What's an appropriate holiday for a SAHM?

[NoKissKissNoBangBang]

Hi All,

Looking for opinions & perspective. Wife has said she'd like to go on holiday with her best mate for a week. We have two children and I have no problem looking after them for a week. As a SAHM I think she fully deserves a week off. Problem is, the best friend is single (both in their late 30's) and they want to go to a party island (not decided but Tenerife, Majorca, Ibiza, Crete have all been mentioned). The best friend likes living the single life (but is always looking out for a boyfriend) and meeting guys, so basically the best friend wants a "wing woman" to go away with. They both like a drink, scratch that, when the opportunity arises they like to get legless.

Is it fair that I am uncomfortable with my wife being in that environment for a full week with a friend who is likely to want to go out to bars and clubs to meet guys most (if not every) night with the inevitable drink fuelled shenanigans that would follow?

Before the inevitable "don't you trust your wife question", I do, to an extent, but an extended stay in this environment watching a single friend do what she wants is a worry.

So, what do you think?

The problem is, though (all you who say they'd not be happy for a DP to do this) that you cannot stop him/her. You can have the 'talk' about what worries you, but to suggest that you can actively stop them - not on.

As I said upthread - my DH didn't want me to take a week away from the family (as a SAHM) to have a holiday by myself. He is now an Ex. And I can go and do whatever I want.

BTW - my marriage ended on the day my DH told me that I couldn't take a week to 'holiday' at a language course.
Are you suggesting that a man forbidding you from doing an educational course, is just the same as one expressing discomfort (no mention of his trying to prevent her from going, just expressing his concern) about his wife going on a drinking, singles style holiday ?

Is this your wife's interpretation of the situation, or yours? Because you sound as if you disapprove of the friend (for her singleness? for the fact that she's up for a boyfriend? for the fact she likes 'meeting guys? for her drinking?) Because you seem to be very carefully not accepting that this, presumably, is the holiday your wife actually wants.

This is a very VERY good point.

OP why exactly are you concerned about this? Is it because you think your wife will sleep with another man, kiss someone, cheat on you, or drink too much ?

Any of the above she has control over. She can ‘choose’ to sleep with someone kiss someone or do any type of sexual fantasy with someone, simply by being in that emvironmwnt doesn’t mean she has no choice. She can choose to do any of the above whilst you’re at work or when she goes to her yoga class. It’s a choice! And that’s the key, just because she can, in any situation, doesn’t mean she will!! It is all about trust... you either trust her or you don’t, if they go to Bognor on a knitting convention she could ‘choose’ to cheat just as easily as in Benidorm.

So... every island in the sun is a rampant party destination? Bollocks.
I been to some of the ones you’ve mentioned and there were plenty of families/couples/pensioners there.
You disapprove of the friend and as that’s her best mate that is a bad idea. I bet the reality of their week away is a bit more tame than you are selling it as!

Responding to a couple of points:

At no point have I ever said she would need my permission or that I would stop her, I would not do either of those things, some posters have put 2+2 together and come up with 127.

I do not dissaprove of her friend, she's very likeable, they are just at different stages of their lives.

They have not been away on holiday together before and I believe the type of destination was a joint decision, it wasn't forced on my wife.

As I have mentioned several times, but some posters seem to have trouble comprehending, her being a SAHM is for context so you guys understand the reality of her daily life which I completely appreciate her for and which is why she doesn't need to convince me why she should be able to go on holiday.

I agree that all those destinations have some nice sedate areas, I just know that they are not the areas they are planning on going to.

I have no specific concern that she would get up to anything with a member of the opposite sex, and agree she could do this pretty much any time she chose, I'm just uncomfortable with her being in that environment.

I didn't post to be told how I feel is wrong or how that makes me villain of the week, I was simply seeking opinion on whether how I feel would be similar to others under the circumstances.

It would appear that a number of posters subscribe to the view that she can do whatever she wants (ultimately she can of course) and I have no right to voice any concerns. Would your reaction be the same if I was doing something that my wife didn't like but just ignored her feelings and carried on without any consideration to her or told her she had no right to voice her feelings as I'm my own man and not her possession and that in having those feelings she defined herself as a possessive controlling twat (posters words, not mine)?

her being a SAHM is for context so you guys understand the reality of her daily life which I completely appreciate her for and which is why she doesn't need to convince me why she should be able to go on holiday.

I do comprehend this, thanks anyway.

She doesn't need to convince you why she should be able to go on holiday regardless of what her normal day-to-day life entails.

I have no specific concern that she would get up to anything with a member of the opposite sex, and agree she could do this pretty much any time she chose, I'm just uncomfortable with her being in that environment.

So what actually made you post this? What is actually making you so obviously feel uneasy? You acknowledge this is her choice of destination and travel companion, and that she has the right to go on the type of holiday she wants, you say don't think she is going to be unfaithful and acknowledge that she could, in fact, be unfaithful while at home so what is actually at issue here?

@TomRavenscroft I'm pleased you finally get it and note you haven't answered my final point which is linked to your comment of "She doesn't need to convince you why she should be able to go on holiday regardless of what her normal day-to-day life entails." Would you equally defend my rights to do whatever I wanted with impunity?

@LucyGayheart Can't put my finger on anything specific, just don't like the thought of her being in that environment for a week, makes me uncomfortable.

@LucyGayheart and I was interested in other people's opinions of how they would feel in a similar situation.

But, OP, you are the one implicitly suggesting she shouldn't go, or shouldn't want to go, because you feel 'uncomfortable' with 'that environment'?

And I'm all for spouses considering one another's feelings when it comes to deciding on a course of action, but if my husband suggested he wasn't happy with me taking a particular kind of holiday, I'd want specific reasons, rather than foot-shuffling and non-specific mutterings of how it made him feel 'uncomfortable' that I was spending a week drinking with a friend in a 'party' environment.

And if I thought he'd gone on the internet to solicit for back-up of his view that I was meditating an 'inappropriate' holiday, rather than talking specifically to me about his apprehensions, I'd be deeply unimpressed.

It just sounds to me as if, from what you say, that you have very settled and rather old-fashioned/ageist ideas about 'life stages', and that a married woman and mother, in your view, shouldn't want to go off drinking with her single friend to a 'party island', because that's an 'earlier life stage' in your eyes -- but your wife doesn't have to agree with that, does she? Maybe she doesn't see dancing on tables as something which is forever debarred for SAHMs in their late 30s?

Plus, it also sounds as though you don't trust your wife, but you aren't willing to come out and say so, on here, or, presumably to her face...?

@LucyGayheart I'm not suggesting she shouldn't go or shouldn't want to go, this is your interpretation of what I've said, not what I've actually said. What I'm actually asking is how would other people feel in this situation. Specifically, how would you feel if your OH said this was his plan? I expect you to say you'd be perfectly happy :-)

As for specific reasons, how about I don't like the thought of my wife fending off drunk blokes trying to score and potentially being in an awkward situation if her friend dissappears with some guy or invites guy (s) back to their apartment where she is still fending off advances.

Maybe I am a little old fashioned and no she absolutely does not have to agree with me.

Your comment about soliciting comments, and i dont mean to sound rude, is a bit rich considering this forum is full of people soliciting views on the actions of dh/dw/dp/dd/ds/mil etc etc it's the fabric on which this site is built.

OP I'm with you on this. I also question the number of people on here claiming that they'd be unconcerned in a similar situation.

I think it's rubbish frankly and they've just taken a dislike to you because you used the phrase "sham".

@findingmyfeet12 lol, and yet it's an acronym this site coined! And one that I used perfectly innocently to help explain my wife's daily life.

My dh as I have an understanding about what we both feel is appropriate and comfortable.
It is an agreement we made years ago and so I understand that you might feel compromised if this is also something you have discussed and agreed on.
Do you go on boys nights out/weekends or boys holidays?

Have you told her you are uncomfortable? I get the impression you feel she will ignore you or has done already.

I am all for holidays and breaks with friends but not at the expense of the love and security of my marriage.
Grubby clubs and bars is not somewhere I would want someone I iced deeply to be either. Odd choice for a ‘relaxing’ holiday.!

Iced - loved

I am interested to know also if you dw is a party animal by nature? Or do you feel she is being less/influenced by her friend. Done friends are toxic for this reason and I don’t think op is completely crazy for thinking through why his wife and therefore their marriage might be compromised or damaged.
I have been at the other end of this dynamic and it ended badly

Lead
Some

I would never let my husband do that! Especially as a twosome so he would be wingman. I trust him completely but I do not trust other people

they've just taken a dislike to you because you used the phrase "sham"

It's SAHM -- a 'sham' is something entirely different. Unless someone is pretending not to work outside the home, but secretly has an job. And, given that a large number of members of Mn are themselves SAHMs, it would be rather odd if the OP's use of the term constituted a reason for 'dislike'.

People are simply helping the OP unpick thinking that he admits himself is somewhat confused, and his title 'What's an appropriate holiday for a SAHM?' probably got people clicking because they wondered what on earth he meant, or whether there was some kind of 'rule'. I personally clicked on it because I thought it was going to focus on what kind of holiday would give someone who does the lion's share of childcare, cooking and housework the best break.

And it seems the OP's wife has decided it's a week away on a party island with her best friend. But the OP doesn't like this, and seems unable to fully express why not.

Specifically, how would you feel if your OH said this was his plan? I expect you to say you'd be perfectly happy :-)

Well, yes, if he wanted. It would be only fair seeing as I (fortysomething WOHM, with a small child) recently spent a week in a US city drinking in raucous dive bars with a male friend who can really put it awa.y It was brilliant, we did not get to bed before 5 am any night, and I don't think I was entirely sober the entire time.

how about I don't like the thought of my wife fending off drunk blokes trying to score and potentially being in an awkward situation if her friend dissappears with some guy or invites guy (s) back to their apartment where she is still fending off advances.

Your wife appears to think she'll be perfectly able to cope. I was able to on my US trip -- my friend didn't have to defend my virtue at all, though he got propositioned a bit. Have you said this to her?

"Sham" was my phone autocorrecting me. I didn't bother mentioning it as I assumed it might be obvious...

I don't know exactly why I wouldn't want my dh going on this type of holiday - I just know that I wouldn't like it.

Character assassinations are par for the course here on mn though.

As for specific reasons, how about I don't like the thought of my wife fending off drunk blokes trying to score and potentially being in an awkward situation if her friend dissappears with some guy or invites guy (s) back to their apartment where she is still fending off advances.

Surely OP men could come on to your wife in any situation at home, if she goes to the pub or a bar with friends on a Saturday night she might well have to fend off drunk blokes trying to score and be put in an awkward situation similar to the one you're describing. Your wife is a grown woman, if he friend "ditches" her for a man one night I would assume she is more than capable of getting a taxi/walking back to their hotel. Alternatively, if this woman chooses to bring a guy/multiple guys back to their hotel (lets ignore the obvious question of why this guy would be persistently trying to shagg your wife to the point she would have to fend him off when hes already going to shagg her friend) your wife is perfectly within her rights to say "I don't want him here, this makes me uncomfortable please go back to his hotel." However as you say this woman is your wife's best friend I doubt she would put her in that kind of situation and make her feel uncomfortable out of respect for her friend. This seems more like you're looking to find other people to side with you so that you can go back to your wife and say "see I told it was a bad idea and your friend is a bad influence everyone on the internet agrees with me." When you haven't gotten the response you wanted you have done what every other entitled male does when proven wrong which is get defensive, skirt around the entire issue and backtrack on what you originally said by saying things like "I didn't say that stop putting words in my mouth."

OP, do you mean the point 'Would your reaction be the same if I was doing something that my wife didn't like but just ignored her feelings and carried on without any consideration to her or told her she had no right to voice her feelings'?

It would depend on what you were doing. If it was the same situation as you describe here, then yes. I'd never dream of trying to tell my (male) DP that he couldn't go away with a single male friend, to a 'party island' or anywhere else.

Also N.b. Most people trust their partners. I would be no more uncomfortable with my DP going to Ibiza than I would if he went to bloody wales. It is a holiday and he is an adult, who am I to tell him he can't go because I feel "uncomfortable" that other women might try to chat him up.

@1474652148 thank you for the comments. She is gregarious by nature (and I always knew this) but this is a new situation, she has stayed away with the same friend for the a night or two many times before (usually monthly) and has been away with a group of female friends for a week to a more sedate UK location/activity, so I have zero concerns about her going away, it's just this choice of location.

I fairly regularly go away with my best mate but always in the UK and certainly not this type of environment. Very occasionally I'll have a night out in the pub with work colleagues and twice in the last two years this has been an overnight stay in a Hotel.

I've not raised it with her yet as I didnt want to come over as overbearing before I'd properly considered if my thoughts were fair/warranted or not.

Some posters (such as yourself) have helped me shape my thoughts, others have been agressive and somewhat rude in their responses.