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Original poster

Does social class over power gender at attainment in schools?

391 replies

Emily19 · 27/04/2011 14:47

Hello,
I am currently studying on an access to Teacher Training course. I intend to research "Does social class over power gender at attainment in schools?".

Any Information given is completely confidential, if you require a copy of any work I have used, I will be more than happy to supply you with a copy. (In your opinion)

  • What are your views on Social class affecting attainment in schools?
  • What are your views on Gender affecting attainment in schools?

-Which do you think has the greater influence?

Many Thanks

OP posts:
mrz · 10/05/2011 07:28

Jabed I suspect you and I may be of the same generation and I certainly wouldn't refer to a child as ESN or throw them out of my class! Shock

Yellowstone · 10/05/2011 08:20

I think you previously said that you were told 'Well it's only a job jabed, get on with life' when you were made redundant. You told us you were pushed rather than jumped.

If your son develops SEN will your attitude change? What would you do then? Or are you going to mould him so closely in your own image that you believe there's no chance. Children can surprise. I only the poor little boy doesn't become a lonely out of time teenager with a crushed spirit because of his dad.

Using the experience of the aristocratic Old Harrovian Winston Churchill 100 years ago as an example of how social class in modern Britain offers advantage doesn't indicate much depth. Emily if you're out there in the ether, this probably isn't a good one to use.

Yellowstone · 10/05/2011 08:21

Sorry, partly crossed threads.

Yellowstone · 10/05/2011 08:22

I only hope..

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 16:26

Jabed didn't you say you've been teaching for 15 years and not 150? This is probably as long as I've been teaching too and certainly inclusion was part of the job description then. Or is this another example where you did absolutely no research and then were horrified about what you'd found yourself in the middle of? I don't think I've encountered any teachers who know less about teaching or schools than you do or who show less compassion to young people and less enthusiasm for the job and, once again, I have to wonder whether you really are a teacher because it's hard and worrying to believe that there are schools that employ people with attitudes like yours to work with children.

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 16:33

'I do not want SEN in my ds's classroom either preventing teaching and learning.'

And I personally find the assumption that children with SEN prevent teaching and learning truly vile and utterly, utterly, ignorant.

You should not be in a classroom, Jabed.

I am glad you were made redundant from your teaching post in the state sector but I do not know any indepedent schools who would knowingly employ a teacher with your views either. My dcs' school which is a selective indepedent school with exceptional results offers excellent support for children with SEN of whom my daughter is one.

You may also be surprised to learn, Jabed, that some of my gifted students who are an ASSET to their peers this year have SEN. I've just copied one of my dyslexic student's A* essays for the rest of the students on the course as an example of insightful, analytical, beautifully structured work.

EvilTwins · 10/05/2011 17:55

It's no bloody surprise you were made redundant, Jabed. Far from being the caped crusader, raising exam grades wherever you went, you are clearly a dreadful teacher. No wonder the state system didn't want you any more.

I qualified in 1997 - 14 years ago. Lucky for me that I missed the training on being an ignorant bigot that, by your standards, died out in 1996. What a relief.

I echo fivecandles - you should not be in a classroom Jabed.

jabed · 10/05/2011 18:18

mrz - I am sure you are very good with SEN, far better than I. Those who are good at it should do it. It should not fall to me to teach things I dont know about. I have other skills. It wouldnt do for all teachers to feel as I do, or indeed for them all to want to be SEN teachers.

Each to his own as they say.

jabed · 10/05/2011 18:22

Tellowstone, I said I was made redundant. I didnt say whether I was pushed or jumped. In fact it was a bit of each. I taught mostly A level. The school closed its sixth form down and went to being an 11 - 16 school.

My job was on the line. As it happened I got my present post before I was officially redundant, so effectively I resigned and jumped ship. I have never regretted it with hindsight. I was gutted at having to leave my last school because I loved it ( SEN and all). But it taught me a lot about committment and how you get treated by others.

jabed · 10/05/2011 18:24

If your son develops SEN will your attitude change?

If my child developed SEN I would find him a proper school with teachers who know what they are doing. I would not leave him to the vaguenesses of mainstream schooling.

jabed · 10/05/2011 18:27

I started teaching in the mid 1980's. Inclusion was a ploicy that came in shortly after I qualified. It didnt affect me ( still doesnt) because I was teaching A level and degree level then.

In my current school we have three children with SEN and all three are taught by specialists. I neither have need to know nor need to have contact. Its never been an interest.

jabed · 10/05/2011 18:31

And shock , horror fivecandles, get over it girl!

A comment from a colleague of mine yesterday sets all in persepective - If you think I am bad , he said " Lets be honest we teach thick kids to pass GCSE's here. Thats what we are paid for".

I said " Look old chum, you cant say that. It might be true but you cannot say it"

;)

jabed · 10/05/2011 18:42

I am no caped crusader getting good exam results. Getting results isnt rocket science. It does requre some very hard decisions to be made and someone who has the tackle to be able to make and impliment those decisions.

The only thing I am doing that is so shocking here is admitting it.

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 18:59

'In my current school we have three children with SEN and all three are taught by specialists. I neither have need to know nor need to have contact. Its never been an interest.'

What, you're saying that in your school children with SEN are taught in isolation?

I'm not sure that you realize that people with SEN are people like any other people. They are not an alien species.

Saying that you do not want anything to do with them is very like saying that you do not want anything to do with people who wear glasses or people with blonde hair.

A good teacher teaches INDIVIDUALS and accepts them for who they are.

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 19:01

' Inclusion was a ploicy that came in shortly after I qualified. It didnt affect me ( still doesnt) because I was teaching A level and degree level then. '

I'm struggling to believe that this level of ignorance persists in 2011 in a TEACHER.

I also specialise in A Level. Students at A Level and degree level can have SEN too!

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 19:06

Jabed, for your interest here is a list of famous dyslexics including Einstein whom you presumably would have refused to teach

www.dyslexia.com/famous.htm

jabed · 10/05/2011 19:09

Fivecandles, instead of berrating me for my attitude ( I am old, I am getting more right wing as I age, I am not for turning), you might be better engaged helping the poor mum out who has a problem on AIBU thread ( just below this).

I can genuinely say that I have done what it takes to get exam results but I have never had to do anything like suggested on that thread ( cheat).
But your input might be valuable there. I cant say anything and I anything I did say might shock the mums.

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 19:17

TBH, I do not see what being old or even being right wing has got to do with refusing to teach kids with SEN. There is no justification for your attitude and you do not belong in the classroom.

mrz · 10/05/2011 19:20

I'm old Hmm

jabed · 10/05/2011 19:31

What, you're saying that in your school children with SEN are taught in isolation?

Not in isolation. We dont have such a unit ( my last state school did )

They are taught in the learning support dept. The have one on one tuition and all the support and resources they have need of. If you want to quibble with that, then that would need taking up with the SMT and HT at my school. That isnt a decision I make.

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 19:51

Being taught in the learning support dept is the same as being taught in isolation i.e there are 3 students in your school who are not being taught with their peers. TBH, I find this difficult to believe.

mrz · 10/05/2011 19:52

and parents are happy to pay fees for this?

EvilTwins · 10/05/2011 19:54

Jabed - do you know what SEN actually means? Do you understand that it includes an awful lot of very different things?

I don't believe that you do. You can't, if you believe that people with SEN can't do A Levels or degrees.

jabed · 10/05/2011 19:57

and parents are happy to pay fees for this?

mrz, they pay fees. They even pay additional fees for their one on one tutors.
You tell me.

fivecandles · 10/05/2011 19:57

I don't think he does Evil. That's what I find so disturbing: this lack of awareness in a teacher.