Westministenders: Boris and his friends hand in their homework to be marked.

[RedToothBrush]

The last week has been depressing for a lot of people.

Even if you are happy about the vote in the Commons, there is a worrying lack of backbone in MPs of all shades.

Then there’s what is going on in the USA which I’m going to quietly ignore in this post except to say that cosying up to Trump still could backfire on all who do for numerous reasons.

It seems like its all over in someways, but there is still plenty going on.

The A50 Bill has only passed stage one. The Government’s deliberate publishing of the White Paper after the vote has left a lot of people with egg all over their face.

Plus its just crap. Actually its not crap. It’s a dog dinner of farcical proportions with no content, faulty data and incorrect details that an A-Level Student did the night before their assignment was due, masquerading as an official government document.

Now its amendment time, which is the serious bit. For an amendment to make it, it will need cross party support. After the government failed to produce a White Paper worth the paper it was written on, and insulted the intelligence of the House of Commons, that could get interesting.

For starters the White Paper says that EU citizens are one of our best bargaining chips. Trouble is a lot of Tory and Labour MPs don’t agree.

In short there is a fair old chance of a government defeat next week at some point. The government don’t want any. Especially not this early. I really think it will be very difficult for the government to provide the assurance MPs will want, even if they crack the whip. They have lost the trust of too many. In voting for the first vote, many MPs will feel they have shown their intent to support leaving and now will get busy on trying to hammer down the details.

Highlights include of the White Paper include the idea that we will still be subject to the ECJ except we won’t. This is ridiculous. We will be subject to ECJ rulings but not be subject to ECJ rulings directly. Eh? What? (Not that we didn’t see this coming). There’s Euroatom and the government doing an impression of Homer Simpson. With a by-election in Copeland on the cards. That story has some time to keep running. As Steve Peers points out, the Leprechauns are going to sort out Northern Ireland for us which is a great political strategy to employ.

Its full of lots of other utter bollocks but those particular points are the ones that are potentially the most problematic for the government. If you don’t think the White Paper screams we are going to get eaten alive by the EU and Trump, you need to get off the hallucinogenics pronto.

If that isn’t awe inspiring enough we also have:

The wonderful mental image of Paul Nuttall kipping on a mattress in a house in Stoke disparately pretending to be a Stokie, nervously hoping that letterbox rattling in the wind isn’t C4 letterbox again and that the coppers don’t pay him a visit in the near future. I confess that whilst my imagination has been kept busy with this, I am disappointed in the lack of video clips of him munching on an Oatcake in a Stoke City shirt, sitting on an Armitage Shanks throne, turning his plate over whilst listening to Robbie Williams and with a Titanic by his side. All at the same time. I think he’s missed a few tricks.

AND

Diane Abbott doing quite possibly even more damage to Labour than them merely rolling over and dying over a50 by pulling a sickie. Her ‘Brexit Flu’ damages the party’s image and Corbyn himself even more. If that’s even possible. Some Labour MPs have demanded an apology.

Labour is starting to look like it’s a ship with rats fleeing this week. MPs have defied a three line whip and quite the Shadow Cabinet (Again). Rumours are that over 7000 members have left. A councillor has defected to the Lib Dems. There was a council by election in Rotherham where Lab lost a seat to the LDs in an area where there has never been as many people vote LD. Nor were there as many remain voters as LD voters. The Parliamentary vote for Unite’s new leader has unsurprisingly selected the anti-Corbyn candidate Gerald Coyne over Len McCluskey. The bookies have dropped the odds on Corbyn leaving Labour before a GE from 6/1 to 2/1 overnight. Oh and Red Ed is being rumoured to be returning to the front bench…

[Kaija]

Could you outline the change you believe will come about as a result of Brexit that will benefit the people of this country?

[Peregrina]

better to embrace change yourself than have it forced upon you by those you most oppose.

But we are not embracing change. If we had seen a White Paper produced after a couple of years deliberation, based on a realistic estimate of what a non-EU future would look like, then I might begin to agree. As it stands all we have had is "let's smash the current system", and we will cross our fingers that something will come out of it.

[Kaija]

Yes, quite, Peregrina. While those on the right like Patick Minford may happily own that Brexit will mostly eliminate manufacturing in the UK, and JRM et al look forward to a brave new world of freedom from employment rights, there is a deafening silence from Liberal Leavers on the subject of any tangible benefits that might be expected by ordinary people.

[Kaija]

In the circumstances, "stunning naivety" is generous.

[woman12345]

"Brexit is an opportunity to reverse the tragic decline of marriage in Britain"
Sweepstake two, who'll bet on divorce law being changed to favour men even more in US and here within next 3 years?
And sad thing is Headfull there are so many contenders for the "who said that to Bercow" quiz, but you could well be right

[RedToothBrush]

Math, I think that terrorists can be 'freedom fighters'. I think terrorism can be 'state sponsored'. The fact that there is a reason behind what violence they commit does not take away from that violence. As I say I struggle with the word, though I think we should not be afraid of using the word and too often do not use the word when we should. That's why I say the word is often political and weaponised in its use and omission.

What the British government has done in NI (and prior to that Ireland as a whole) is appalling. I can well understand why Irish Nationalists took the route they did especially after Bloody Sunday. It is dreadful that it has not all been investigated and there is still an ongoing cover up which I think is utterly shameful. British people who have tried to undercover it have been stitched up by the establishment. I have huge sympathy for the whys and wherefores.

However it still does not necessarily excuse it. The IRA targeted shopping centres and children ultimately and left many living in fear as a result of their actions. Terrorism is modern day guerrilla warfare however you cut it and whatever the beliefs and justification and legitimacy behind it.

With regard to the Irish question there are times when I do wonder what else could have been done in the face of British oppression. I do not have an answer to that question. I have spent too many years of my life pondering it and am no closer to resolving it and reconciling it in my head. Neither side is 'in the right'. It is civilians and innocents who suffer for it. As in war.

Perhaps it is a controversial opinion, but I see a problem with only giving the label to one group: it labels the whole group as well as those within it who are wholly innocent and not the action.

You can not just fight it with weapons as there isn't a front line. It lives amongst you. That's a great deal of the point.

I think we need a realisation that terrorism is the very action of acting against a larger power or force. The role of the state or establishment goes hand in hand with acts of terrorism. Asking how innocent or passive that establishment has been is part of dealing with that terrorism in the long run. Ask why individuals involves are 'outside society'.

There are no easy answers. But I don't think you can make a distinction between what is and what isn't a terrorist, apart from to say it is anyone who carries acts out in this fashion. I think you have to have an inclusive approach to the word to neutralise its power politically in some respects. Terrorism is war. Just a different kind of war.

The war of front lines in the traditional sense is no longer as relevant as it was. Our language has not adequately changed and adapted to reflect this and our society has not yet become intelligent enough to understand how we contribute to social disaffection and alienation and aid radicalisation and how individual can exploit this feeling and weaponise the vulnerable.

[RedToothBrush]

Faisal Islam ‏@faisalislam
On Bercow: cd only find 1 MP willing to go on record to criticise Speaker - Duddridge. Others unhappy, don't want to be seen to defend POTUS

Which is interesting in itself...

[RedToothBrush]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2848378-Westministenders-Boris-is-reminded-of-the-Munich-Post?watched=1

New thread.

[CeciledeVolanges]

Obviously there are more nuances than this, but with Brexit I would say: wrong problem, wrong scapegoat, wrong time, wrong solution, distracts from actual problems.

[RedToothBrush]

Ciaran Jenkins ‏@C4Ciaran
Populism is "a totalitarian sleight of hand.. used to justify coercion in the name of temporary or spurious majorities." -William Riker

[CeciledeVolanges]

And Antonia Fraser wrote a very interesting book about Marie Antoinette which I would recommend. She is also very good on the six wives of Henry VIII. Of course when it comes to Nero the only way is Suetonius

[Kaija]

"wrong problem, wrong scapegoat, wrong time, wrong solution, distracts from actual problems."

Yes.

[CeciledeVolanges]

Thanks Kaija :)

[woman12345]

‏@faisalislam
On Bercow: cd only find 1 MP willing to go on record to criticise Speaker - Duddridge. Others unhappy, don't want to be seen to defend POTUS

Which is interesting in itself...
Yep

[woman12345]

www.mmu.ac.uk/equality-and-diversity/doc/gender-equality-timeline.pdf

Timeline of how far we've come, and we're still going.