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Brexit

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Westministenders: Boris and his friends hand in their homework to be marked.

990 replies

RedToothBrush · 03/02/2017 14:10

The last week has been depressing for a lot of people.

Even if you are happy about the vote in the Commons, there is a worrying lack of backbone in MPs of all shades.

Then there’s what is going on in the USA which I’m going to quietly ignore in this post except to say that cosying up to Trump still could backfire on all who do for numerous reasons.

It seems like its all over in someways, but there is still plenty going on.

The A50 Bill has only passed stage one. The Government’s deliberate publishing of the White Paper after the vote has left a lot of people with egg all over their face.

Plus its just crap. Actually its not crap. It’s a dog dinner of farcical proportions with no content, faulty data and incorrect details that an A-Level Student did the night before their assignment was due, masquerading as an official government document.

Now its amendment time, which is the serious bit. For an amendment to make it, it will need cross party support. After the government failed to produce a White Paper worth the paper it was written on, and insulted the intelligence of the House of Commons, that could get interesting.

For starters the White Paper says that EU citizens are one of our best bargaining chips. Trouble is a lot of Tory and Labour MPs don’t agree.

In short there is a fair old chance of a government defeat next week at some point. The government don’t want any. Especially not this early. I really think it will be very difficult for the government to provide the assurance MPs will want, even if they crack the whip. They have lost the trust of too many. In voting for the first vote, many MPs will feel they have shown their intent to support leaving and now will get busy on trying to hammer down the details.

Highlights include of the White Paper include the idea that we will still be subject to the ECJ except we won’t. This is ridiculous. We will be subject to ECJ rulings but not be subject to ECJ rulings directly. Eh? What? (Not that we didn’t see this coming). There’s Euroatom and the government doing an impression of Homer Simpson. With a by-election in Copeland on the cards. That story has some time to keep running. As Steve Peers points out, the Leprechauns are going to sort out Northern Ireland for us which is a great political strategy to employ.

Its full of lots of other utter bollocks but those particular points are the ones that are potentially the most problematic for the government. If you don’t think the White Paper screams we are going to get eaten alive by the EU and Trump, you need to get off the hallucinogenics pronto.

If that isn’t awe inspiring enough we also have:

The wonderful mental image of Paul Nuttall kipping on a mattress in a house in Stoke disparately pretending to be a Stokie, nervously hoping that letterbox rattling in the wind isn’t C4 letterbox again and that the coppers don’t pay him a visit in the near future. I confess that whilst my imagination has been kept busy with this, I am disappointed in the lack of video clips of him munching on an Oatcake in a Stoke City shirt, sitting on an Armitage Shanks throne, turning his plate over whilst listening to Robbie Williams and with a Titanic by his side. All at the same time. I think he’s missed a few tricks.

AND

Diane Abbott doing quite possibly even more damage to Labour than them merely rolling over and dying over a50 by pulling a sickie. Her ‘Brexit Flu’ damages the party’s image and Corbyn himself even more. If that’s even possible. Some Labour MPs have demanded an apology.

Labour is starting to look like it’s a ship with rats fleeing this week. MPs have defied a three line whip and quite the Shadow Cabinet (Again). Rumours are that over 7000 members have left. A councillor has defected to the Lib Dems. There was a council by election in Rotherham where Lab lost a seat to the LDs in an area where there has never been as many people vote LD. Nor were there as many remain voters as LD voters. The Parliamentary vote for Unite’s new leader has unsurprisingly selected the anti-Corbyn candidate Gerald Coyne over Len McCluskey. The bookies have dropped the odds on Corbyn leaving Labour before a GE from 6/1 to 2/1 overnight. Oh and Red Ed is being rumoured to be returning to the front bench…

OP posts:
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Peregrina · 05/02/2017 17:34

The speech was from 2012

"How to negotiate such a change, and how to obtain the approval of the British people for attempting such a historic deal ......".
"I believe that we can achieve both of these aims with a focussed approach, using the so-called double referendum strategy. This is less complex than it sounds"

"First it requires us to decide very clearly what our negotiating aims are – really what I have just laid out – during the course of the next year."

So the clowns had 3 and a half years to work something out and the best they could do was a cobbled together white paper printed in the small hours of the morning it was due to be presented, with poor grammar and errors.

HashiAsLarry · 05/02/2017 17:48

I can see why he was thought of as a man who could run with a plan. Its pretty clear though that they don't have a plan.

woman12345 · 05/02/2017 18:02

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/27-tory-rebels-threatening-to-wreck-brexit-bill-amendments-article-50-a7563541.html
plus 100 from last week = 127 against at this stage?

JamieXeed74 · 05/02/2017 18:02

TM has set out the plan very very clearly. Its just that you dont like the plan.

HashiAsLarry · 05/02/2017 18:04

I haven't seen or heard a plan.

If you know the plan, or are able to copy and paste it I'm sure we'd all be delighted to see it.

woman12345 · 05/02/2017 18:05

But what about the people?
F
^Mr Baker, who chairs the pro-Brexit European Research Group, claimed the group of 27 – who he did not name – could unite with opposition parties to demand the rights of EU citizens living in the UK are protected and to press for a “meaningful” final debate on the terms of the exit package.
The bill sailed through its second reading and returns to the Commons for three days this week when a number of amendments will be debated before the final vote on whether to begin the exit process is held this Wednesday.
Mr Baker said: “I understand 27 Conservative MPs plan to support wrecking amendments to the Withdrawal Bill, weakening the Prime Minister’s hand and exposing the bill to damage in the Lords.”
And, referring to the decision by the Irish Parliament in 2008 to vote down its own referendum result and hold a second one, he said: “Given the court case in Ireland, we know at least some MPs intend to overturn the result^.

woman12345 · 05/02/2017 18:06

So there's constitutional precedent on second ref.

RedToothBrush · 05/02/2017 18:07

www.theguardian.com/media/2017/feb/05/rupert-murdoch-access-to-downing-street-theresa-may-david-cameron?CMP=twt_gu
Rupert Murdoch accused of enjoying ‘astounding access’ to Downing Street
Murdoch executives met PM or chancellor 10 times in a year – more than any other media organisation, report reveals

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/diane-abbott-resign-article-50-parliament-vote-brexit-bill-caroline-flint-itv-peston-on-sudnay-a7563751.html
Labour MPs renew calls for Diane Abbott to resign after she misses crucial Article 50 vote with 'migraine'

OP posts:
woman12345 · 05/02/2017 18:07

^As Trump tries to close America’s doors, Muslims are opening theirs on Visit My Mosque Day
People had interesting questions and concerns – Are women allowed to visit? Yes. Do women need to cover their hair? Not necessarily, but it might be nice to try it out. Can couples hold hands? I don’t see why not. What about LGBTQ visitors? All welcome, as the invitation says^
www.independent.co.uk/voices/visit-my-mosque-day-donald-trump-muslim-ban-open-doors-a7564036.html

woman12345 · 05/02/2017 18:08

I'm going to email my local mosque. It's a bit late to visit, but might enquire if they have any events on.

HesterThrale · 05/02/2017 18:12

Thanks Semi for providing a date and context to Davis' speech. I wasn't being deliberately disingenuous saying 'before the referendum'. I tried to date it but there doesn't appear to be date on the page at all.

www.daviddavismp.com/david-davis-mp-delivers-speech-on-the-opportunities-for-a-referendum-on-europe/

However, the bottom line, I think, is that many people feel really anxious that we may have to accept whatever deal it's possible to negotiate in the short time available. (Or no deal at all, as TM suggested in her Jan 17th speech).
And that after A50 is triggered we have absolutely no say, or recourse to ask questions, about said deal. Is that truly going to be the case? It seems hard.

JamieXeed74 · 05/02/2017 18:14

HashiAsLarry, I am sure you have read TM speech at Lancester House last month. She covers pretty much everything she can without weakening our negotiating position.

Fingers crossed none of the wrecking bills get passed.

JamieXeed74 · 05/02/2017 18:19

we may have to accept whatever deal it's possible to negotiate in the short time available

Their are no other options, what else can anyone do? However whatever the outcome there is no reason why after we have left the EU we can't keep changing/improving the deal as time goes by, including under a new government. Its not set in stone.

InformalRoman · 05/02/2017 18:21

Hashi You must have missed The Plan - it's here.

HashiAsLarry · 05/02/2017 18:22

I have a similar plan for my local football club.

-Buy the best players
-Stop players getting injured
-Win every game
-Collect league trophy

Except that's not a plan, its a wish list.

HashiAsLarry · 05/02/2017 18:23

informal Grin

Worryingly those headlines have thought about more than TM did. At least it addressed Scotland.

Kaija · 05/02/2017 18:27

"TM has set out the plan very very clearly. Its just that you dont like the plan."

Was it the one where we're going to make a success of it, and we all get 14 weeks holiday a year?

TheElementsSong · 05/02/2017 18:29

Informal and Hashi Grin

JamieXeed74 · 05/02/2017 18:29

You might call it a wish list others would call it a good starting point for the negotiations. Po-tae-toe, Po-ta-to, To-May-to, To-Ma-toe

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 05/02/2017 18:30

Oooh Yes kaiji

I like that plan

HashiAsLarry · 05/02/2017 18:32

There's a whole world of difference between having a good starting point for negotiations and having a plan.

Though having a starting point for negotiation should figure on the plan somewhere. TM et all can have that one for free.

TheElementsSong · 05/02/2017 18:32

good starting point

What, we might get more than 14 weeks holiday post-Brexit? Holy shitballs, count me in! Grin

Peregrina · 05/02/2017 18:34

So we jump of a cliff. If we are lucky we don't break our necks. If we are still alive, we hope that someone else is alive and comes along to rescue us.

It may be Theresa May's idea of a plan, but it isn't mine. It's about the level of intelligence of a three year old.

Lico · 05/02/2017 18:36

Fillon:
Email circulating in London French Community:
File on Fillon was picked up by Ministry of Finances and given to Hollande who via intermediaries (all ENA buddies) gave it to Le Canard Enchaîné '. Hollande instructed: 'use this file as you see fit' . This was meant to destroy Fillon in order to give advantage to Macron who is Hollande's darling.
***

AFFAIRE Fillon

A qui profite le plus cette affaire ? A Emmanuel MACRON, bien évidemment.

La gauche étant hors jeu, il ne reste que François FILLON comme adversaire pour passer le 1 er tour.

Alors comment faire pour salir l’adversaire : employer les bonnes vieilles méthodes et jeter l’opprobre.

Le « dossier » émane du Ministère des Finances et a été remis au Canard Enchainé par Gaspard GANTZER, grand ami d’Emmanuel MACRON (même Promotion à l’ENA) auquel il doit son poste à l’Elysée.

Entre amis, on se doit des services et des renvois d’ascenseurs.

Circuit du dossier:

Thomas CAZENAVE (ENA, Promotion République, ex Directeur de Cabinet d’Emmanuel MACRON, et nouveau Secrétaire Général Adjoint de l’Elysée, en remplacement de Boris VALLAUD, mari de Najat VALLAUD-BELKACEM) a remis les documents à François HOLLANDE en guise d’allégeance au Souverain.

HOLLANDE a transmis ce « dossier » à GANTZER en lui disant simplement « Faites en bon usage »

GANTZER est un grand ami d’Emmanuel MACRON, ils sont de la même Promotion à l’ENA -Promotion SENGHOR.

Il est également un proche de Dominique STRAUSS-KAHN.

Le Mardi 9 Janvier, Gaspard GANTZER a rencontré Michel GAILLARD, directeur de la Rédaction du Canard Enchaîné (et ami de longue date de François HOLLANDE) pour lui remettre les éléments.

ET LA MACHINE EST EN MARCHE.

Problème, mais de taille : il n’y a rien d’illégal dans le dossier.

Madame FILLON a été collaboratrice parlementaire de son mari, mais c’est tout à fait légal. De plus, les revenus ont été déclarés aux Impôts.

Mais il suffit de jeter en pâture à la presse des informations pour salir et que le bon peuple s’en délecte.

Madame Eliane HOULETTE, Procureure du Parquet National Financier s’est saisie très rapidement (comme par hasard) du « dossier ».

Madame HOULETTE, (sympathisante Socialiste avérée) a été nommée par François HOLLANDE lui-même sur les recommandations de Christiane TAUBIRA.

Le Parquet National Financier étant maître de son agenda, nul doute que le « dossier » va trainer longtemps.

François FILLON, par les mains d’un Avocat, Maître Antonin LEVY, a remis au PNF toutes les preuves de la véracité du travail de Madame FILLON.

JamieXeed74 · 05/02/2017 18:40

Was it the one where we're going to make a success of it, and we all get 14 weeks holiday a year?

You mean the white paper that TM didn't think was needed as she had already explained the plan. But she heroically slapped one together in the middle of the night to get it released asap to appease all the MPs who just wanted to make trouble? So there was a human error, big whoop that has never happened before.

If you want 52 weeks holiday go to Greece and join the massive unemployment queues that are a result of being in the EU.

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