Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

'The Brexit Arms' is now open. Friendly cosy pub with log fire for leavers & remainers to chat & ponder life, the universe, & Brexit.

1000 replies

surferjet · 30/10/2016 16:43

You are all most welcome Wine

OP posts:
Thread gallery
16
StorminaBcup · 02/11/2016 15:27

Roman you will have core traits that stay stable so it's not completely useless but I think the issue with tests like these is how they are applied on a wider scale.

InformalRoman · 02/11/2016 15:46

Storm I think I did mine after a couple of glasses of wine, so that it was more of a initial response to the questions rather than thinking too much about them. Friend that did the assessment did it as a favour as we were curious to see if it revealed anything new / interesting, not sure it did really (I was an engineer at the time, so not surprising that I'd be ordered and logical and thorough, probably best to be that way if you wanted to make sure your bridges stayed up etc).

ManonLescaut · 02/11/2016 15:47

I'm not sure Myers Briggs tests were ever taken seriously. I remember doing them at work for a laugh years ago. I was ENTP fwiw.

MangoMoon · 02/11/2016 15:57

I know it's not a definitive thing has been discredited etc, I just meant as a basic blunt instrument.

Better would be your self perception maybe?

In an extremely unscientific way I think it would be interesting to see how we all compare is all.

InformalRoman · 02/11/2016 16:00

ManonLescaut friend was working for a US company at the time - I think a lot of US organisations took it / still take it quite seriously (McKinsey for instance).

ManonLescaut · 02/11/2016 16:09

I was working at a US company at the time, but we didn't do it officially, we were just messing about. I can't even recall what my type was supposed to be - unconventional? something like that - I just remember the letters.

InformalRoman · 02/11/2016 16:26

ENTP: Quick, ingenious, stimulating, alert, and outspoken. Resourceful in solving new and challenging problems. Adept at generating conceptual possibilities and then analyzing them strategically. Good at reading other people. Bored by routine, will seldom do the same thing the same way, apt to turn to one new interest after another.

IamWendy · 02/11/2016 16:37

Interesting idea about personality differences. I was on the sharing food thread, and someone said that what separates us from animals and remain voters;) is delayed gratification. Every time a remainer mentions the pound dropping, or Marmite going up, out another immediate effect we are experiencing I just feel like they must be the people who dont care about tomorrow as long as today is good as possible. Cramming sweets down their necks without thinking about what to eat tomorrow. Short-termism.
So maybe leave voters are the ones who like to hold back some sweets for tomorrow.

scaryteacher · 02/11/2016 16:41

Gloria Oh really? At this point you lose the right to be taken seriously. Do you live in Belgium? Do you keep up with the local news, and see that the community in Molenbeek didn't want to engage post Bataclan, with the closing of Brussels last Christmas, Zaventem and the metro bombings?

There are some bloody dangerous people wandering unchecked around Europe, and whilst you may want to stick your head in the sand and make like an ostrich, some of us don't. I know people who were killed in the metro attack and maimed for life in the Zaventem bombing, so I do have the right to be taken seriously.

There is a long standing and well known problem with Islamic extremism in Belgium www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/11/belgium-radical-islam-jihad-molenbeek-isis/416235/ para 4 in particular refers. You might not like the facts that Belgium has a well known radicalisation problem; you may not like me pointing out that it has six governments and three official languages, but reporting my posts doesn't change the facts.

RedToothBrush · 02/11/2016 16:42

I think you are over generalising just a touch there IamWendy.

InformalRoman · 02/11/2016 16:47

IamWendy Not everybody falls for the promise of jam to-morrow.

scaryteacher · 02/11/2016 16:48

Gloria Because Londonistan isn't Islamophobic in itself. No? It's not called London Aviv is it? Think about it.

If it is acceptable to be anti semitic, and it seems to be amongst certain parts of society, notably the Labour party and certain Lib Dem peers, then why can't one be anti Islam? Radical Islam opposes all that European civilisation stands for, and you are happy with that - we just smile and say 'crack on' because it is not PC to do otherwise? I think you need to get real.

IamWendy · 02/11/2016 16:50

But there'll never be jam tomorrow if we gorge on the strawberry crop today.

ManonLescaut · 02/11/2016 17:00

Sounds great Informal - could be anyone though.

scaryteacher · 02/11/2016 17:08

Iam, There'll be apricot and cherry jam though!

ManonLescaut · 02/11/2016 17:15

I can't speak for Gloria, and by the sounds of it you're optimistic thinking she'll respond to you scaryteacher, but I live in Paris & was here at the time of the recent bombings. I lived in London at the time of the 7/7 bombings, and all through the IRA bombing campaign in the 80s.

There are dangerous people everywhere, and stigmatising whole communities for the actions of the few is as unintelligent as it counter-productive.

Belgium is not the only country to have a problem with Islamic extremism. But it is perfectly possible to be concerned with Islamic extremism without being Islamophobic. Many, many Muslims across the world are as concerned as everyone else, for example.

Would you think it acceptable to demonise the Irish on the basis of the actions of the Republican and Loyalist paramilitaries?

Do you even know the difference between Islam and Islamism? (I suggest you have a quick google.)

Anti-Semitism is no more acceptable than Islamophobia, and your weak justification of it shows the dangers of the legitimisation of racism by politicians & media. It is a problem that Labour will have to root out as it shames them and affects their electoral prospects.

InformalRoman · 02/11/2016 17:26

But there'll never be jam tomorrow if we gorge on the strawberry crop today.

It can only be jam yesterday and jam to-morrow. It will never be jam today.

RedToothBrush · 02/11/2016 17:33

Belgium does have a long history with connections to terrorism. It predates 9/11. Algerian terrorism in France was often connected with the illegal gun trade in Belgium because it had more relaxed laws than other European neighbours until recently. The networks for modern terrorism are closely related and established.

This is something of a point though. Its not new. Its not suddenly come from nowhere and escalated to a point which is totally unprecedented in levels.

Its just getting a lot more coverage due to other geopolitical reasons and because tactics have evolved in a particularly nasty way.

I don't think the threat is therefore substantially increased. (The number of deaths from terrorism In Europe isn't leaping up, despite what you might think). It is higher this year than it has been in the last few but there were comparible peaks in 2004 (due to the Madrid train bombings) and in 1980. There were several years in the 1970s which were worse too.
Article about the number of terrorists deaths in Europe. Nor do I think there is a cover up to somehow hide terrorism and stop widespread panic (There is more sensitivity to anything that involves violence and social media also plays its part in this).

I do think that Belgium is weak in tackling terrorism and always has been - in part because its law enforcement is federalised and there is difficulty within the police to share information because of a turf war on language. If memory serves me correctly there has been in the past a situation where British intelligence has been more effective in picking up on terrorists in Belgium for various reasons - not least this federal one. The British have been hesitant to share all their information for security reasons, but as the threat is changing there is actually an increasing reason to be involved more actively in European policing.

Strangely enough, May seems to agree with me on this one, and the UK has committed itself to this today (the first big UK-EU decision post Brexit) and there will be more cross border security measures.

I do think the tone of some of the comments on the subject on this thread are completely off, and lack the historical context (which is pretty important in stopping this panic about there being a wave of Islamic militants appearing suddenly from nowhere as the refugee crises has enfolded).

There is a problem, but sensationalist fearmongering (yep there is a large part of the Leave narrative that is doom mongering going too) isn't helping tackle the problem either. A lot of the right of the Leave camp think we should not cooperate with Europe on this, which is bonkers.

I do not think putting up borders or even more marginalisation of Muslims is really going to stop the issues either here nor in Belgium. I don't think this is being 'soft' either, but recognising the weaknesses of government and helping to support that as well as looking at problems with integration.

I think the whole 'radical islam' thing is part of the problem really as it focuses on the problem being a) a failing only of islam b) puts the emphasis on the whole religion c) puts the responsibility only on the shoulders of Muslims.

I do think that terrorism always requires a look in the mirror as part of the process of dealing with it as if its happening there is always something that its a reaction to in terms of social inequality and injustice.

For this reason, it always requires very measured responses rather than headline that scream 'JIHADI HAVE TAKEN OVER BELGUIM' or the like every five minutes. Which is what we are in the firm grips of. The threat is being over stated to scare and control people rather than to tackle the issue effectively. Its whipped people up into a hysteria.

Sensible debate on the subject is next to impossible on MN if I'm honest, and I do think its in no small part down to the media, so I try to keep out of it as a general rule.

I don't mind talking about. I think people should do. But only in a constructive way and that's really the problem that we have a culture that makes that difficult to do.

time4chocolate · 02/11/2016 18:19

EU ideology = "peace, prosperity and an ever closer union"

Reality = Social unrest, huge economic problems inc high unemployment (Spain & Greece at around 20/25%) and a rise in popularity of parties such as Front National and the Neo-Nazi movement.

The open door policy has been pushed to its limit within mainland Europe without any thought given to infrastructure for either the refugees/immigrants or the countries that receive them and that particular disaster is unfolding before our eyes daily. The French government have no idea how to deal with it so are just going to move the issue to different locations, causing unrest in local communities. All that will be achieved by that is a few more votes for Marinne LePenn. It's like a social experiment gone horribly wrong.

From what I see and read it's not looking peaceful, prosperous or ever closer in 2016. How do we think it will be in another 10/15 years?

Ironically the two main goals of the EU, "ever closer union" and "prosperity" will be the two things that I believe will be its undoing.

There is no fix, that I can see, it is in crises and the reason it can't be fixed is because the originators of this ideology are the cause of the current problems.

If you voted for the status quo fair enough, however, you only have look at what's gone on in the last 2/3 years to realise we are going to be far from the current status quo in 10 years time (and in my opinion not for the better).

WinchesterWoman · 02/11/2016 19:17

Hello lovely bar stewards

WinchesterWoman · 02/11/2016 19:22

I don't see s problem with talking about Islamist extremism in Europe and violent Islamist extremism. I don't really like to say jihadist though.Jonas is not supposed to be about violence. I mean, I have used it and will again for convenience, but it's like giving extremist Islamist violence a sheen of respectability.

Marmitelover55 · 02/11/2016 20:13

Time to get your coats Wrexiteers - shares in Weatherspoons are down 6.3% today at the news of a slow down in sales post the referendum result Grin.

Haven't read today's posts on this thread so sorry if I'm repeating old news.

time4chocolate · 02/11/2016 20:22

Marmite - I think I can live with that.

WinchesterWoman · 02/11/2016 20:22

Actually grooming there because people could lose jobs
Idiot

Petronius16 · 02/11/2016 20:30

Didn't a terrorist start WW1?

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.
Swipe left for the next trending thread