Westministenders: Boris and his friends hand in their homework to be marked.

[RedToothBrush]

The last week has been depressing for a lot of people.

Even if you are happy about the vote in the Commons, there is a worrying lack of backbone in MPs of all shades.

Then there’s what is going on in the USA which I’m going to quietly ignore in this post except to say that cosying up to Trump still could backfire on all who do for numerous reasons.

It seems like its all over in someways, but there is still plenty going on.

The A50 Bill has only passed stage one. The Government’s deliberate publishing of the White Paper after the vote has left a lot of people with egg all over their face.

Plus its just crap. Actually its not crap. It’s a dog dinner of farcical proportions with no content, faulty data and incorrect details that an A-Level Student did the night before their assignment was due, masquerading as an official government document.

Now its amendment time, which is the serious bit. For an amendment to make it, it will need cross party support. After the government failed to produce a White Paper worth the paper it was written on, and insulted the intelligence of the House of Commons, that could get interesting.

For starters the White Paper says that EU citizens are one of our best bargaining chips. Trouble is a lot of Tory and Labour MPs don’t agree.

In short there is a fair old chance of a government defeat next week at some point. The government don’t want any. Especially not this early. I really think it will be very difficult for the government to provide the assurance MPs will want, even if they crack the whip. They have lost the trust of too many. In voting for the first vote, many MPs will feel they have shown their intent to support leaving and now will get busy on trying to hammer down the details.

Highlights include of the White Paper include the idea that we will still be subject to the ECJ except we won’t. This is ridiculous. We will be subject to ECJ rulings but not be subject to ECJ rulings directly. Eh? What? (Not that we didn’t see this coming). There’s Euroatom and the government doing an impression of Homer Simpson. With a by-election in Copeland on the cards. That story has some time to keep running. As Steve Peers points out, the Leprechauns are going to sort out Northern Ireland for us which is a great political strategy to employ.

Its full of lots of other utter bollocks but those particular points are the ones that are potentially the most problematic for the government. If you don’t think the White Paper screams we are going to get eaten alive by the EU and Trump, you need to get off the hallucinogenics pronto.

If that isn’t awe inspiring enough we also have:

The wonderful mental image of Paul Nuttall kipping on a mattress in a house in Stoke disparately pretending to be a Stokie, nervously hoping that letterbox rattling in the wind isn’t C4 letterbox again and that the coppers don’t pay him a visit in the near future. I confess that whilst my imagination has been kept busy with this, I am disappointed in the lack of video clips of him munching on an Oatcake in a Stoke City shirt, sitting on an Armitage Shanks throne, turning his plate over whilst listening to Robbie Williams and with a Titanic by his side. All at the same time. I think he’s missed a few tricks.

AND

Diane Abbott doing quite possibly even more damage to Labour than them merely rolling over and dying over a50 by pulling a sickie. Her ‘Brexit Flu’ damages the party’s image and Corbyn himself even more. If that’s even possible. Some Labour MPs have demanded an apology.

Labour is starting to look like it’s a ship with rats fleeing this week. MPs have defied a three line whip and quite the Shadow Cabinet (Again). Rumours are that over 7000 members have left. A councillor has defected to the Lib Dems. There was a council by election in Rotherham where Lab lost a seat to the LDs in an area where there has never been as many people vote LD. Nor were there as many remain voters as LD voters. The Parliamentary vote for Unite’s new leader has unsurprisingly selected the anti-Corbyn candidate Gerald Coyne over Len McCluskey. The bookies have dropped the odds on Corbyn leaving Labour before a GE from 6/1 to 2/1 overnight. Oh and Red Ed is being rumoured to be returning to the front bench…

It is an interesting issue though. That the new world order makes for strange bedfellows. As Big choc highlighted last night and as Isobel Hilton says in her article that I linked to Xi, the Chinese leader is a right wing leader who is responsible for increased repression domestically. He has confounded the hopes that as the dinosaurs died off the rise of new leaders educated in the west, combined with an increasing middle class, was seeing greater freedom, not increased repression. Nobody can accuse me of not taking that seriously, I have stood under a yellow umbrella. However when it comes to the balance of world power now and Trump's agenda suddenly Xi is the hope that there will be a sensible grown up looking to protect world stability.

I don't know - why do you expect a group of Mumsnet posters to have done anything concrete about it before now? Why does it have anything to do with whether or not we should leave? I'm really confused about your argument. Sorry.

The trouble with Debbie's fascism post is that it was cut and pasted from the Mail without attribution, so it looks as though it's her opinion. There is a simple lesson to learn there.

As for NATO - I have absolutely no faith in May securing Trump's backing for it. His word his not his bond. It will entirely depend on how he behaves.

No one - inc politicians - are scared of airing their racist xenophobic or fascist views since brexit
Osborne is just one of many

The EU have been very concerned about orban for some time
But, frankly, with rise of DT they now have bigger worries

However Debbie won't be riled by that issue in the Daily Mail who like the Telegraph don't seem to have noticed China is the world's second largest economy and regard China as a source of "they eat dog penis" articles.

Talking more about one thing doesn't mean you don't care about or are ignoring another though. If I donate money to a Parkinson's disease charity it doesn't mean that I don't also want there to be a cure for cancer.

cecile why the defensiveness. Why the lack of criticism for the remarks Hollande and Merkels friends in the EU have said?

"The Prime Minister of neighbouring Slovakia, Robert Fico, said last year that Islam had ‘no place’ in his country. He speaks of the need to ‘monitor every Muslim’ and won’t let a single Muslim refugee enter his country"

"With other chilling views — such as describing journalists as ‘dirty, anti-Slovak prostitutes’ — he almost makes Trump sound like an Islington Leftie"

^^ I know some of you are upset by Trump and others treatment of the press. These are your fellow EU buddies....surely you should be thanking me for drawing these views to your attentions?

Because either you didn't realise and didn't know, hence the silence or you did know and ignored it.

whatronalddo

well, it doesnt matter which paper has been the conduit - those are the views and words of those leaders.

Are you going to dismiss them then, because the conduit was the Daily Mail?

Ummm interesting...

Nazi loving daily mail?
Guck yes I'm going to dismiss it!!

wrong I'm honestly not trying to be goady here but isn't it a bit late to be looking for answers those questions now?

Bear To clarify, I believe I know what the situation is (i.e. individual states are responsible for their own immigration agreements and agreements about existing migrant nationals). But others have said this is not the case so I want to find some evidence that my understanding is correct, otherwise,we are just going to go round in circles.

However, even if I am wrong, and it is an EU wide responsibility, that would not have changed my vote. It seems a bit odd to be criticising me for my lack of a definitive knowledge on this when there seems to be general confusion amongst a lot of posters (leave and remain).

badders

did you know orban was so right wing then - or didnt you realise, doesnt this worry you ?

Please answer me about your personal actions to address this problem and how long it has been bothering you before you attack me for the same problem.

I object to being told that they are "my EU buddies", that seems like a pretty baseless, ad hominem attack.

As it happens, I have been concerned about aspects of the regimes in certain EU countries, in my case especially in relation to their attitude to LGBT people because I have done pro bono work on extradition trials from the USA where people were being extradited to countries where they faced a risk of contribution, and I contributed to a survey on the "anti propaganda laws" in those countries. This was before the referendum. I am deeply concerned by the rise of far right parties in those countries and have voted in my MEP elections among other things in reflection of my political views. I still don't think we should strengthen ties to leaders like Trump.

The trouble with Debbie's fascism post is that it was cut and pasted from the Mail without attribution, so it looks as though it's her opinion. There is a simple lesson to learn there.

Thanks Peregrina. So it's not even concern-trolling; it's just copy-pasting. What is it with Trump/Brexit supporters and plagiarism!?

The ^ symbol is useful when quoting, or even the pre-Internet method of using quotation marks. Providing links is good manners, although not doing so is excusable when it's the Mail ;)

And thank you for drawing those views to my attention, very kind of you.

www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/26/hungarian-prime-minister-viktor-orban-praises-donald-trump

Hungary does not need a single migrant for the economy to work, or the population to sustain itself, or for the country to have a future,” he told a joint press conference in Budapest with Austrian chancellor Christian Kern.

“This is why there is no need for a common European migration policy: whoever needs migrants can take them, but don’t force them on us, we don’t need them,” Orban said.

For us migration is not a solution but a problem ... not medicine but a poison, we don’t need it and won’t swallow it,” he said.

Orban is a fierce opponent of the European Union’s troubled plan to share migrants across the 28-nation bloc under a mandatory quota system.

Hungary has filed a legal challenge against the proposal and will hold a referendum on its participation in the scheme on October 2.

Yes I realised
Yes it worries me
But Donald trump worries me MORE

What is it with Trump/Brexit supporters and plagiarism!?

The ^ symbol is useful when quoting, or even the pre-Internet method of using quotation marks.

Quotation marks were used throughout the post.

HTH.

Thanks for posting that, Debbie. It seems like Hungary is much closer to the UK's position than we though. The only difference is that they are challenging the EU's policies internally rather than opting out of the entire thing.

When Teresa the appeaser met DT in Washington the same quote kept running through my mind;
"My enemy's enemy is my friend"
What a poisoned chalice we are all quaffing from.

Debbie The issue has been covered in all the papers, I do not dismiss the issue. I dismiss the way that the Daily Mail has covered it. You have been worked up into a frenzy not by the issue but by the fact that you have been led to percieve that liberals don't care about it. They do.

"A question though for EU citizens living here now: do you feel that what Theresa May has offered is a guarantee of your right to live and work here?
Would you be confident to make future plans based on her 'guarantees'?"

OF COURSE NOT. Sorry for shouting but, just that.

Thanks Ron, you summed that up much better than I could!

mistri actually i always provide a link it was a simple over sight

But don't shoot the messenger if its news you dont like

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/slovakia-bars-islam-state-religion-tightening-church-laws-robert-fico-a7449646.html

""Islamisation starts with a kebab and it's already under way in Bratislava, let's realise what we will face in five to 10 years," SNS chairman Andrej Danko told Reuters after the legislation was passed.

“We must do everything we can so that no mosque is built in the future.”

By the way, I'm just reading through the conservative manifesto (as you do, there is a reason) and they promise to "strengthen devolution" and "put the safety and security of the people of Northern Ireland as our highest priority".