The Brexit Arms. A friendly place for anyone wanting to chat about Brexit.

[surferjet]

Pull up a chair and relax.....

Kaija

you do realise from that article you linked that the EU does trade with Turkey. Why on earth are we - Uk not supposed to trade with it - when the EU already does? I dont understand your point there.

"Don’t forget, it’s not that long since Turkey was championed as a democratic beacon in the Middle East. In just a few years, hyperbole, deliberately fanned fear and paranoia have fuelled the country’s descent into Islamism and the sort of Big Brother state its people had hoped it had left behind in the dark days that followed the 1980 coup"

How many countries have seen this backward slide? Anyone seen pictures of Kabul in the 60's? Women walking along - in western style clothes - looking free and happy. And Terhan?

Lady according to the mass hysteria - Trump is far worse than any of those leaders

I think perhaps people are being led by the media whipping them into a frenzy, as the other major major human rights abusers don't matter one jot.

Bit lively in here today chamomile

Just popped in to say next time someone blames inflation on Brexit and the £ I may well feel compelled to point out the US and Eurozone (out today) inflation figures are higher.

I agree that it is tricky to speak out against male domination or violence against women when there is a race element to it because Black and ethnic minority groups are sadly easily and habitually marginalised and discriminated against

Its a far wider subject than that. There is discrimination its not so simple as to put failures to help women within some communities down to that.
For instance a woman may go to the police then the police talk to the community elder who is in league with or responsible for those abusing her. We need more officers who understand how some communities work.
Many women are in arranged marriages and brought over from eg Pakistan, they cannot speak the English language but they have no idea of the laws of this land, and their rights. They are taken instead to so called Sharia councils and subjugated by their laws instead.
How are such women ever to be able to speak or reach out?
There have been very interesting and comprehensive reports on problems with integration and its very much a two way street.

The point is more that Trump has only been in power just over a week and done some hugely controversial (putting it midly) things. Even if he hadn't, it would be slightly unusual to invite him for a state visit at this early stage, so May's craven invitation is both needless and wrong-headed.

Have to say, I do not give a tiny shit whether the Queen finds it all a bit awks, though! I care that we are very visibly and actively endorsing Trump's muslim ban.

'Mass hysteria' is silly - I think perhaps there's a mass slightly surreal phlegmatic refusal to acknowledge just how worrying this all is! Frankly if you're not a bit frightened and very disgusted, you're an absolute fool.

"What happened in Rotherham was abhorrent. But..." Dear god, there is no but. It was abhorrent and no one protested. It was a struggle to find a thread discussing it on here at one point. Avoiding difficult subjects or making them off limits is not the answer as we can see. It ends up with folk voting Brexit and Trump.

What happened in Rotherham was abhorrent. I don't buy in for a moment that the police were 'scared of looking racist' - the failing here was the failure to take the concerns and safety of young working class girls seriously. What sort of police officer is more 'scared of looking racist' than of young girls being raped?

The safety of girls and women is what the women's march was about. Or would it only count if there were placards saying 'we protest the rape of white girls by Muslims'?

No I don't believe people voted Brexit because of Rotherham. Does anyone really think that? The perpetrators are all Pakistani not from a EU country.

Farage, Arron Banks and his buddies have no interest in protecting vulnerable girls. They pursue an ALT Right fascist and elitist agenda. Not liberal educated elite but well off white man's elite. Support them if you like that sort of thing, fine but don't fool yourselves that they are knights in shining armour.

"The safety of girls and women is what the women's march was about. Or would it only count if there were placards saying 'we protest the rape of white girls by Muslims'?" Exactly Seek

Also, be wary of thinking 'trade deals with the US' are some kind of magic bullet.

True, we have put ourselves in the ridiculous position of having to scrabble around the globe looking for someone to trade with, having decided to turn our backs on what we had in the EU.

But US requirements for many things are much more stringent than EU's - their health and safety standards are actually higher, so we are going to have to think very carefully about what we can possibly sell - and if we can afford to adapt goods to meet those trading requirements - as well as what we might possibly want to buy.

Really interesting Dr Lucy programme on bbc4 the other night re interpreting historical "fact".

Simon Burns MP quoting "wise" JFK in defence of the moral outrage at the "specialness" of our US relationship. (those who ride the tiger ...)
When I think of JFK I think of him narrowly averting causing WW3 and the quagmire of Vietnam and that is before I get anywhere near his misogyny.

Sometimes wonder where I missed the group think vaccination.

howabout I have just been reading about Howard Hughes, extraordinary book. Up to his neck in bribing presidents etc, buying people off.

JFK Oh yes - prolific womaniser.

I don't buy in for a moment that the police were 'scared of looking racist' - the failing here was the failure to take the concerns and safety of young working class girls seriously

Oh well then your failing to take into account a myriad of reasons why this was the case all reprted

im thinking of opening a pop-up on the other thread, selling smelling salts...i can see much demand but have to take into account how much in denial the sufferers are

I love it when people mention cologne, it's so utterly irrelevant. Like no-one has ever been to an event where white westerners harassed women. Have a look on the BBC website- they have an article about women being sexually assaulted at gigs. This has been going on for years, but no one gives a shit. It's only an issue when the offender has a different skin colour

I don't protest events such as these because there's so many instances of women being abused by men, where would you start?
Instead, I donate to women's charities so that women who need help and support can access it. Is that ok with all of you? Do I pass the test

good idea bored and a stack of pearls to clutch.

Were these people up in arms when Merkel went crawling and slithering to Turkey last year over the Migration crisis? Where was the talk of morals then? Where is the talk of morals when the EU does deals with Turkey?

Bolshy can you link please to events on the scale of cologne, the last one I was aware of was actually In Egypt in the main square during protests.....

That is about 1,200 women and 2,000 men.

"During the 2015/2016 New Year's Eve celebrations, there were reports of mass sexual assaults, at least 24 rapes, and numerous thefts in Germany, mainly in Cologne city centre. There were similar incidents at the public celebrations in Hamburg, Frankfurt, Dortmund, Düsseldorf, Stuttgart[25] and Bielefeld.[10][26][27] For all of Germany, police report that 1,200 women were sexually assaulted and estimate that at least 2,000 men were involved, acting in groups.[28]

where white westerners harassed women

Missed this disgraceful minimizing statement - harassed

It's so much safer to refuse to give a shit about anything, isn't it? Because if you think your prime minister fawning all over a racist psychopath is bad, then that's not really valid unless you've marched about literally everything that has ever been bad, anywhere in the world.

Best just to close your mind and your heart.

Agree with debbies last post

And seeks last post

I honestly dont understand people who think that way

meanwhile, back in uhe uk I bring you good, timely news:

www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/01/31/city-finally-sees-light-brexit/

Avoiding difficult subjects or making them off limits is not the answer as we can see. It ends up with folk voting Brexit and Trump.

YY.

Trump is the public face of what America wanted.
Democratically elected.

I voted Brexit for many reasons, mostly because I didn't want ever closer political/economic/military union etc.

However, I also am opposed to the complete freedom of movement with no 'emergency brake' or ability to exercise any control on numbers etc.

By making the subject of immigration completely off limits, people had no option in that respect other than to vote Brexit (although I would have personally voted Leave anyway, I don't actually think Leave would have won if the immigration point had been addressed).

Farage, Arron Banks and his buddies have no interest in protecting vulnerable girls. They pursue an ALT Right fascist and elitist agenda. Not liberal educated elite but well off white man's elite. Support them if you like that sort of thing, fine but don't fool yourselves that they are knights in shining armour.

#confused

Must have missed the posters who expressed unfettered admiration for Farage & Banks, and equated them to knights in shining armour.

Sometimes wonder where I missed the group think vaccination

Me too howabout.

For anyone beyond their Torygraph limit the original press release

www.thecityuk.com/news/thecityuk-hails-opportunity-for-trade-and-investment-policy-reset/

BBC business also reporting buoyant regional construction outlook fuelled in part by confident FDI.