AIBU to wonder why approx 40% of Londoners voted for Brexit?

[fluffychicken]

Can any London Brexiters tell me why you voted for Brexit? I am really curious to know.

(Forgot to add West Indian to my list of nationalities on my street).

Citing the Indie in support of your attack on Brexiters is on a par with citing the Daily Mail for an attack on Remainers

Seriously?

The data quoted in the Independent was released directly by the National Police Chiefs Council.

The majority of offences were 'primarily harassment, common assault and other violence'.

Denial and minimisation of racism and racist attacks - is racist. As is the need to 'provoke' or 'challenge' people of a different race. As is labelling people 'foreign ethnics'.

Trying to deny Brexit-inspired racism while making racist comments is as ironic as it is revolting.

On the face of it Peregrina, what Bo Jo said and what John Redwood said seems disingenuous. However EU citizens and UK citizens should be able to live and work in each other's countries after Brexit. It's just that they may have to comply to more strict criteria to be able to do so. No one is saying stopping freedom of movement is stopping people coming or going at all. So they are not saying anything that is contradictory at all.

Mamon - There were 2 indie links. I think the comment refers to the second one not the first.

Well, who knows what BoJo thinks because he flip flops and plays the fool, but he implies a Business as Usual stance with regard to freedom of movement for EU citizens so gives the impression of wanting a Brexit Lite. Redwood clearly doesn't want that and wants a Hard Brexit, but is thin on the details.

BoJo is in Government and Redwood isn't, which May or May not be an indication of the way the land lies. Or be Mayhem.

I think you are reading too much into it TBH Peregrina. I don't think that indicates that BO JO wants Brexit Lite.

I don't think Johnson knows what he wants. And/or what is possible/acceptable to hard Leavers/acceptable to soft Leavers/acceptable to Norway/the City/the EU/the WTO/Northern Ireland/Scotland...

Which is the heart of the problem. THERE ARE NO GOOD ANSWERS BECAUSE IT WAS A STUPID QUESTION.

"Shocking hypocrisy that you criticize me for questioning the reliability of the ONS data I used, when they offer the only data you would find acceptable. "

I don't mind using the ONS data, I was critiquing your use of the 600,000 which is an ONS count, and then deriding the net migration figure gathered by the same organisation. Not hypocrisy, critique, you need to know the difference.

As I said you were perfectly happy to use the data when it fitted your agenda, but sought to question the reliability and methodology when the figure doesn't.

The same goes for your attempt to question the authority of the Indy link, the true source of it is the National Police Chief Coucnil, but again it doesn't suit your argument so you launch an ad hominem, further undermining the quality of your argument.

This is easy old boy.

Quite Sapphire - accommodating Scotland and N Ireland is completely incompatible with Hard Brexit. So who will May decide is more important?
Sooner or later, she and her negotiating teams, will have to decide.

One assumes it's keeping her up at night on her holiday in Switzerland.

Who are having a salutary rough ride of it at the moment with their own freedom-of-movement referendum...

Something to think about, Theresa?

That Bojo article described a new relationship with the EU which resembled nothing so much as our current membership of the EU. I seem to remember him being roundly ridiculed for it at the time and his having to explain that it was written in a hurry and he hadn't meant it etc. In fact iirc Michael Gove edited it for him, just before he stuck the knife in.

God it seems a long time ago now.

I think the comment refers to the second one not the first

Only the first link was about race. The second was about the incoherence of Brexit philosophy.

Kiaja knew which link was being referred to and answered it accordingly Manon. Nothing to do with race at all.

My impression was that Marmaduchess was referring to both Indie links provided by Kiaja. She was implying that it was as biased for Remain as the DM is for leave (Despite the fact it doesn't print lies like the DM).

Either way - my point about her denial of racism stands.

Yes. Marmaduchess both disputed the evidence of racist attacks as reported in the independent, and suggested that an article on Brexiters' incoherence was invalid because it had appeared in the same newspaper, so Manon's point does indeed stand.

Not perhaps that it makes much odds. I saw today a description of arguing with climate change deniers that felt strangely familiar:

Arguing with climate change deniers is like trying to play chess with a pigeon. It struts around knocking over all the pieces then shits on the board and declares it's won.