why are some women content to do all the housework?

[honeydew]

I meet lots of mums in my local area who, like me, are stay at home mums with very young children but are prepared to do absolutely everything for their partners and DH's! They slave away cooking, cleaning and washing at home with no help and at the weekends, they still don't expect
their partners to do anything! I have friends who never get a proper break from their children, even if it's only for a couple of hours. Their DH's leave them to it 24/7. Is it just me who has found that old style patriarchy is alive and well in society once a woman gives up work to raise her brood? My DH does help me with baby DS, he also puts my older daughter to bed and washes up after I've cooked each night, so we work as a team. So many women I speak to say that their DH's are not 'hands on' parents and do virtually all the chores and baby changing/feeding. Oviously, if one partner is working during the week they can't do that much, but some men don't want to contribute at all it would seem! Are they just lazy or simply 'expect' women to fulfill that role?

'Since you and your DH are both teachers you don't need to prioritise.'

Yes we do cos we don't teach the same students at the same time in the same school. I'm just saying when we decide who takes time off money or who has got the better job (which is dp) doesn't come into it and I would like to think that it wouldn't even if he were the Headmaster but I appreciate this doesn't sound and probably isn't very realistic.

Still, like I said, if we just accept these things then they will continue. They need to be questioned.

Okey-dokey BAWC.
Goodness, I've only been on this forum a day and I'm already a week behind on the housework...

Fairymum- I suppose I am defined at the mo by my job as a sahm. I have found it a very difficult job to do and for years I was fighting to try and validate the job to myself. I haven't meant to make anyone upset or insulted by any posts and I'm sorry if anyone feels that way. I think it is that I wish we sahms had a recognised job in society. When I went to registar one of my children's births I was asked what I did. I told the man that I was a fuul time mother and as he was typing this into his computer he said outload " Mother, of no gainful employ" Now I know what he meant, I don't earn a wage, but that was so insulting considering the many meanings of gainful. Anyway this has been said so many times.
I would like to see a society where men and women are recognised and respected for their DIFFERENCES and that it becomes OK. for men and women to have very different but equally important skills, and not have a soceity that tries to iron out the uniquness of the sexes thereby losing the benefits of having both. Does that make sense? Hope so

again BAWC - slightly jealous of your utopian life but you must admit you are lucky - my DH earned about 40K more than me so we had to admit my job wasnt as important whereas yours are more balanced i would imagine? i agree that it more likely that mums are expected to do the childcare and majority of housework but i do expect a division of labour when DH returns from work if he expected me to continue doing everything when he gets back from work there would be strong words had......

OK between me and DH I earn more money, BUT when he is working his takes the priority. Basically is he takes a day off there is an actor missing from the play, if I take a day off I have to catch up on my sales the next day.

So money isn't everything and IMHO it is about negotiation.

But of course if we are all SAHM (or dads) there would be no need to argue/negotiate about who's job was more inportant (only joking )

With us, the person who is least busy takes a day off work if DS is ill. However, as neither of us is entitled to be paid if we take time off to look after sick DS, we loose more money if DH takes a day off work.

However, taking time off for sick children is nothing compared to the amount of time that I think I would need to take off to cover holidays, half term, inset days, attend sports days etc. etc. I have worked out that DS will be out of school for about 3 months a year. Have I made a mistake in my calculatations or is this right?

MadameP - my worries exactly and 3 months is about right.... dont have to worry to much about this for another couple of years but beside the competition for school friendly hours jobs you then have the amount of time off to cover - no wonder people take the option to continue being SAHM when kids are school age - oh to be a teacher

Nope that ia about right!!

Hence it can be more tricky with school aged kids, try to find a CM in your area. They will usually do after school and holidays, they also often do all the inset days etc.

Or find some work uptopia that does exist in your dreams where you work 9 - 2.30 school days only

kittywits, I absolutely agree that there is a difference between the sexes. In our house too the roles of mummy and daddy are very different, but we supplement eachother. I think it's important to our children to have a mummy and a daddy who can play with them, care for them, who takes an interest in their homework, go to school meetings and care for them when sick. I think it's important for my children to see that their dad wants to take time off work and care for them when sick too. And I think it's important, especially for my DD, to see that you can have a career as well as children without stressing yourself out as long as you share fairly between you.

I second Kittywits .

Really?!!!

OK, so my plan is to retrain to do my ideal job (botanical artist), get loads of commissions, only work between 9 and 2.30 and take the holidays off. Sorted. (I will also be doing this in a house by the sea with a lovely deck overlooking the beach, and I will probably be wafting around in white linen alot. My house will be on Grand Designs, but it will be one of the few ones where everything goes right...ooh and I'll have a brilliant guaranteed pension plan...)

Make sure you pay your taxes too

Blimy, we're being much less argumentative tonight. Phew. Just to say that some of you are equating importance with earnings and, while I understand that if it means as a family you lose more money if mum takes a day off rather than dad or vice versa, then that makes sense, as many others of you have been at pains to stress, some of the most important jobs are badly paid or not paid at all (like mother or fatherhood).

I wish my job was as utopian as you seem to think it is. Actually my college runs from 9am till 4.20 which means we really need to be there from 8.30 am or earlier till at least 4.45 which would mean not being able to pick up dd1 till at least 5 and dd2 (at nursery) till 5.30 so since I want to pick them up earlier when they're in school I will have to be p/t and therefore get paid p/t salary when some teachers finish school at 3 pm anyway and get paid full-time IYSWIM. And not all of our holidays coincide so I'm now having 2weeks with dds on my own before DH breaks up and he will have 2 weeks with them on his own at the other end of the holiday.

Also, as I've said, although my contact hours at college finish at 4.20 both DH and I do several hours in addition to this every night after kids are in bed and at weekends and on holidays. Sometimes I dream about a job where you didn't have to bring work home. But I know the grass is always greener...

It's too nice an evening to be arguing. The sun is still shining here and it's rather lovely sat with the patio door open and a cool breeze blowing in.

DH has gone to a works dinner Now that's what I miss about work, even though at the time they seemed crap and bothersome to attend. But actually, I'm looking forward to an evening of DDs in bed and the house to myself for the evening.

Glass of sauv blanc, anyone?

can't someonesmum - have housework to do

Oh come on cleaninglady - a little tipple helps with the dusting monotomy. Mothers little helper....

By Kittywits Wednesday 4.47 pm

"I have found it a very difficult job to do and for years I was fighting to try and validate the job to myself. I haven't meant to make anyone upset or insulted by any posts and I'm sorry if anyone feels that way. I think it is that I wish we sahms had a recognised job in society

By Kittywits Wednesday 7.34 am

I have seen arguments for both parties. What I haven't seen is anyone suggesting that women SHOULD sah when they have pre school children.I know this will offend I reckon the mother, by evolution, is the best caregiver. I know there are women who have no choice and have to go back to work when they don't want to and that is awful for them. What really pes me off is those women who CHOOSE to go back to work and put their poor kids in day care!!!
I think it's outrageous. Why did they bother having kids if they can't be bothered to give them the care and support they need..... I think kids suffer if there is not a parent, pref mother staying at home.
yep and I know this is really going to piss people off I have seen so many kids 'abandoned' by working parents at school. Those parents are too busy/ tired to take part in their kids' school life and the kids look really sad about it.

Kittywits, have you been swayed by the working parents arguments here? Early this morning you were writing messages 'you knew would offend' By the late afternoon you were saying 'I haven't menat to make anyone feel upset'

What a difference a day makes. Why the change of tack?

No I haven't really changed tack, I can see your point though. It's more a question of consideration. Somweimes you realise that HOW you have said something can be upsetting etc.
I do believe that one should be able to say contentious things, things that might well upset alot of people, but it's not BECAUSE you want to upset anybody it's sort of part of the deal.
Perhaps I'm just not sure how it's supposed to work here on MN. If you hold views that are contentious, should you not discuss them? I think it is fascinating to hear people's views. I shall keep putting my views forward, but I shall be much more careful with my wording, lest the wording actually offends more than the view itself! That is what I meant by not meaning to offend. The views might put people's backs' up, but the language shouldn't. Does that make sense/ I'm v.v. tired and have a jelly head tonight.

I still beleive that people shouldn't have children if they can't /don't want to care for them. I have seen so many children treated as accessories /by products of sex.

KW it is hard when you feel your veiws oppose what is generally accepted here on MN. However don't be afraid to post, just beware the response

Of course you should put your strong views forward. That's what makes a great thread
I totally agree that you should not have children if you don't want to care for them, but being a working parent does not mean you don't care for your children. See, being a SAHM or a WHOM tells us nothing about your parenting skills or about your relatinship with your children.

Thankyou for being so kind, it's much appreciated

well, kittywit, hopefully the more you read mumsnet, the more you'll see how people can and do have strong views yet survive here. Lots do it - it can be done

Using emotive words like 'outrageous' and 'abandoned' when talking about other methods of parenting is IMO not always helpful for reasoned debate. If you had been a working parent reading that early morning message of yours, how would you have felt?

I find it very interesting to read how other people feel about their own parenting choices - speaking from their own direct experience with their own children. If someone said that they felt they had abandoned their child by taking a job and also believed their own child felt abandoned - that IMO is not automatically offensive to all working parents. It's just someone's viewpoint applied to their own life.

It's when people start to talk about other people's parenting choices, without having personal insight or experience of those choices that things can get on dodgy ground IMHO.

kittywits, you should post whatever you feel. everyone else does!

and you know many posters me included agree with much of what you are saying, so please don't think you are alone.

sometimes on MN saying you feel most mums should look after their own kids brings down the wrath of mums who spend all day at work and feel it's the right thing to do.

but each to their own!