Ex Lives In Squalour With My Children

[MrMarkyMark]

This is the first time I've posted here but I have been dealing with this for a long time and need advice on what to do.
My ex was always messy. The entire time we were together I was the person who did all the cleaning and tidying. The details would make you sick but there is too much to go into now.
We split some time ago and my two kids live with her during the week and see me every second weekend (although they do come to me a couple of evenings during the week too).
However, since we sold the house and moved to separate places, her place is almost never in a fit state for human habitation. It's filthy, clothes all over the floor, bins overflowing, dog treats on the floor, week's worth of washing up piling up, and you are barely able to walk through the living room without stepping on something or tripping over something. The toilet is filthy, and there is mould in the bathroom. She never opens a window or the curtains.
She has been diagnosed with a couple of mental health conditions and I'm pretty certain she is autistic. For this reason, I have been hesitant to raise this subject as I know it will lead to a meltdown.
Despite all this, I know she loves the kids and her way of showing love is to plan as many fun days out as possible for them. The kids also love her.

I'm at the point, however, that I don't think I can let this continue. I need your advice for the next steps.

Also do an over night midweek, it can’t be hard to negotiate a later start time for school drop off once a week, you are a working parent.

You are at last resort..this is it. Here. Now.

I get you dont want them FT (& you dont, that's clear, its hard i get it) but you should be having them at least 50% of the time to protect and shield them for this to some degree.

Your children are collateral damage for your Exs mental health.

You need to step up and in.
I'd be pushing hard for 50/50 at the very minimum (right now you have nothing like 50/50) and supporting her sorting her home out.
Ideally id want a custody reverse ie she does what you do in terms of contact

You will probably need a third party to get involved in that

Your childrens primary home should be safe clean and secure. If she cant/won't provide that and you have capacity to - you must.

I’ve read your posts and it sounds to me like you want your children’s home environment to improve - as long as it doesn’t impact you.
You realistically know that your ex isn’t going to change to become housekeeper of the year.
Her working 25 hours and you working 50 and her having more income due to your child maintenance payments are red herrings.
She has the children 12 out of every 14 days, except the few evening hours you have them before them going home to sleep. She has the majority of their care and expense.
I don’t know what you are hoping for from this thread. You don’t want to have the children more, you don’t think they should help their mother care for their home. No one here can suggest a way to get your ex to comply. It sounds like she CAN’T rather than won’t maintain her home.
BTW the word is squalor.

I've just read this entire post and there are a few things you have mentioned that I don't understand;

• Your ex pushed you into the fridge-freezer in anger due to you moving parcells off the oven so that you could cook.
• If she is confronted about things her meltdowns are inevitable which subsequently cause her to resort to threats of self harm.
• She has been diagnosed with several mental disorders, with a possibility of more undiagnosed disorders currently roaming untreated.
• You frequently state that you want to keep things friendly with her so as not to jeopardise your co-parenting relationship for the sake of the kids.

There are so many highly questionable things that you have mentioned, that it is difficult for me to focus on just one thing alone, but I will try and give you advice based on my experience.
As a single mother to four, I have met with some very difficult challenges over the years. What I have taken from some of them is that when faced with seemingly impossible situations, you have to confront things head on and stand firm for what you believe in.
Much like your ex's unchangeable hoarding behaviour - I see that you are clinging onto every reason why you believe you can't do anything to make a change for your kids, and you won't let go of these excuses, which is what they are.
As a parent, you should be doing everything in your power to ensure that your kids have the best possible upbringing you can deliver - and your parenting attitude should be god help anyone who stands in the way of this, because how they are brought up gives your kids the building blocks they need to become well rounded human beings for the rest of their lives.
You can change their lives overnight, if you wanted to by doing the following;

• don't allow your ex's mental instability to dictate and control how you parent your children.
• tell the kids they now live with you, and move them in. Explain they can see their mother as and when they wish to, but their main residence is now with you.
• immediately reduce your house at work so that you can be at home for your youngest. Change the children's government benefits to your name.
• claim benefits until you find another job if your employer won't accomodate your reduced hours.
• your ex is not your child, therefore she is not your problem - there is help out there for her aside from her family - intricately designed to support her complex needs.

Allowing your kids to remain living as they are is mentally damaging for them - to not challenge someone due to their mental instability shows them that this is acceptable behaviour, on both sides of the coin.

Instead of giving them the tools to be able to healthily engage and work through mentally challenging situations in life, you are actively demonstrating that living as an adult and bringing up children without any understanding of basic human needs, like cleanliness and hygiene, is acceptable because psychological disorders are present! You are also giving them real-life examples of how acceptible it is to allow someone to continue to impose this abuse and neglect of basic human needs not just on themselves but also on children! And, you are teaching them it is perfectly acceptable to spend your life walking on egg shells around a ticking time bomb who can become violent at any given moment.

As adults, your children were already highly likely to develop mental disorders due to the predisposed genetic link to their mother's disorders. This likeliness will be doubled down by the added environmental factors they have witnessed by their mentors - their parents.
Thes kids stand very little chance of leading healthy lives as well rounded adults - any relationships they form will be laced by control and neglect, and it would be surprising if they will know how to regulate their emotions when faced with difficult life challenges, let alone how they deal with minor disagreements along the way. But, that's OK because as you have said several times in your copy/paste responses, you are superior to your ex as you work more hours than she does, despite her doing the lions share of housing your kids!

Anyway, who are we to advise? keep things as they are, the damage is already done. Us mums don't care, we just dish out advice because we have nothing better to do. And me? i'm no exception, I couldn't care less, despite my absolute novel of advice to you based on my 25 years of parental experience - pay no attention to it!
You do you!

There are 2 slightly different issues here about the state of the house. Mess is 1 thing and unhygienic/lack of cleaning is another. My main concern would be the lack of cleaning and tidying up waste, leading to flies laying eggs and so forth. This is not a suitable environment for anyone to be living in - particularly children.
Whilst I accept your ex has some diagnoses, she is prioritising being fun mum over basic household chores and your children will be suffering. She is not suitable to be the main resident parent, she is neglecting the children and her emotional outbursts/abuse if she is challenged is also if concern.
Sadly, you have tried to maintain the relationship with your ex, so your children have parents having an amicable relationship but it's not working. You have to put your children first by having them live with you the majority of the time. Their mum can then be the fun mum she wants to be and potentially get help with managing her conditions and the environment she lives in.
You are living in fear of her reactions, so she is continuing to abuse you, and to a degree, the children.
If it has to get to court, then it does. You may have to get SS involved, but this is definitely a safeguarding situation. Possibly get young carers referral made through the school/GP, so they can get support there.
FWIW, I have my own severe disability and children, so can understand how hard these situations can be. If I did split with my DH, he would likely have to have them much of the time because I simply couldn't manage to care for them properly. I have a cleaner and do the bulk of the washing/tidying. Am also teaching and encouraging the children to be involved with household chores, so they can learn to look after themselves in the long term....
I wish you good luck with a very complex situation.

I wonder if your children asking their mum to help them clean up would less triggering than a cleaner? 13 and 15 year olds are starting to be independent and I’d have thought helping their mum run the house, to a small degree would be beneficial to everyone. Aren’t they embarrassed when friends come over? As others have said, maybe you need to do 50/50?

Why isn’t ex wife medicated? Did you say one child has autism -has that been diagnosed or someone’s assumption?
Children can change their own beds and hand over to Dm as she does wash. You say you wash their clothes. Can you ensure they take lots of fruit,cheese etc so their diet isn’t too bad.
If the children keep their own bedrooms clean and you ensure they and their clothes are clean I would let it run.

In your council area you may be able to make a referral for a service usually called things like "early help" or "family hub". You can ask to be anonymous. It sounds as though your ex won't comply with their recommendations or take their help, but it would be best for all if social services (and ideally the school) know about the kids' home situation, including unsanitary conditions and witnessing physical/emotional abuse. They are there to help and can fast-track mental health referrals etc. they won't take the kids or anything like that, the bar for drastic action is really high. If I were you I would also take or ask the kids to take photos and videos of the living conditions. It sounds like the best thing is that they live with you more/full time and there may come a time when you need evidence to back up what you say.

I think it's commendable that you want to have a good relationship with the kids' mum but she abused you for years, you don't owe her anything - but you do owe it to your kids for them to be in the best environment possible for their welfare. It sounds as though your ex will never keep the place clean because she either can't or won't. The only option there is to hire a cleaner and pay for it yourself (frame it as you want to make your ex's life less stressful or whatever) but be prepared to pay a lot at the start for a tidying/deep cleaning service. You've said yourself you've tried to speak to her and she hasn't taken kindly to it so you've already tried that approach

Being difficult is a cop out. Of course it’s difficult but plenty of single parents manage full time work and having children full time…. It’s difficult but doable

Maybe offer to go round and help sort the house out?

You need to take the kids full time while she sorts herself out. If her mental health is that fragile, she needs additional support. But the kids need to be removed from the situation, so all she needs to focus on is herself. Yes, it may tip her into some sort of breakdown, but that's not your fault, it's not the kids fault, it's just reality, and at least the children will be protected.

Read the whole thread. It's past this point. People with such issues do not take kindly to offers of help believe me.

There are businesses that do clear outs for hoarders/people with mental health issues. I understand that you don't think she thinks she needs help, but a one off big clean will make things more manageable for everyone.

It's so hard to know where to start when things get that bad and it's completely reasonable for you to push for this.

And I'm sorry, but leaving your children with someone who is physically abusive and brings them up in squalid conditions is down to you deciding that's acceptable.

Change jobs. The money you'll save on maintenance if you have your children will go towards improving their lives. She needs help and support for her issues, your children need help and support from the parent who is stable.

Your ex has an awful lot on her plate as she has to make up for your lack of parenting. If youre concerned about your DCs living conditions you should be doing 50/50. You are letting them down. I appreciate that ex doesn't seem to want help right now, but maybe when she has more time to breathe and is less overwhelmed she may become more ontop of things.

Really? How many divorced MNetters would want their ex even in their home, let alone cleaning or tiding it? If their ex offered to pay for a cleaner, might they just think 'bastard' and throw a few more dog biscuits on the floor?

I do find it a bit jarring OP that you say that because your child has problems at school and you work full time, having them more often would be “difficult”.

That’s parenting I’m afraid, it’s not easy to parent children let alone those with SEN but it’s no easier for your ex than you.

Nobody suggested it as they thought it would be easy. They did so as you say your children live “in squalor” with your ex who has serious mental health issues and a history of emotional and physical abuse.

You can’t just leave things because you don’t like confrontation and know that stepping up will be more “difficult” than your current status quo.

Pay for a professional organiser, then pay for the house to be cleaned every week.

Ok, this had been put to bed so many times already on this thread. You can't just pay for a cleaner to go to someone else's home..in the real world can you actually imagine somebody saying oh thanks, I mean come on.
People.get horribly defensive about things like this.
So many deeply naive people on here who think there is such a lovely simple solution to things. It runs alot deeper, it's really not that simple.

Agreed.... some people really do inhabit uncomplicated worlds if they think these things are so easily solved

I didn't say it was lovely and simple, I said it was a start. It could have been worth trying.

FWIW I have organised (and occasionally paid for) both cleaners and domicilliary care for my ex. I've also sorted food deliveries, home insurance, problems with the council, and numerous other things. I've done that for friends, actually, too, from time to time. It's the sort of thing you end up doing when someone can't do it themselves, for whatever reason. It is possible to help others, in a practical and nonjudgmental way, I promise, even people you've split up with or who have really difficult personalities.

But alot of the time it isn't.
And this sounds very much like one of those times like he has said.

I agree coparenting amicably is important, but not living in an environment that is dangerous/hazardous to health is even more so.

I maintain some problems can be solved. Just because you can't do everything, doesn't mean you shouldn't do anything.

It is possible to make things a little better. And better is better.

(I learned this through living in many highly complex and challenging life situations. Trust me, we can always improve things. Even if you're quadriplegic and demented, there's better and worse ways to experience those terrible things, and it's always worth trying.)

OP, it is worth trying to improve things. Coming here and posting was worth doing. Don't feel that because the situation is so complicated and you can't fix the root cause, that it's impossible to get to any kind of better situation. Small good things really do matter to your children and each small thing you make better will help them grow. You can do this.

You're correct, but if she refuses that option he needs to report her to social services for not providing the most basic care for their children. Perhaps with that being the only other option she might have to put her defensiveness to one side.

Sounds like she just has different standards to you.
My washing builds up too
If your kids are safe and happy an untidy home doesn't matter