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The mental trauma caused by boarding

321 replies

GodessOfThunder · 25/07/2023 19:28

Very interesting book:
https://amp.theguardian.com/books/2015/jun/08/boarding-school-syndrome-joy-schaverien-review

“Attachment – the crucial establishment of trust and security through a primary carer – is the basis of modern child development psychology. Boarding schools could not have broken or redirected healthy attachment more effectively, as Schaverien illustrates. From the moment the parent drove away, a child had to adjust to the fact that not only was privacy and safety no longer guaranteed – let alone the consolation of a hug – but that their parents had chosen this future. John Bowlby, the psychologist famous for first coming up with attachment theory in the 1960s, described public school as part of “the time-honoured barbarism required to produce English gentlemen”

Boarding School Syndrome review – education and the pain of separation | Society books | The Guardian

A gripping academic study of the mental wounds inflicted by classic British institutions

https://amp.theguardian.com/books/2015/jun/08/boarding-school-syndrome-joy-schaverien-review

OP posts:
AgathaSpencerGregson · 28/07/2023 13:03

CrazyArmadilloLady · 28/07/2023 01:17

You seem to be (wilfully?) missing the point of that post, which was:

I read something the other day when it was pointed out that most people are desperate not to have their children taken away and put into care, yet the rich actively seek it out and pay a fortune for it. I hadn't thought of it that way before, but even recognising that some parents have no choice for the reasons identified on this thread, it has the ring of truth for those who opt for boarding voluntarily.

It was simply pointing out an irony - that for most people, having their children taken away is their worst nightmare. Whereas some people pay for their children to be away from them for a not insignificant period of time.

It wasn’t (quite obviously, to me at least, with no skin in the game) comparing the experience of children in care with boarding schools.

I’m not missing the point at all. The post quoted, with approval, someone who said that people who send their kids to boarding school are paying for an experience comparable to their forcible removal. That’s what it said. You clearly find that indefensible (correctly) so for reasons best known to yourself you’re trying to pretend it didn’t.

Randomnamehere · 28/07/2023 15:33

sparechange · 27/07/2023 20:19

I’m not a ‘pro boarding school parent’

if you had bothered to read my posts, you’ll see I am a grew-up-in-an-abusive-household-child’ who is merely trying to add something to the thread

What I find really strange is the dogmatic posters who refuse to take on board any other opinion or lived experience and use ridiculously inflammatory language to try and shut down those posters who have a different viewpoint
Case in point here

You didn't address my question.

It appears you were using untruthful hyperbole (aka blatant lies) to shut down the posters who were speaking up about their own lived experiences.

So your last sentence is mere projection.

You favour the status quo. We get that. Your opinion doesn't trump others' negative experiences.

The discussion can move on I hope.

sparechange · 28/07/2023 15:40

Randomnamehere · 28/07/2023 15:33

You didn't address my question.

It appears you were using untruthful hyperbole (aka blatant lies) to shut down the posters who were speaking up about their own lived experiences.

So your last sentence is mere projection.

You favour the status quo. We get that. Your opinion doesn't trump others' negative experiences.

The discussion can move on I hope.

It appears you were using untruthful hyperbole (aka blatant lies) to shut down the posters who were speaking up about their own lived experiences.

how so?

Randomnamehere · 28/07/2023 16:02

AgathaSpencerGregson · 27/07/2023 23:52

Moving the goalposts there. I had and have no criticism for those saying they had bad experiences. My criticism is for those who are choosing to weaponise the tragedy of forcible removal of children to score points off people they disapprove of. Because it’s a disgusting thing to do.

Moving which goal posts?

Some of those speaking out in books and documentaries about their lived experiences have specifically likened boarding schools to foster care for the wealthy.

You can find published research that investigates the effects on children living in institutions like boarding schools, care homes, asylum centres and prisons.

Psychologists specialising in childhood development have written papers concluding that neither boarding schools nor children's homes are suitable places to raise emotionally healthy children.

Many ex-pupils have described themselves or others returning from an exeat at the school gates and physically clinging to the car door or their own mother until they were literally "forcibly removed" from their homelife again.

No one is "weaponising" anything in this debate, or saying anything objectively disgusting. I think you need to get past that fact and face the actual issues if you want to contribute anything useful to this thread.

Or you can just call me stupid again, and we'll leave it there.

Randomnamehere · 28/07/2023 16:04

sparechange · 28/07/2023 15:40

It appears you were using untruthful hyperbole (aka blatant lies) to shut down the posters who were speaking up about their own lived experiences.

how so?

Click "Show quote history" and all will be revealed.

AgathaSpencerGregson · 28/07/2023 16:09

Randomnamehere · 28/07/2023 16:02

Moving which goal posts?

Some of those speaking out in books and documentaries about their lived experiences have specifically likened boarding schools to foster care for the wealthy.

You can find published research that investigates the effects on children living in institutions like boarding schools, care homes, asylum centres and prisons.

Psychologists specialising in childhood development have written papers concluding that neither boarding schools nor children's homes are suitable places to raise emotionally healthy children.

Many ex-pupils have described themselves or others returning from an exeat at the school gates and physically clinging to the car door or their own mother until they were literally "forcibly removed" from their homelife again.

No one is "weaponising" anything in this debate, or saying anything objectively disgusting. I think you need to get past that fact and face the actual issues if you want to contribute anything useful to this thread.

Or you can just call me stupid again, and we'll leave it there.

there are people who have had bad experiences at boarding school. There are those sent too young, those sent who were not fitted for it, those sent to places where abuse was tolerated (and abuse happened and happens at day schools too and no, parents do not necessarily realise it when their children come home at the end of the day). That emphatically does not establish that as a general rule sending your children to boarding school is comparable to their forcible removal by social services for either parent or child and it is absurd and insulting to those who have had that experience to suggest it does.

AgathaSpencerGregson · 28/07/2023 16:11

even more absurd to suggest that a normal boarding school environment is comparable to prison. I’ve been in both, and I can’t tell you how ridiculous and hysterical a statement that us.

sparechange · 28/07/2023 16:25

Randomnamehere · 28/07/2023 16:04

Click "Show quote history" and all will be revealed.

Oh dear

you’ve got my posts mixed up with someone else’s, haven’t you. And then launched into me in a bit of mistaken identity and now instead of backing down and answering my question, we get this vague post

cringing for you

GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 18:20

AgathaSpencerGregson · 28/07/2023 16:11

even more absurd to suggest that a normal boarding school environment is comparable to prison. I’ve been in both, and I can’t tell you how ridiculous and hysterical a statement that us.

There’s all sorts of things in history that we now, with hindsight, judge to be inappropriate and in many instances cruel and damaging. I suggest sending young children to boarding school will become one in the future.

OP posts:
GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 18:22

sparechange · 28/07/2023 16:25

Oh dear

you’ve got my posts mixed up with someone else’s, haven’t you. And then launched into me in a bit of mistaken identity and now instead of backing down and answering my question, we get this vague post

cringing for you

Cringing for you - because you’ve latched onto this little sub-discussion due to having little of substance to counter the broader points made about the damaging mental effects of boarding.

OP posts:
fairislecable · 28/07/2023 18:31

I know a wonderful man an amazing father, in his 40’s now, he loved his time at Harrow it gave him a fully rounded education and if possible he would have sent his children there.

His brother on the other hand, absolutely hated it and couldn’t wait to leave but he intends to send his boys there! The logic of this defies me.

We are all different and for some children boarding school will bring out the best in them.

AgathaSpencerGregson · 28/07/2023 18:47

GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 18:20

There’s all sorts of things in history that we now, with hindsight, judge to be inappropriate and in many instances cruel and damaging. I suggest sending young children to boarding school will become one in the future.

I am not quite sure why you think this addresses the point I made about the absurdity of comparing boarding school to prison. But if we are on the question of how history will judge us, it seems to me at least as likely that it will take a very dim view of the far more widespread practice of placing non verbal infants in daycare, given what we know about the importance of attachment in infancy, and the fact that such children can’t tell us about abuse or unhappiness.

Hoppinggreen · 28/07/2023 18:53

fairislecable · 28/07/2023 18:31

I know a wonderful man an amazing father, in his 40’s now, he loved his time at Harrow it gave him a fully rounded education and if possible he would have sent his children there.

His brother on the other hand, absolutely hated it and couldn’t wait to leave but he intends to send his boys there! The logic of this defies me.

We are all different and for some children boarding school will bring out the best in them.

True but you can’t be sure which children until it’s too late

sparechange · 28/07/2023 19:20

GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 18:22

Cringing for you - because you’ve latched onto this little sub-discussion due to having little of substance to counter the broader points made about the damaging mental effects of boarding.

Little substance?

I boarded from the age of 11. I have given my view - and counterpoint - to some of your dogma. I have shared my experience.

If that makes you cringe, then maybe this thread isn’t the discussion you tried to pretend it was in your initial posts
Speaks volumes about you, I’m afraid

tenbob · 28/07/2023 19:27

It’s ironic @GodessOfThunder that while wanting to have a robust conversation about how boarding schools are awful in large part because of bullying, you are marching around this thread being a bigger bully than anything I ever encountered at school.

Not sure whether it’s insecurities or wanting to stamp other posters/opinions into submission, but your posting history on this thread is coming across as pretty unpleasant tbh

If you’re hoping to be a poster girl
for the soft, loving parenting who children want to be around 24/7, I’m not buying it

Anothernamethesamegame · 28/07/2023 19:41

I don’t understand boarding school for children under 13ish. Except maybe where it is the best option out of other very difficult options (eg care not possible safely at home etc). I just can’t imagine not seeing my 8-9 year old for weeks on end and not having oversight of their well-being.

I can understand possibly for older children, especially those with specific skills they might want to attend a specific school to develop/nurture.

GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 20:53

sparechange · 28/07/2023 19:20

Little substance?

I boarded from the age of 11. I have given my view - and counterpoint - to some of your dogma. I have shared my experience.

If that makes you cringe, then maybe this thread isn’t the discussion you tried to pretend it was in your initial posts
Speaks volumes about you, I’m afraid

One personal experience is just that.

Here’s some research for you:

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.0021-8774.2004.00495.x

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/bjp.12677

www.taylorfrancis.com/books/mono/10.4324/9781315760582/trauma-abandonment-privilege-nick-duffell-thurstine-basset

scholar.google.com/scholar_lookup?hl=en&publication_year=2020&author=J.+Faulkner&title=Balanced%2C+avoidant+or+preoccupied%3F+Attachment+strategies+of+adults+who+attended+independent+boarding+schools+compared+with+those+who+attended+independent+day+schools

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1532-7795.2008.00556.x

scholar.google.com/scholar_lookup?hl=en&publication_year=2014&pages=86-96&journal=Childhood+Remixed&author=N.+O%27Brien&title=‘I+didn%27t+want+to+be+known+as+a+snitch’%3A+Using+PAR+to+explore+bullying+in+a+private+day+and+boarding+school

OP posts:
GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 20:54

tenbob · 28/07/2023 19:27

It’s ironic @GodessOfThunder that while wanting to have a robust conversation about how boarding schools are awful in large part because of bullying, you are marching around this thread being a bigger bully than anything I ever encountered at school.

Not sure whether it’s insecurities or wanting to stamp other posters/opinions into submission, but your posting history on this thread is coming across as pretty unpleasant tbh

If you’re hoping to be a poster girl
for the soft, loving parenting who children want to be around 24/7, I’m not buying it

The mistreatment of children is a serious matter which prompts robust discussion.

OP posts:
tenbob · 28/07/2023 21:04

GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 20:54

The mistreatment of children is a serious matter which prompts robust discussion.

But you’re not having a robust discussion. You’re being a bully

The same sort of bully you chastise boarding schools for harbouring

Anyway, taking a quick skim of your posting history, you are just anti private schools
You don’t give a shiny shit about the kids (hence being so fucking rude to posters here who once were those kids), you just have an ideology objection to private schools and are using any angle you can to attack them

It’s just a shame that so many other posters have come here in good faith to share their experiences when you’re not actually interested in any of them, beyond gathering ammunition for your political stance

BoardingSchoolMater · 28/07/2023 21:04

The mistreatment of children is a serious matter which prompts robust discussion

The mistreatment of children absolutely deserves robust discussion.

However, the problem here is that, for you, "boarding school" = "mistreatment of children". But this is demonstrably not the case, however much you try to argue otherwise.

There can never be any sensible or nuanced discussion with someone who can't see beyond their own firm conviction/prejudice.

GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 21:04

sparechange · 28/07/2023 20:59

So you haven’t actually read any of my posts then?

Or you think those links are something new to me?

you’re making yourself like a prize tool with some of these posts as Pp said

Been on the ciders tonight?

I’ve read all your posts.

Accusing someone sharing a multitude of academic research that supports their point of being drunk is both childish and wholly undermining of your credibility. I thought they taught debating skills and suchlike at expensive private schools.

OP posts:
GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 21:05

BoardingSchoolMater · 28/07/2023 21:04

The mistreatment of children is a serious matter which prompts robust discussion

The mistreatment of children absolutely deserves robust discussion.

However, the problem here is that, for you, "boarding school" = "mistreatment of children". But this is demonstrably not the case, however much you try to argue otherwise.

There can never be any sensible or nuanced discussion with someone who can't see beyond their own firm conviction/prejudice.

Except in the multitude of academic research I posted a short while ago

OP posts:
GodessOfThunder · 28/07/2023 21:08

tenbob · 28/07/2023 21:04

But you’re not having a robust discussion. You’re being a bully

The same sort of bully you chastise boarding schools for harbouring

Anyway, taking a quick skim of your posting history, you are just anti private schools
You don’t give a shiny shit about the kids (hence being so fucking rude to posters here who once were those kids), you just have an ideology objection to private schools and are using any angle you can to attack them

It’s just a shame that so many other posters have come here in good faith to share their experiences when you’re not actually interested in any of them, beyond gathering ammunition for your political stance

“Ad hominem means “against the man,” and this type of fallacy is sometimes called name calling or the personal attack fallacy. This type of fallacy occurs when someone attacks the person instead of attacking his or her argument.”

OP posts:
CrazyArmadilloLady · 28/07/2023 21:24

I think the thread is over at this point, isn’t it?

Nothing left to say? No-one thinks any differently than when they joined the thread?

I agree with the OP, in theory - but your posting style is really off-putting.

I’ve been more persuaded by others on this thread (definitely not all, especially the ridiculously defensive ones).

Swipe left for the next trending thread