Gender Critical in Ireland Part 3

[VaddaABeetch]

I’m watching RTE news. They mentioned the Garda representatives organisation are concerned about Gender Identity in the workplace. It’s been brought in without consultation & without training.

the Garda Commissioner has said that Garda may be disciplined for misgendering.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I have a feeling he isn't on the radio any more - his clear-eyed view might have become uncomfortable for them. And his policy of interviewing people rather than middle class spokesmen for the people.

Particularly poor, mentally ill, criminal, marginalised people.

@DeanVolecapeAKAelderberry thank you, listening to it now
I think things will get worse ... I'm losing hope. I'm appalled by women who actually don't see anything wrong with this

Just listened to that episode and it's made me so sad and angry. everyone who says "oh self id has been in Ireland since 2015 and its all fine " should listen to it. Like my OH said, anyone who is advocating for this isn't actually affected by it like these poor women are

Nice right-on middle-class genderist women (RTÉ is full of them) remind me of the well-meaning nuns who ran the homes and the laundries. Genuinely believing in their ideologies, and that there is a Truth more important than the flawed, suffering human beings in front of them.

And yes, I know those nuns went through a horrendous foundation process themselves, and that some of them tried to help and feel awful about what happened. But righteousness is a dangerous mindset.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/crime/barbie-kardashian-under-garda-investigation-29820564
This was just posted on the feminism board. By allowing the farce that is self id here to continue, it gives certain males continued easy and continued access to females they can abuse.

It's all depressingly circular. And ironic. The responses from trans rights sometimes seemed contradictory.
For example -
What's wrong with drag Queens like Flo Job reading stories to toddlers?

And in the next breath -
Priests and vicars wear frocks. Snigger.

Some days it feels like I'm living in an alternative universe, where I have no understanding of almost anything. There is no logic, no justice, no honour, no respect....nothing. As always, the most affected will be the most vulnerable women and children, and nobody will care. The politicians will continue to live in their sheltered world, disconnected from reality, virtue-signalling and taking "big decisions" for the good of the masses. And they'll have the "Nice right-on middle-class genderist women" to applaud them.

I hope the prison officers sue the state for making their workplace unsafe.

Hear hear. Would shine plenty of sunlight on what is going on too.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2023/05/06/leo-varadkar-hate-speech-laws-ireland/
I wish Irish mainstream media would report on these issues.

Hmm. It's quite revealing that Paul Murphy and Boyd Barrett voted against this bill.
PBP may be a load of sexist morons . But they have enough cop on to know this law will be used against people like them too.
So they voted with the Healy Raes. How ironic.

How ironic that SF supported this Bill. It isn't that long ago that the voices of prominent SF politicians were considered too offensive to be played on radio or TV. Their voices were dubbed over with the voices of actors.
You would have to wonder why they don't see the similarities with this Bill.
Its also worth remembering that the attempt to deprive SF of publicity backfired, as it heightened the aura of martyrdom surrounding them.
🤔. Perhaps there is a lesson to be learned from that, but if you are so confident in your righteousness that you disregard 70% of feedback from public consultations, then there appears to be an unwillingness to learn anything at all.

So true @MaeveofConnaught.
What's to stop some opponent of SF claiming they feel threatened by talk of a united Ireland?

Plenty of SF haters would find 'hate speech ' quite handy come to think of it. Mary McAleese said the atmosphere in rte was poisonous when she worked there in the 80s. Doubt its changed too much.

I find the whole notion of hate speech to be very dangerous, TBH.
I may utterly object and disagree with what someone is saying, but for goodness sake, I am an adult, so I can disregard it.

I will disagree with them in a calm way without relying on "oooh...hatespeech" as a deterrent.
No minds are ever changed by threats... only by dialogue & personal experience.
Of all the countries in the world we should know that.

Prosecute people for incitement, yes .... e.g. "lets go burn out the (Travellers/ gays/ Muslims/ women's group/ Nigerians/ Proddies... insert hate group of choice here)".

But while I will disagree with racist language about out-groups it doesnt reach the threshold of a crime.

Its a continuation re-emergence of paternalistic thinking ; the State knows best.

Actually, thinking about that, the notion of hate speech- it really is quite paternalistic isn't it?
I completely get that it is very very unpleasant and sometimes frightening to be the target.

I have worked in enough countries around the world- including working in London during the IRA's campaign. I've had people assume that I was Catholic, stupid, uneducated, lazy, workshy, backwards and a drunkard.

I've been interviewed by police in London - someone objected to my shopping in Waitrose with an Irish accent.

None of that reached the threshold of being a crime.

I'm not quite articulating my thoughts here correctly- maybe someone can help me out?
Its seems like we should be preventing and treating the problem of lack of tolerance, instead of sticking on a plaster of "hate speech" to frighten people into compliance.

It is great to see that this happened, and that it got some media coverage though not enough and not from the national broadcaster of course.

https://twitter.com/Irish_WL/status/1654494750261616646

https://twitter.com/womensspaceire/status/1654779455892598786

Good on Michael McDowell.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/michael-mcdowell-writes-to-justice-minister-simon-harris-over-inclusion-of-transgender-in-new-hate-speech-laws/a266464446.html

Be very interesting to see what Simon's response is.

It is great to see, but so few in the Seanad seem to be speaking out. Sharon Keogan and Ronan Mullen are questioning it too.

His full letter here
twitter.com/senatormcdowell/status/1656315507429998592?s=46&t=n3zdqIaFvPOAlTgp5jGVgA

The fact there is so few of them opposed doesn't bode well does it. It has echoes of the gra being passed I think, with how it's being pushed through. Though granted there is more publicity about this.

https://corinnacohn.substack.com/p/smuggling-hormones-to-irish-youth

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/heather-humphreys-and-roderic-ogorman-clash-on-gender-law-for-under-16s/a192434084.html

The headline is misleading. Humphreys says there are no plans to change anything for under-16s and research is ongoing, but O'Gorman is working on things behind the scenes.

It is hard to feel upbeat about the situation here when a heavily funded lobby group is looking at how to get a doctor who has been barred in the UK getting drugs to children in Ireland; and two government ministers don't seem to know which of their positions is actually policy. What a shit show we're in.

Today at 12 is the last date to submit opposition to this referendum.

Please read the explanation below

https://gript.ie/why-you-should-reply-to-the-public-consultation-on-equality/

I agree with the article, it's just a sneaky way to include gender in our constitution, which is wholly unnecessary.

I suppose even if the referendum on gender equality goes ahead (which unfortunately I think it will), I actually think it will be a good opportunity for us to bring up the topic in real life, and in the media - what is gender? what is the difference between sex and gender, and why does it matter? etc. The other side will have to talk about it if they want the referendum to be carried, they will actually have to answer questions and not ignore them.

Also a good opportunity to bring up the gender recognition act, as many people are still unaware that this crap is the law already in Ireland.

Hi all, there's another thread on this on the Feminism, Gender and Womens rights forum which includes suggestions/templates for objections in case you're having a busy day and dont have time to write your own.