Those of you in favour of grammar schools, come and tell me what to say to my Ds...

[seeker]

He woke up crying in the night because the reality had just hit him that he won't be going to school with his close friends in September because he failed the 11+ in September. "I can't be very bright, can I mum, or I would have passed" " no, it was just one of those things-you're going to a good school, you'll be fine" "I know- but if i was clever I'd be going to school with X and Y" "You are clever- look at your SATs-you'll be in the top set at the high school because of those" " it's not SATS that are important, though, it's the 11+"

Do you want to have more kids feeling like that? Then campaign for more grammar schools,

Where have I ever said I thought out personal situation is disastrous? U think the system is., but as I have said on this and othe threads, my Ds will be fine. He is, however, a very useful example of why the system stinks,

The thing is Seeker, you are so hypocritical to post this and expect sympathy. I simply do not get your rational. Your older daughter passed... cue much jubilation but yet you yap on endlessly about the utter unfairness of it all for your son. If you were Living by your oft spouted beliefs then neither of them would have even sat it. You keep saying you're a victim of the system you live in. Well, not really, not when nearly 80% of children attend comps...if you want to keep saying they are highs, fine but they a huge spectrum....as you know. If he had passed, then some other poor sod might be sobbing, that is not ok is it? Just accept it. It might be better for you if you just utter abandon your loosely held principles and send him private instead of yearning for all that he has lost.

That's the problem people are having seeker. You post as if wanting help when you actually know your ds 'will be fine' because he's a 'useful example' to make your political point.

and I thought when posting my first response that seeker knows all this already. I feel a bit used, it's all about the anti grammar agenda not really your ds at all.

If you genuine think your son will be fine, and you have told him so and he believed you, why on earth are you posting?

You clearly think he is going to an inferior school (no madrigal group) with children of lower intelligence and that thus will have a negative impact on him.

As before, you can carry on thinking this is really bad or you can get a grip.

It is your choice how you handle this situation.

Or move house.

But coming on here and posting repeatedly, including laying down this gauntlet of 'those in favour, how would you answer my son who has been unfairly rejected?' is pointless.

Pointless if you genuinely do think he will do fine at the secondary modern, I mean.

The reason the system works is because only the bright get in. That means we all risk having children who won't get in. The grammars are good because most children including the boy here were not as good as those who did.
If we simply have more grammars they would be mediocre ones. It's like with prviate schools - you get a pecking order from Westminster/St Paul's down to those those not at all bright go to.

I think children are only as upset as parents make them. Just have iti as no big deal. Big up the other options - we also do this with all schools our children try for. The only distressing situation was daughter 2 not getting into Habs where her sister went . she was only 5 and they coudl not find a book she couldn't read - so I really think of all our children she was the one who might have gone (triplets got 3 places in that year)... and she did cry not that it lasted long, went to a lovely other school instead (St Paul's feeder)and got into NLCS at 7 which is above Habs in A levels indeed often one of the best for A levels in the UK and it was all fine and indeed they have very similar careers now. Life is about trying and failing things. On the £1k a day earnings thread I list a load of my career and business failures over the years. It is the mental attitude to that that mattesr and how we deal with the failures rather than that they occurred.

Could you take a second job and pay school fees for him and perhaps your husband take a weekend job too? Lots of parents are prepard to do that kind of thing for their child.

Actually, I think a lot of your DS's problems are less to do with having failed the 11+, but to be going to a different school to his friends - if you lived in a comprehensive system, you would still risk that at 11 several of his best friends wouldn't be going to the same school, either from parents choosing different state schools or choosing private education - as happened to me.

Do you know any of the other DCs from his class who will be going to his school? could you arrange meeting up with their families? OK - it's a little late in the summer for this, (pity you didn't post earlier) but still might be good to have him talking to other boys/girls who will be there at his school when he starts, rather than just spending time with boys who'll be talking about going to the grammar school.

And if he's really as gifted as you say, obviously just having an off day for the 11+ exam (which you chose to put him in for even though you don't approve of it), could be worth checking out if any of the private schools have scholorships - he might be too late for 11 intake, but many have an intake at 13. (Mind you, if you're against selective education, I can't see you'd want him to be in private either)

(my first paragraph wasn't clear, I didn't go to private school, I was sent to the comp that the majority of my school went to, however 3 of my close friends didn't, either because they were sent to different state schools or private)

oh, and you'd probably have tears this summer if he had passed the 11+ but all his friends didn't. It's a big change.

Seeker, if you think that your don being bright and being supported by an achingly middle class family means he will do well even at the secondary modern, what on earth is the problem?

You say he will do well.

What's the problem, then?

I am sure there will be a madrigal group in the evenings if you look. And a tutor in Latin. Voilà.

I can't see the problem unless you think it's a disaster. Which you deny.

What school system do you want seeker? I have read your views on private schools before and i know you are anti them as well.

You sound rather bitter about this Seeker - if you were so worried about it why live in an area with grammar schools?

DW didn't pass the 11+ (one sib did and did amazingly and the other didn't sit it) but she has still done very well academically over the years.

Sadly, we can't all pass everything - that is a lesson of life. Perhaps when your DS does significantly better than his peers/friends who did get into grammar schools you can demonstrate to him that he is not a failure...

It might also be that your son thrives in a school where he is one of the brightest?

I'm so glad I live in a comprehensive area when I read threads like this.

He still should have all the opportunities at his secondary modern school that he would have at grammar. There will be a large overlap, and the sm will absolutely be preparing A* students.

He might have to be a bit more keen and you might have to be a bit more pushy, but you will end up in the same place. He will probably end up in the grammar school for sixth form.

His ultimate career choices will be determined by what he does in sixth form. If he is an aspiring 3 A/A* student (for medicine etc), he will still be able to achieve that. He will be able to demonstrate softer skills in spades.

Are there plus sides? For example, is the school closer to home, so he will have more leisure time and less drudgery of commuting?

On every cloud, there is a silver lining.

Don't be disillusioned by extra curricular opportunities. My three eldest children in two very highly regarded independent schools have done virtually nothing outside of their academic learning. I get a bit cross when schools market themselves as being amazing at club x, y and z. My three very different children have not partaken. My youngest two are in a small school where they have to participate.

But Xenia the bright don't always get in. My dd passed the 11plus but didn't get a place. Kids who scored lower than her but live nearer got a place. As the town gets bigger the catchment area shrinks. This is only the 2nd time ever that kids from our village didn't get a place, so its not like we're out the "catchment area"

I was a bit confused with the title and op, but now reading the replies, I take it you are anti grammar? Why did he sit the 11+ then? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick?

Viva well that is not fair. If you take any of the best private schools like Manchester Grammar or Habs you could live 200 miles away and you'd get in if you did the best in the paper. It is a purer and fairer system but the the private sector does just about everything better than teh state. So the answer is to ensure women pick careers which enable them to pay school fees.

Again I think parental influence though affects how a child feels. No one our children know is going to their next school. You know that doesn't bother them one jot. Why is that?

If seeker is against privateschools and grammarschools asseems to be the case stated by others,then she hasno choice but to send her DC's to a comprehensive.

Of course I too am all for equal opportunities but not where my DS is concerned.

You cannot change the factyour DS has failed the 11+. All you can do is make a choice for the best available school. Like Xenia I would say that now exists in the private sector.

My own school is semi selective. We have some pupils who are scholarship, some who are able but did not make the cut on the 11+ and some who are rather more challenged.

They all share afamily background where education is valued and where their parents want the best chance for them.

Its worht saying here maybe that whilst my A2 class this year were all
"failures" in the local Grammar School system, my results werre better than Colchester Grammar. Eat your heart out Colchester - super selective and still cant get the results? Which I think shows the clear superiority of a private education .

The problem is that people are perfectly happy if their DCs pass, but in reality highly intelligent children from supportive, educated families fail. They always have and they always will.

Our grammar only offers sport and music as after school activities, DDs high school has 20 different things on their list.

DD is bright, but she wouldnt have coped in the grammar school, its too competitive. Half way through her first year her HT asked us if we wanted to see about moving her to a grammar,we didnt. Shes happy and content and doesnt get realms of homework.

I know it can be important to do well academically, but its not the end all and be all. I just wanted her to be happy.

I do agree about parental attitude, I've had my tears well away from dd. Infront of her I've raved about how good the comp is (and it is a comp not a secondary modern, complicated but its in another town). I've bigged up the fact her friends are going, etc. I've told her how if she's clever and works hard she will do well anywhere.

She had a lot of tears initially as she had wanted the Grammar after the open evenings. But she's fine about it now and is looking forward to the comp.

I obviously have some reservations about how good a school with a 65% GCSE pass rate can compare to a school with a 100% pass rate. However I keep telling myself that there will be kids going to the comp who would never pass 5 GCSEs inc maths and english no matter how good the teaching is.

Sorry, my computer keyboard seems to be missing recognition of the space key( unless you thump it).

Hope the above is readable.

And to agree with jabed( a very rare occurrence!) the fact that he can take the failures and get better results than the grammar school that rejected them shows the mockery of the whole system.

Children are not fools - my parents had the best possible 'can do' attitude but I knew I had been tested and was a failure. The fact that everyone around me said that I wasn't didn't make a difference.