How many kids do you know definitely leaving private for state?

[Quodraceratops]

I'd be very interested to know how many children people know of who are definitely leaving their private school for a state school - not people with plans to do so in future years, solely those definitely going now / in 2025.
For myself - large Scottish all years school, I only have knowledge of my early primary kids's classes - no-one leaving so far (but I'm guessing early primary may be less affected as Labour have been signalling this policy for a while so you wouldn't start if you couldn't afford VAT).

There is no point to pretend it's black and white. There are good state schools IF you move to particular postcodes or areas. The Oratory is a state school 😂

Plenty of taxes can be avoided by just not doing something - SDLT (don't buy properties), road tax (don't buy a car), capital gains (don't buy appreciating assets); that's hardly unique

Moving house and paying stamp duty to avoid VAT on school fees would be a bit odd.

For the Oratory, they'd also need to convert to Catholicism.

I'd also advise people to be wary of moving into the catchment of an 'outstanding' school, because those grades are going and you might end up over-spending.

But even good state schools are funded at a level far lower than private schools, which does have an impact.

I am very aware, I am a Governor at our local comprehensive so I know exactly what state its in - its why my DC went Private

It is good for some, or so I hear. If you have a well supported neurotypical child and a good school then you can probably do just fine. Maybe not as well as in private, but not terrible.

if you have a nd child, it is generally terrible, though.

many things can be true at once - state can be great for many children, it also can be awful for many children.

My point is that presumably there is a reason that these private school parents went to great expense to avoid putting their child in a state school, yet these reasons seem to evaporate when it comes to dodging an 'unfair tax'.

True in many cases but not all. I still have 1 in Private and he will be staying there.
While I don't agree with the VAT thing (becuse I don't think it will do what people hope) at least it may make some parents think more carefully about using their local State schools if they have decent ones and not assume that Private is always better.

If private isn’t better then what the fuck are they doing with all that money?

“My point is that presumably there is a reason that these private school parents went to great expense to avoid putting their child in a state school, yet these reasons seem to evaporate when it comes to dodging an 'unfair tax'.”

it is a different concept if you are paying fees to pay for your own children’s teachers, maintenance/capex of facilities your child uses (even if the school does share them very widely) and don’t take a place your child is entitled to and already pay a huge amount of tax into a pot that gets shared with the many

VS

suddenly being told your choices are a “privilege” and you bought a luxury advantage so now your choices will be penalised with a privilege penalty, that buy the way won’t even help state schools anyway due to the pitiful amount likely to be raised (but the impact on you personally will be huge!)

So I think it is more than likely that many of those parents will reassess their choices, full stop. And unfortunately for the rest of us, not just with regard to schooling for their children, but with regard to having the privilege to work to that level etc to pay that amount of tax.

I think plenty of people will be making wide reaching changes off the back of this policy.

That is why taxes like this should always have a full impact assessment first. They are reckless against a backdrop of us simultaneously being told not enough people are working full time/full stop and not for long enough either.

Mine! But that was our plan anyway (to move our two from private primary to state secondary), as our local secondary schools are excellent.

I know of 2 others doing the same, but pretty sure it had always been their plan too.

DC in final year of primary has 2 new joiners from private school. Like DC they have tried for grammar tests this week. I understand why the parents moved them now, the work for 11 plus has already been done. It’s good news for our school’s KS2 SATs results and funding. The class is very full though. Against a backdrop of some local schools with falling rolls, we are very full. The most sought after state schools are still bursting at the seams.

Hello, i apologise in advance if this has been asked numerous times before.

I am very torn and appreciate any input re my child and private schooling from the offset.

I would like to ask, those who have older children who are still in school or moved onto secondary or later, has private schooling been worth it from Reception. Or how would you have done it differently.

To provide more context, we do have good states in the area , but lot of people still opt for private on our road , area. My son is smart enough as much I can tell for this age , but does lack focus and attention span.

Our school 3 kids that I know if left for state schools out of 2 years including ourselves. Both year 6 and 7 shrunk in size.. I don't know about other years.

moveornot2 personally I would hold out til year 2/3 and the move. Early school years is all about learning to read and you do much of that at home in any case. Private school really starts to benefit when they have different subject teachers and proper art / sport etc teachers.

@sheep73 thank you, that’s helpful to know.

i am sorry ! I was meant to start my own thread , not confuse this one - am clearly a novice ! I’ll start my own

Modern Languages but I think the same school…!

Really @Araminta1003 ? I don't buy all these threats to send children to state school and some how overwhelm the state sector. Only a couple of people have gone from my children's school and both their families will probably breathe a financial sigh of relief as they constantly were stretched.

Everyone else I chat too seems reigned to taking the hit because their reasons for sending their child private haven't changed.

I also think it's very hard to distinguish VAT from the general attrition resulting from COL and the fact that fees keep ratcheting up year by year anyway, plus the fact that falling birthrates have started to increase the number of parents who get their first choice of state school.

Exactly, two of the "outstanding"* schools near here are advertising they have spaces in several year groups and actively advertising for their next year R intake.

*(I don't like the one word assessments and am glad they are going)

I think the real impact will be felt in the medium to long term. Many parents whose children are already in private will seek to stay, particularly when many schools are trying desperately to offset as much of the VAT as they can, at least for now. But I think there are a lot of families who will now avoid starting private in the first place - or who'll transition from private prep into state secondary. That will be more manageable in terms of school places (because it won't be a sudden scramble for an in year place), but it will still have an impact. The education bill for the taxpayer will be higher, because there will simply be more children in the state system. Competition for the best schools will be fiercer. Families who may have previously needed two high incomes to pay for private school may prefer to substitute that for one high income plus a second parent with a lower income but more time to manage the children's education. The tutoring industry will explode further.

Perhaps this change will lead to what the optimists are hoping for: greater cohesiveness within the state system because of more buy-in from wealthy parents, and a gradual increase in standards. Perhaps it will lead to what the pessimists fear: the state education budget having to stretch even further, lower income tax revenue to pay for it, and even greater inequality within the state sector because of selection by 11+ tutoring and/or house price, plus an extremely exclusive private school sector. Only time will tell.

Personally, I’m hoping that at some point Labour will commit to actually finding enough funds to properly improve the state sector (particularly SEN provision). Even by their own calculations, the maximum sum raised by taxing private school parents will be a drop in the ocean. We only went down the private school route in the first place because we had a disastrous state school experience, particularly for my elder, disabled, DS.

If you don't mind the personal question: why are you planning in 6th form - and other parents at your school now - to jump straight from boarding to state?

If you need boarding because you're living far from schools, then how are you now going to manage it?

And if your reason for boarding is giving your child the best possible access to a well-rounded education, with extensive opportunities for learning and personal growth, then wouldn't a day private give you more of that than state?

So parents who were willing to pay a fortune for smaller class sizes, specialist teachers, excellent sports/performing arts facilities, lack of extreme behaviour issues, wraparound childcare are now suddenly reassessing whether it's worth it because the government has said that it's a luxury?

I mean, there wasn't the sneaking suspicion that it was a luxury beforehand and that's why they were paying extra to get it?

“So parents who were willing to pay a fortune for smaller class sizes, specialist teachers, excellent sports/performing arts facilities, lack of extreme behaviour issues, wraparound childcare are now suddenly reassessing whether it's worth it because the government has said that it's a luxury?”

@noblegiraffe - other than the small class sizes everything can be purchased extracurricularly VAT free on the open market. And 1:1 tutoring or small class tutoring trumps smaller class sizes any day.

It’s government interference at its best - tax the one-stop shop of Private School but not the rest.

So people will simply purchase the rest.

other than the small class sizes everything can be purchased extracurricularly VAT free on the open market. And 1:1 tutoring or small class tutoring trumps smaller class sizes any day.

Sure, you are going to buy your kid a tutor in every single subject to make up for the lack of small class sizes and specialist teachers and then send them to extra curricular clubs to make up for the lack of sports and performing arts....at what point does your kid actually get any free time?

Hahaha I'm going to beat the government's VAT plans by putting my kid in a state sixth form, that'll show them. Oh no, my kid doesn't actually have a teacher for their A-level that they need for uni and are having to teach themselves, now I have to source an A-level teacher for them.