Private schools are a bloody great rip-off

[fillipo]

and I should know because I used to teach in one!! I'm an English teacher, taught for 8 years in 2 different independent schools and then took the plunge and got a promotion into the state sector in September. It's like a breath of fresh air! And I've moved into the 21st century! Can't understand why I took so long to take the plunge. The teaching staff are on the whole far more professional - they don't have the complacency that some of my former colleagues had. Lessons are vibrant and interesting, the pupils are well behaved and interested. And it's free!! Well paid for through taxes but you know what i mean. Now I fully expect I'll be shouted down by lots of people telling me i'm wrong, but I don't understand why anyone pays for a private education when the alternative seems just as good.

sadly figures probably show they aren't

it sounds like your very lucky. there are some good schools out there - my kids are in one.

i'm glad your happy.xx

I'll think of you during my two week half-term

It's obvious that you are not a Maths teacher. You want to extrapolate the whole of the education system from a sample of 3 schools? Not statistically valid!

My experience is: My DD went to a State school. When she joined them she was predicted straight As at GCSE but only got Bs because her school lacks ambition. On the other hand, DS is at a brilliant State school and I think that he will do well at GCSE. Conclusion: some State schools are excellent and some aren't.

I wouldn't pay for private if the alternative was just as good but, quite often, the alternative isn't as good. In DD's case, the school wasn't so bad that it was worth thousands of pounds of my hard-earned money to go private. However, if money was no object then I would have been out of her lacklustre school like a shot.

Scaryscience - you're dead right that probably the main difference is those hugely long holidays lol. Yes I would be looking at two weeks off if I'd remained in the private sector - but hey, a two week holiday doesn't make the school better!! Yes, of course my experience is anecdotal - isn't everyone's? - and yes, of course there are some rubbish schools in both state and private sectors. I'm just observing the fact that whereas in the private schools I taught in, many of the parents (and teachers) assumed that the institution "must" be better because it came at a cost of nearly 20 grand a year. And the reality from what I can see is that a lot of these parents are throwing their money down the drain. Custenstein - you mention statistics. I think what most statistics tell us is that the vast majority of kids in private schools are at least above average ability with parents who are going to push them to do well. It doesn't mean that a child of similar ability and parents who take an interest in their education is going to do less well at a state school. And let's face it, it's your own kids you're bothered about - if a pupil gets 10 A grade GCSEs, I've never heard the parent give a moment's thought about whether 20, 10 or 0 other kids in the school got them too! Anyway, keep the posts coming - I knew this would spark some debate (!) but just couldn't resist posting my experience because it's been quite a revelation to me too.

I was a teacher, in state school for 9 years. I worked in two different schools - one very good, one failing and in Special Measures. My experience in the latter resulted in me leaving teaching completely, and with no inclination to return.

There aresome excellent schools out there - in both sectors. And also some not so good. And I know that there are some truely dreadful state schools. I don't have any experience of really bad private schools but I dare say some may exist.

I pay for my DD's education for many reasons. We looked at state and private. We chose where DD is as it best suited us and her. And so far it is worth every single penny. The teachers are professional, The teaching is excellent. The lessons and the school day is fun, imaginative and DD adores it.

I am not shouting you down, nor saying you are wrong about the schools you taught in - but not all independent schools are lacking IME. Just as not all state schools are great.

And IMO in many areas the alternatives are not "as good" sadly.

I work in a state secondary school which is nothing like the one you describe, and it recently had 'satisfactory' from Ofsted. The next nearest is in special measures, and the next nearest had 5GCSE incl M/E rate of 15% last year! Added to that there are plans afoot to close all 3, re-organise the pupils, and have a new Academy: all during the time my boys are in yrs7-11.

My boys will be going to an independent school.

roisin - that's dreadful, that as someone contributing to education in the state sector you feel you have no option but to pay through the nose for your own children's education. What an appalling lack of choice for you. I suppose what really surprises me though, is that I've only moved 3 miles down the road to the job I'm in now, so many of the parents who send their kids to the private school I taught in until last July, did have the option of the state school I'm in now. And I honestly can't see why they don't choose the state school as an option. A few of the parents have maybe got more money than sense, but many of them were struggling to pay the ridiculous fees. The school I'm in now had a "Good" in its latest Ofsted, but I've also known parents choose private when the local school is "Outstanding". Weird!!

I don't think it is possible to generalise on such limited experience. Good and bad in each sector, and I'm sure in each staffroom.

I suppose it depends what you want from an education. Around here the schools with good results are sausage factories that cram kids from day one and try and make them take BTECHS that don't suit them so as to raise their own standards.

I also want dd to have a catholic education and to flourish and grow in our strong religius and cultural heritage and I don;t think she will do that in our local vcatholic schools. I also want dd to acces lots of extra curriular activities which are just not possible in the local state sector.

I will have to work hard to pay the fees but I am not blindly throwing my money away, as a teacher I know a lot about the local schools and rejected a lot of private schools and have done a lot of research into the one dd will be going to including doing a visit on a normal day and sitting in lessons. I very strongly did not want my dd to attend the private school but buckled under family pressure and the look of delight on dd face whenever she goes there. I also know that the schools in our town have lots of money problems so calss sizesd are too big and children with special educational needs are going without support and we are about to go through lots of change with some schools being merged, some being demolished, an academy being introduced and other variations. Due to the high levels of transience in this town schooling here is unastable enough without all of that being added to the mix.

Unfortunately the alternatives are not always as good.
Private and state schools can be excellent, private and state schools can be rubbish. Depends on the individual school doesn't it.

I'm really glad you feel like that.

My experience of state and private education (having been educated privately and worked in independent and state schools) is that each factor has a good and bad way to spin it!
The following can often be true:
In independent schools some children who would, by dint of average intelligence, some laziness or 'rebellion' achieve mediocre results in the state sector are 'cushioned' from the results of their mediocrity, given a sense of confidence and boosted to results which they would not have achieved in the 'survival of the fittest' state system.
There are many teachers in private schools who left the state sector because they could not handle a wide range of children well enough. They have left and taken a less stressful option.
Those two week half terms. Independent schools present financial challenges in more ways than one. If you are, and can afford to be, a SAHM two week half terms are wonderful. If you must work to support fees extended holidays mean you pay out yet more for half term holiday schemes, and your children may feel separated from their freinds.

Independent education may be what you want, and the best for your child, but if you are choosing it because you have fallen for the horror stories and the peer pressure to 'go priavte' and want to be free of the perceived anxiety of sending your child to a state school, you may be lulling yourself into a state of false security!

Yes; my disagreement is with people who automatically assume that private education must be better than state education.

I tend to feel that if you've exhausted all the state options available to you and they really won't do, private is tenable.

I don't think it matters that teachers may have left the state sector to go the to the private for the less stressful option, as long as they can teach the kids in the private sector and do a good job I am happy. I have seen many very good teachers driven to the edge by the state sector.

I teach in a comprehensive - described as 'good' by Ofsted. It's certainly not a 'sausage factory' - bright kids do well academically and go on to University if that's what they choose. Less academic kids do well on vocational courses which are suited to their ability and which don't spoonfeed them into achieving inflated grades which make them appear cleverer than they really are. In fact if we're talking sauage factories, I'd say it's a more apt description of our local private school where a friend of mine works - she says she's bored rigid teaching classes of kids who basically want to learn the 'right' exam answers to get the 'right' grades to get into the 'right' university. My kids don't go to private school, because the bottom line is, I don't want them to grow up thinking that they're 'better' than the other 93% of the population. [Ducks and runs for cover!!!]

I teach in a state school and am having a two week half term!

Twinsetandpearls: is that one of the new 6 term arrangements?

I agree that any kind of school, state or private can ne a sausage factory, our most efficient school in terms of sausage making is a private one, hence it was the first one scrubbed of our list in terms of secondary. The school I am sending dd to is not a hothouse, infact for a selctive school its results are not outstanding but it has the extra curricular activities , ethos and emphasis on our catholic heritage that I am looking for.

I don't want my dd to grow up thinking she is better than anyone else and I challenged the head to tell me how he was going to support my efforts in achieving this. I am not going to defend private education as it is the one decision I have made in my life that sits the most uncomfortable with me and is indefensible. Very few people know we are about to withdraw my dd from the state sector and I know that quite rightly I will get grief for it. But the decision was not taken without lots of research - no assumptions were made.

No it is because we are having twilight inset.

We all know the things that can be wrong with state schools. Regarding private schools, does anyone have any experience of problems there? When private goes wrong, what sort of wrong is it?

NFK - loads can go wrong, but as you say, we tend to not here about it because there are way smaller numbers in private schools. Just a few anecdotes from my friend.... a fairly large amount of underage drinking and sex, which is covered up as far as possible by the Headmistress. Some pretty uninspriring teaching which get accepted as ok because by and large the kids are docile enough in the classroom to not question it and expect something better. Some awful parents = the meddling mother brigade whose husbands pay the school fees and who have nothing better to do after dropping the kids off than hang around in the playground competing with eachother over whose child is best. That's a few things for starters!

sorry 'hear' about it. I can spell, honest!!

We have a local private school with a big drugs problem. although I wonder if it is percieved as such a big problem as we don't expect it of a private school and they can afford more and perhaps different drugs. the same school is also very old and it building and general resources are in quite bad repair and need updating.

I know of another state school which seriously crams kids and lots of them are unhappy. This same school is also known for taking your fees from age three and then turning around in year 10 or eleven and saying we will only let them sit one or two because it will affect their placings in the league tables. They also have no meaningful SEN support or counselling system. I know of a mother there whose son has SEN needs and behaviorial issues but they are refusing to put in place any support and strategies and when she complains they say you can always send him somewhere else.

If you are considering boarding there are issues that come with that as well.