Brexit-lite here we come

[Bearbehind]

Theresa May has today said the UK wants to maintain the closest possible economic ties with the EU and to guarantee the rights of EU citizens living in the EU.

Are any Leave voters actually happy with that?

Many of the remainers on here are all saying 'what a shambles' it is and that nothing has happened and that there was no plan and how terrible it all is.
Well I'm also pretty pleased with what I've heard so far it's going just the way I want. We won't be hearing what is happening until there are proper negotiations happening anyway.
The fact that there was no plan was nothing to do with the leave campaign. It was up to the government to have a plan. But I actually think TM has a plan and it's panning out just fine. She is going to see all the leaders and the chancellor is out and about as is Liam Fox et al. They are in other parts of the world laying foundations for negotiations for trade deals we will need after Brexit.
There are other things going on too in WM such as a committee discussing such things as how we deal with stopping the current open door policy. There will be loads of other things going on in every facet of government. But we won't necessarily know about them and I wouldn't expect us to.

Like I said corcory, I think people are hearing what they want to hear.

Only yesterday you said of TM on another thread 'She seemed to be indicating that the austerity we have been having for the last few years was not something she was going to continue.'

That's not at all how I interpreted what she said- I think she means austerity will just be a way of life.

Likewise, I think the plan is for freedom of movement and freedom of trade to be pretty much unaltered based on what is being said.

Well if this whole thing isn't a massive fuck up, then I don't know what is

I agree with Manatee

I voted Leave I'm fine with that

Salems - what's a 'massive fuck up'?
Bear - what I was trying to say yesterday is that I didn't think we were going to get more austerity, as in more cuts but that we were going to live within our means.

Smallpox is it really necessary for you to come onto every EU thread and instantly launch into the name calling. You attempt to shut down every discussion it's really quite unpleasant.

Apologies that was a spell check I meant Smallfox

Um, I'll do as I please, thanks.

I'm certainly not going to be called on being unpleasant when I have taken shed loads of abuse for not being "positive".

I was a Remain voter and believe me Brexit lite is not what I wanted. What I wanted is no Eu exit at all.

However that is not what got more votes on the day and the question that was asked was do we wish to remain or leave the European Union.

It does appear that what is being proposed will mean we are coming out of the EU in terms of full membership, but by keeping some economic ties overall effect will I hope be less catastrophic than it could have been.

Frankly I have no idea exactly what Leave voters wanted as this was not clearly articulated in the Leave campaign. It is hard to translate Making Britain Strong again and regaining national pride into specific actions.
Therefore I'm relieved that we appear to have someone vaguely sensible in charge who is going for the least bad option, and somewhat bemused by those crystal ball leave voters who could have foretold this would happen all along.

May has said herself that the government will stick to its intention to reduce public spending and cut the deficit.

Hammond has said that deficit reduction would have to continue but the 'parameters' would be reviewed.

What do you think "living within our means " meant?

Quite funny being in "that London" and having voted to remain, my economic circumstances won't really change, we'll get Brexit lite and the city will remain the world power it is (after all whose vested interests are they going to act in) the people voting out in the regions? Well they'll get something different for what they voted for.

I'd just like to remind people who are so full of praise for May and her "new approach" of this:

"Where there is discord, may we bring harmony. Where there is error, may we bring truth. Where there is doubt, may we bring faith. And where there is despair, may we bring hope’ and to all the British people—howsoever they voted—may I say this. Now that the Election is over, may we get together and strive to serve and strengthen the country of which we're so proud to be a part"

Margaret Thatcher 4th May 1979

Sounds great till you remember what she actually did.

What do you think "living within our means " meant?

A rebranding of austerity naturally...

I think people need to define their terms:

What is Brexit lite?

What is a full Brexit?

I don't think many leave voters wanted us to cut ourselves off from Europe. We did plenty of trade with Europe pre EU.

May also stated in that speech that she didn't feel the solutions to the problems Corbyn was presenting her with lay with increasing welfare spending; I agree with her.

rookie - I think you would have had listened to the debates, news night, Andrew Marr and Andrew Neil shows to have an idea what the leave campaign was actually about and not just the sound bites.
I don't think any of the leave voters have crystal balls but we listened to what the campaign was saying.

It's an almighty cock up. Who on earth would agree to get people to vote on a vague notion without any detail or preparation. Cameron will be crucified for this in years to come.

My understanding of brexit lite is leaving the EU but retaining the single market or a strong element of it. Perhaps with some concession of restricting immigration / temporary halt.

Full brexit is leaving fully to wander into an abyss of years of negotiation while our economy dries up.

Only a fool could vote for the latter. Nothing surprises me any more with politicians but I'm struggling to believe we'll get thrown into the latter.

I think May is handling it well.
Salem - if the EU feel they have to make an example of any country that wants to leave then to me that clearly shows why we must get out. It is no happy union if your objective is to make people too scared to leave. Attitudes like that from EU leaders are a clear statement to me that we shouldn't let them dictate to and it is time to step back.
Bear - your constant outrage and assumptions that you understand leave voters, when you don't, is actually pretty funny.

"We did plenty of trade with Europe pre EU"

But had been desperately trying to get into the common market for more than a decade before hand because we weren't benefiting as much as we could.

Lindy I agree some of the EU leads are bullies. I voted remain but their behaviour is awful. I think the issue is parts of the union (free movement and single currency) will be under serious threat over the next year with terrorism, immigration and poverty. If we'd hung in there my feeling is we would have got the reform people wanted sooner or later, without being hung out to dry.

It's not really like that. If you give up membership of a gym, you don't get to use the equipment. You certainly don't get perks on leaving that members don't have themselves.

Actions have consequences and I'd high choose to leave you don't get to dictate your terms.

• if not I'd high

There are some Leave voters who made that choice because they wanted EEA rather than EU membership. And did so knowing that EEA membership still means freedom of movement and, of course, very close economic ties. So yes, there are Leave voters who'd be very happy with that.

They may be a minority of Leave voters, but they exist and, more importantly, added together with Remain voters they likely form a majority of those who voted. Obviously this still potentially leaves us with a problem because guaranteeing the rights of EU citizens is not at all what some Leavers thought they were voting for. That problem doesn't necessarily go away because the majority of those who voted would find 'Brexit lite' acceptable, or at least more so than Brexit heavy.

If we'd hung in there my feeling is we would have got the reform people wanted sooner or later, without being hung out to dry.

I agree with this.

Leavers make the mistake of believing rightist propaganda that we don't have power in the EU - in fact we have enormous power as one of the biggest economies and actually the EU has been pretty accommodating of our general recalcitrance.