Freedom Association continue to deny that populism has contributed to a rise in hate crime pointing to a dislike for how incidents are recorded. Their influence in Westminster is too apparent.

Some of the comments made in the houses of commons and to the media by Tory MPs have been worryingly close to comments made by Trump and his associates. They have been worryingly close to online trolls. They have been laced with too many ‘alternative facts’ and full of exaggerated language about immigrants. Language, its use and context are important and powerful.

These are elected officials with a social responsibility. Instead they are continue to stir things. We no longer need Farage and worry about UKIP. We have a whole bunch of them in the HoC and a quick trawl though Hansard reveals them in all their glory. To a privileged white man they are Trump apologists. During the debate over Trump’s visit to the UK, one even thought it appropriate to woof at a female MP. In 2017.

We might be very British in the way our alternative facts are being expressed but the same threats are very much present within British politics as they are currently in US politics. We might not have anyone quite as brash and brazen as Trump (with the possible exception of Farage), but this makes it more not less dangerous. People like IDS and Johnson add respectably to the thin veneer of hatred and xenophobia.

A50 is likely to pass the commons, without amendment as things stand. (I think we need to watch the Lords with interest) We are perhaps likely to enter a period where things might quieten down in the UK for a time. We must be vigilant and not accept normalisation and continue to make noise about how we feel about the future of this country or we will be dominated by the agenda of these individuals who have little respect for the interests of anyone who is not part of their boys club.

Theresa May may not be one of them, but like Trump she craves their approval and does share many of their values. She is happy to pander to them, and them to her as she makes their toxicity somehow more acceptable.

What women do next is crucial. Do we want to accept this vision of the future? Now is not the time to fall silence and accept that things are equal now. We know the reality. And it affects all of us, regardless of how we voted on 23rd June.

OP posts:
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Kaija · 10/02/2017 13:11

Tweet from Lib Dem peer Lord Strasburger.

This is typical of many messages I am receiving:

Westministenders: Boris is reminded of the Munich Post.
Peregrina · 10/02/2017 13:25

Is that your letter Kaija and his response is a bit fat silence?

I had a positive reply from Peter Hain. It was the standard reply he was sending to everyone but at least it was virtually by return.

Kaija · 10/02/2017 13:27

No not mine! He just tweeted it.

Peregrina · 10/02/2017 13:40

Do I take it with a name like Strasburger that he is Jewish? In which case, he is probably significantly more mindful of where the present Government's and Trumps actions may lead.

Yes, I know for the Leavers on the thread, mentioning a slippery slope towards fascism is something they take exception to.

MockTurtleSoup · 10/02/2017 13:57

Well done to Lord Strasburger (fantastic name!)

Kaija · 10/02/2017 14:07

Possibly. He's also a lib dem, and for all their faults they seem to be the only ones collectively keeping their heads straight just now.

Meanwhile in France:

foreignpolicy.com/2017/02/08/french-intelligence-agency-braces-for-russian-bots-to-back-le-pen/

The likelihood that there wasn't a similar influx here before the referendum seems vanishingly small.

Tryingtosaveup · 10/02/2017 14:35

Don't forget us Leavers are also writing to the Lords.
I find it astonishing that many on the Left, who would have abolished the HOL last year, are now depending on them to stop A50.

Kaija · 10/02/2017 14:38

Are you sure it's the same people, Trying? It if of course not just those on the left who oppose the government's present course. I've never had Ken Clarke down as a lefty.

By all means post your letters on here.

Tanith · 10/02/2017 14:41

You don't know many journalists then, Gloria? If they're your close friends and you've discussed it?
Only you did say none of the journalists you know post on here. It sounds like such a tiny sample as to make your comment irrelevant.

Peregrina · 10/02/2017 14:45

I didn't think John Bercow was particularly a leftie either, although his views have changed over the years.

I find it astonishing that it's now a Tory calling for the abolition of the House of Lords. Why only last year Cameron was threatening to pack it out with more Tories. I do wish they would make their minds up what they want.

lalalonglegs · 10/02/2017 14:48

I've shaken off my ennui and I'm going to write to some peers - would anyone like to advise me of the names that would be particularly useful to target?

Kaija · 10/02/2017 15:00

I can't but would like to ask the same question.

Full list with email addresses here:

www.parliament.uk/mps-lords-and-offices/lords/

SapphireStrange · 10/02/2017 15:11

Red gave me/us this link earlier about the Lords and their interests; I haven't had time to look at it yet but it sounds useful.

Peregrina · 10/02/2017 15:18

Don't sent the same email to more than six, or it will get blocked. I wrote to a few and tried to pick out something which was a particular concern.

boredofbrexit · 10/02/2017 16:42

At the risk of being told off for flagging up news, I'll point you to an evidence basedWink report in the Telegraph that the economy is firing on all cylinders.
(Yes, I realise we haven't left yet but its good to have That Friday Feeling)

Kaija · 10/02/2017 17:24

It would be great news, bored, if we had a reasonable expectation of building on that by continuing to trade within the single market and customs union. Sadly, all the indications are that we are about to throw it all away.

Peregrina · 10/02/2017 17:47

Yes, bored, I read a report this morning, of a business committing to the UK (can't remember now which), but the commitment was actually made before last June. So the implication that this is a sign of increased confidence in the country is not entirely true.

CeciledeVolanges · 10/02/2017 18:06

peregrina do you remember when the Tories were supposed to be trustworthy on the economy and were trying to reduce the deficit?

CeciledeVolanges · 10/02/2017 18:07

And Trying I think you will find that barely anyone is trying to stop Article 50. We are just trying to stop every available bit of power being conferred on Theresa May without oversight or constraint.

Kaija · 10/02/2017 18:14

Trump to visit during recess to avoid issue of addressing parliament.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/feb/10/british-officials-drop-plans-donald-trump-address-parliament-queen-elizabeth?CMP=sharebtnn_tw

"Officials are also said to be keen to limit the president’s public exposure more generally during the visit, in order to reduce the opportunities for protests and disorder on a state occasion. "

Peregrina · 10/02/2017 18:25

Some bright spark in the comments has said it would be a short address of 160 words!

lalalonglegs · 10/02/2017 18:32

Ooh, this is interesting.

Britain will remain under the jurisdiction of the European court of justice for years to come if it seeks a transition deal to cushion its withdrawal from the EU, the chief negotiator for the European parliament has said.

WrongTrouser · 10/02/2017 18:32

Can I ask a question?

Those of you who would like the House of Lords to stick a spanner in the triggering of A50 - what is it about the HoL that you think gives it the right (I don't been legally, I mean morally and politically) to overturn the referendum result AND the democratic decision of the HoC?

And if it is that the HoL are somehow above the political fray, able to bring their own wisdom to their decision etc, etc, then why are you lobbying them?

Figmentofmyimagination · 10/02/2017 18:34

HL abolition proposals - Yet another spooky parallel with the build up to the First World War.

Figmentofmyimagination · 10/02/2017 18:39

WT do you know anything about the progress of eg the Trade Union Act in 2016? I think you'll find that sadly, nowadays, the Lords is where you find rational, considered debate by people who are not afraid of the tabloids etc. it's just 'real politics'.

It's the same sort of reason why someone like Margaret Hodge - one of the stand out wealthiest members of parliament - is able to fight her corner so superbly on the Public Accounts Committee - these are people who really don't give a shit anymore who is going to give them their next job post politics - and that, sadly, is how you get good decision making! Shock!

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