If this isn't what you voted for stand up and be counted!

[WidowWadman]

So all those Brexiteers and Lexiters who didn't vote on the basis of immigration controls, where are you? Will there be marches against May's interpretation of your vote?

You know, I actually believe that plenty of people didn't realise what their vote was going to unleash despite being warned frequently and emphatically. It's not too late to speak out and stand up against it. If you didn't mean it, don't hide behind that you haven't meant it. Do something about it.

Pro-tip: declaring xenophobic things to be not xenophobic, actually is not speaking out against it or distancing yourself from it. Declaring hurt at being lumped in with the xenophobes without outright condemnation of their rhetoric doesn't count as standing up to it. Much the opposite.

smallfox are you Ed Miliband?

Small - I was referring to your three threads previously.

You may well be right on your last point but seeing as neither of us has a crystal ball we will have to wait and see.

"Where are the ones complaining about the suggested policies on immigration?

They were VERY vocal prior to the vote, in fact these boards were dominated by leave voters back then, where are they all now?

Where are the ones who said it wasn't about immigration?"

Dunno. I'd guess Arron Banks and others aren't bankrolling any post referendum campaigners to flood social media.

So refer on those threads not randomly on another one it doesn't make sense.

Sorry my mistake, meant last 3 posts.

What's wrong with those posts, WT comes here and challenges others opinions and reasons yet diens not to offer her own. So I find that odd.

Where are the ones complaining about the suggested policies on immigration? Bot sure I ever worked out which policies which side were moaning about. It al got very shouty!

They were VERY vocal prior to the vote, in fact these boards were dominated by leave voters back then, where are they all now? Really? My reading was, and still is, that the boards were/are dominated by Reamainers asking the same questions, but getting shoutier.

Where are the ones who said it wasn't about immigration? Like that! As I read many responses, it WAS about immigration, about controlling it not stopping it not about deporting but about knowing what the realities are and being able to make up our own minds/rules about how we would deal with it

As far as I can tell, here, fb, the DM etc etc, only racists and angry Remainers insist that Brexit means All Foreigners Out!

Your not allowed to name them but here was a huge number of posters here prior to the vote who were leave, they started he most threads, they ganged up on others and did lots of taunting without getting banned.

Many other posters stated that they weren't bothered abut immigration and that the big issue was democracy.

Let me just see if I have got this right:
Immediately after the referendum anyone on here who voted leave and dared to voice their reasons were told their reasons weren't valid enough, we were all racist/xenophobic (I was told I was the sort of person who would spit on a Muslim child), we are uneducated and a myriad of other delightful terms that are still continuing to this day. Now taking all the above on board Remainers want/need us to come together to bolster their voice regarding immigration - sorry it doesn't work like that. You can't have us on side just when is suits you.

Also ourblanche when the posters who were produced immigration controls were asked why they came out with the same old reasons, nhs, housing, jobs etc and blaming immigration for the issues with these points. Which aren't accurate.

OurBlanche if only racist (and angry Remainers) insist that it means tall foreigners out, why aren't most Leavers screaming at TM and her 'fantastic ideas about listing foreigners in companies/naming and shaming companies/listing children nationality AND place of birth etc...

I mean, I agree with you that few Leavers wanted that but I don't understand why we never heard about them.

time4 are you really saying that you will support TM actions on immigration even though you didn't agree with it and it's not what your vote was about, just because it would mean supporting and agreeing with the Remainers?

I certainly never said anything of those things to you.

I love how you are all victims. Have you looked at the abuse doled out by your own side?

I'm not saying I'm supporting TM actions on immigration i'm just giving you my thoughts on where I am right now.

Small - I'm not getting into a victim blaming debate with you, just telling you what I have personally experienced and how experiences shape people's views.

Scared because it is currently a proposal, not an actual fact and maybe because there is the possibility (one from the conspiracy theorists that made me stop and think a little bit) that TM et al are making this all so very distasteful deliberately, to fulfil their own agenda!

but I don't understand why we never heard about them. having read through most of the posts here I would have said that some tried, and were very quickly shouted down. Sometimes certain words work immediately - racist, fascist, nazi, all were used, some were deleted!

smallfox you repeat the same precis of opinions a lot. You never acknowledge that there were details, nuances. You are still very black/white and single minded, simplistic!

So leavers are saying that they refuse to engage because they have been shouted down by Remainers.
And Remainers are saying that they are stopped from voicing their worries told they are refusing to accept a democratic process etc by Leavers...

And then.... Are we going to wait until proposals are going to become realities to say something or will it then too late too? All because no one dares expressing an opinion?
And that goes for politicians too?

:(:(

My views are certainly not simplistic sorry. Tell me how so ?

Scared I think it is more that both sides seem to have become a bit entrenched in the "who go it worst" style argument. Both sides seem to feel equally hard done by/got at.

The current 'proposal' is, as far as I can see, one of those things 'leaked' to get a response. Coming at the same time as the school census with its new 'country of birth' question there was a lot of bandwagoning. So much so that it is pretty hard to tell what is hype, proposal and fact. I am not usually particularly into conspiracy theories, but I do find the overall tone and timing of Amber Rudd's 'proposal' odd. It was guaranteed to get equally kneejerk overstatements in response, like This reactionary call to restrict access to global talent goes against everything we are doing to build a global tech hub that rivals Silicon Valley. - there has been no such call...

Tell me how so ? I have, here and on other threads!

Ahhh lack of elaboration again..

Me? Oddly that is what I accuse you of when you I say your rebuttals and repetition are simplistic

We disagree! Get over it!

Well it migt just be a proposals but plenty of big companies have taken the time to say they didn't agree with it and that they would NOT be implementing it.
Companies took the time to say this wasn't right, leaked information or not. Proposals there to made people react or not.

So why aren't people reacting too??

MY rebuttals are simplistic, I asked you for elaboration and this was yours?

Come on I'm dying to know.

To the extent to which there is a nuanced post above of mine pointing out that the many of the factions of the brexit vote who all voted for different things, and who were promised their vested interests were at heart by the leave campaign will be bitterly disappointed by the outcome.

Yet you fail to acknowledge or even ask further, but you just attack me.

Scared I don't know why people don't stand up and shout about things that are not currently happening! Well, maybe on forums but not in real life

I am politically active, so I am doing some shouting, through an apolitical group and a couple of community charities. So I know what I am doing to have y say, have my voice heard...

On other threads I have suggested that MNers get politically active, instead of shouting here. But each time I have been told that it isn't that simple, takes too much time, won't make a difference, and a few other lackadaisical ripostes!