Brexit- still gutted by result

[TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince]

Now on holiday in France. Handing over our EU passports was bad😰

Driving through France. Lots of the French Tricolour flag being flown alongside EU flag. That made me feel gutted too.

I just don't seem to be able to rally about it😟. I feel very keenly that we have lost that sense of unity and support.

Snivelling in a French gite atm☹️

That's what I thought IPity; I was in Greece on 5 July last year and had many discussions with lots of different Greek people about the situation.

It was reported today in the guardian that they are discussing a way we can have a temporary (7-10 years) block on immigration and stay in the single market.

We'd still have to pay and of course not have a say on new rules but otherwise it would be a pretty good compromise.

On the one hand it sounds like a huge thing but on the other I heard it described as being as though the UK were invoking the 7 year moratorium on immigration that other countries took at the enlargement stage. We just didn't take advantage at that time (huge mistake in retrospect).

On the one hand it sounds like a huge thing but on the other I heard it described as being as though the UK were invoking the 7 year moratorium on immigration that other countries took at the enlargement stage. We just didn't take advantage at that time (huge mistake in retrospect).

Is this really what the majority of Leave voters want?

We don't have to accept it and move on. TM hasn't triggered A50 yet so there's time to make our feelings known and hope we can stay in the EU. That's democracy.

Think " heard it described as being as though the UK were invoking the 7 year moratorium on immigration that other countries took at the enlargement stage. We just didn't take advantage at that time (huge mistake in retrospect)."

I tried googling this because I didn't know anything about - I never knew the option existed. For some reason I thought when we adopted free movement the whole EU did so. Would you be kind enough to point me to any dates etc, that's so interesting.

Such a huge topic!

I suspect, modal, that had we won and Farage argued that there was a need for a second referendum you would not have said "that's democracy". We ran a shit campaign. We lost.

It is not a football match though. It is our lives and our dcs's lives:-(

It is not about winning

I'm still sad about it, but life carries on for now. I fear in 2019 I will be saying 'I told you so' quite a lot. Some people need to learn the hard way, it's unfortunate we all have to suffer the consequences too.

Oh my god this again? I voted remain but a lot of other people didn't. What is all this hand wringing supposed to achieve?!

Cuboidal "We ran a shit campaign. We lost"

what would you change about the campaign?

Sorry, been out of Internet access for a few hours.

Talking to the guy who runs the cottages..the general feeling is that Britain had taken leave of it's senses, and why would anyone want to leave a community that helped each other?☹️

It's easy to say put it behind you, but it's not that easy.

My ds grandfather voted remain despite being a true blue Tory. He was involved in the Berlin Airlift after WW2, and never wanted to see Europe in discord ever again.

It's not behind us at all. It's all still to come and I plan on expressing my opinion on every part of it, particularly when you have so much misinformation to combat, such as the Greeks' apparently holding an in out referendum and being "forced" to stay in the EU.

I get you OP

Poor you, OP. Still, have a lovely holiday, won't you?

Free movement has theoretically been part of the EU rules for ever, but in reality it was only in 1992 people could travel without a job. The internet also makes it much easier for people to get information about jobs, travel, money etc.
The 7 year moratorium was about the new countries (Poland, Romania) etc where travel from those countries could have been blocked for 7 years (and was by most of the EU). The Labour party decided they did not want to block them because none would actually travel here.

what would you change about the campaign?

Labour campaigning unambiguously for remain, possibly (given EU membership had been settled policy for 20 years) including expelling Stewart.

Positive discussion of economic benefits, rather than negative discussion of problems caused by leaving (same facts, different presentation).

Corbyn campaigning with Cameron.

More work on mobilising the young vote.

Genuine admission that A8 migration has not been an unalloyed benefit for British workers, and. Proposals to mitigate that.

A campaign that didn't just talk about London.

Effective leadership, not a washed up loser like Alan Johnsom talking crap about how you needed a visa to go to Spain in 1976, which just made him look stupid to anyone old enough to remember (you did need your passport to get travel money because of exchange control: look up who abolished that).

Shutting fucking Izard up.

Reading about why Yes to AV failed, and not making all the same mistakes.

Not running a campiaign based on yelling "now listen to me, poor people, I am middle class and know what is good for you even if you do not"

Need I go on?

Good analysis Cuboidal. The Remain camaign was pathetic. Osborne talked of a house price crash. For a significant number of people the answer to that would have been 'bring it on, perhaps we will be able to afford to buy a house now.'

Indeed. The campaign was almost designed to alienate everyone who isn't an employed homeowner living in southeast England, or a student at a high-end university.

TM hasn't triggered A50 yet so there's time to make our feelings known and hope we can stay in the EU. That's democracy.

How is it democracy? Majority voted leave.

You may not like it. I voted remain also but it isn't the best of three or let's keep going until I get what I want.

How is it democracy? Majority voted leave.
But as Ian Hislop said, after a General Election, the other side don't say 'OK we lost' and shut up for 5 years. They continue to press their points and try to influence legislation. I fail to see why the Remain camp can't try to sell the benefits. I think they will have a hard job because they have pissed off the other EU countries, but I still think they should try.

And after all, if the majority did vote leave, why don't we just trigger A50 now, and say we will take whatever is given, we don't need any input. That seems to be the logical way your argument is heading.

The argument that people didn't know what they were voting for is precisely the sort of smug arrogance that lost the campaign. It has a name amongst SWP cadre: "false consciousness" - the idea that the cadre know what "the class" want and need better than they do themselves. It is, of course, utter bollocks.

You feel sad about the EU flag?

just got back from a trip to Greece. The EU flag/passport thing made me feel sad too. Several Greek people wanted to ask us why we were leaving. All I could answer was that I voted to remain and am very sorry to be leaving. They obviously thought that we as a nation have taken leave of our senses

Seriously?
Because the Greek economy is doing so well.
they're probably jealous

OP you need to grow a pair.

Yes, still gutted OP and really concerned about the increasingly hard right rhetoric both at home and abroad. And I say that as someone who is very much in the centre ground politically.

It's kind of like with Trump. It all seemed do ridiculous, the arguments so implausible, that I didn't believe so many people would actually support them. And yet here we are.

OP don't 'feel sad'

Couple of years from now there won't even be a EU.

The whole thing was always a house of cards.

As an aside.
What is this 'thing' where adults state they 'feel sad'.
That's something you usually hear primary school age children saying.