Gender critical in Ireland

[Muppetryofthepenis]

Just wondering if there are many others out there. Was reading a political pamphlet and it was going on about self ID and how important it is. I just don't agree and think it's so damaging to change the definition of what a woman is. And the definition of a man too, I guess. Sex based rights are under threat in Ireland. Fed up with all the nonsense. Wondering what other Irish mumsnetters think.

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In truth it's not really talked about here the same as it is being discussed in the UK because they are trying to avoid the legislation coming in so politicians are being forced to talk about it. We are far beyond that, because Self ID is already the law here so the government never had to justify it to the public, they didn't ask if we were ok with it.
However it is already a problem here, as we have male sex offenders in Limerick women's prison. But the media don't report on it.

I don't have kids so I'm not sure how prevalent it is amongst teenagers here, I would think it's more kids that spend a lot of time on social media etc. that get sucked into it. I see it like other manifestations of distress, like self harm and eating disorders, only this is being endorsed by the government and media.

I have heard that it is more common with children for example with autism, as they may be more likely to think that if they don't like stereotypically 'girl' things then that must mean they are boys. However, many of these young people are just confused about their sexuality, or in the case of young girls, they may be trying to avoid womanhood, especially if they have seen pornography and think that is what women are supposed to be.

The point I suppose is that we as a society should not be waiting for the worst to happen - Self ID is problematic for women and girls, and the trend for young people to want surgery and hormones is very harmful.

I'm Irish living in the UK. Where do I start?
I'll just give one isolated example of something that happened recently..
Schools here brought in a drag queen to talk to kids aged 4-11 in primary school about trans people, sexuality, gender etc. The drag queen goes by the name of flowjob and demonstrates sex acts on their Instagram account for anyone to see, children included because kids nowadays have social media and the profile is public.
The school did not tell parents ahead of the visit from the drag queen that she would be attending and the parents had to hear from their children about it.

Good luck being sad about this. I guarantee it's unfortunately going to get a lot worse

I have name changed this is shocking...this has been coming about for a long time.. When my girls were born I was berated by some friends for dressing them in all pink, buying them lots of doll & generally loving all the girliness that came with my little bundles... They wanted to raise "strong girls" & would only dress their girls in grey, navy, blue or white, nothing frilly or girly whatsoever... Only unisex toys, no pink at all... They mocked me raising "princesses"...
They proudly brought their girls to fancy dress in spiderman or batman costumes & eyerolled at my Cinderellas.. My girls are now 7 & 10 still ridiculously girly & I wouldn't have it any other way... This thread has been an absolute eye-opener... Girls should be allowed be who they want & if that's a Disney princess so be it... Sorry if I'm coming accross as uneducated on the issues facing us women, I've alot of reading up to do...

@Commentqueen yeah I often dress my girl pretty girly too and in 'girly' costumes. She's too young to pick her clothes yet.
If when she's older, she wants to dress differently and even stereotypically more boyish, I'll try my best to be open minded and understanding. I just hope that it will be coming from her though and not external influences like from a drag queen that came to the school and convinced her that maybe she is a boy in the wrong body 🫣

That's what bugs me about this whole movement - it's totally regressive. Who cares if a boy wants to wear stereotypically girly clothes or visa versa, it doesn't change who they are, they may just be gender non conforming children and so what? In the 80's dressing androgynously was cool, men like David Bowie wearing make up was fashionable. They didn't claim that it made them women somehow!
This ideology is not progressive or kind, it's dangerous. Children should not be put on hormones or a path to surgery before they are truly able to consent or to understand the long term consequences of these. Many of these children if left alone will grow up to be happy healthy gay adults.

This is what happens when schools outsource this stuff to companies or groups that have an agenda. The schools think they are saving time and money by not having to develop a curriculum, but then they are not fully able to scrutinise what is being taught. Many of these groups have no qualifications to teach, other than being trans or non-binary people themselves, and some of the stuff they are teaching about is very age inappropriate.

@Roseglen84 yeah that's exactly it.

Another thing that bothers me is how quickly legislation in Ireland was 'updated' to facilitate this ideology. So along with Self ID law being passed, our Equality Legislation now refers to gender rather than sex as the protected characteristic. This completely undermines women and girls needs, we are discriminated on the basis of our biological sex, not our gender - and as you can be whatever gender you choose, it's basically meaningless.

Same with the rushing in of new hate crime legislation, looks fine and dandy on the surface, but if you read into it, again sex is not mentioned, but rather gender. This doesn't protect women explicitly.

It's like the gay conversion therapy law that are trying to be pushed in the UK - it is not what it seems. If you read up on it, a therapist exploring the reasons for a child suffering from gender dysphoria may be prohibited by this legislation - you are supposed to affirm only, which is such a dangerous thing to do.

Could you imagine if for example with anorexia, or some other body dysmorphia, if the therapist could only affirm the distorted thoughts of the patient - yes, yes, yes you're too fat keep starving yourself. It's madness.

Why don't they want to find out why so many children are suddenly seeking to change their gender. Why don't they want that explored?

This is really good website for people who want to read more -

womensspaceireland.ie/

It's usually hard to find stuff that's specific to Ireland.

I’d also suggest looking at The Countess website. Issues are detailed & made simple

Yes, Laoise is very good I have watched some of her webchats.

I really hope we can mobilise some sort of resistance in the next few months/ year or two before the next general election about this issue. I know it's going to be a long fight, but it's frustrating that we have so far to go.

In my kids secondary school this year they had people come in talking about gender, top surgery etc. I emailed the school to get the stuff being taught. Talk about regressive nonsense. I emailed my objections to the regressive, sexist, homopobhic nature of the content. I also noted that there was no mention of detransitioners and also the brutality of top and bottom surgery. I told them my mothers generation had to leave employment on marriage and how this ideology affects womens rights. They noted my objections. I hope next year, especially after liveline peaked people, that there will be more objections.

FFS, that's ridiculous. They noted your objections, how nice of them. Did nobody in the school veto this stuff? I can't quite believe that we are in a situation where children are being exposed to this stuff, by sanction of their school and their government. Talk about being failed by the grow ups.

And we are the crazy ones - for not wanting children to be unnecessarily medicated? I despair.

When reality bites and people wake up to what is happening under their noses, I'm sure there will be a 'lessons will be learned' inquiry, like all the other bullshit inquiries that go nowhere.

I'm so angry for the children being co-opted into this shit.

I don't want my kids exposed to any of this, our generation grew up complete innocent of this & are fine.. None of my peers are homophobic & absolutely sympathise with the thoughts of anyone genuinely transitioning... It's great people can now come out as gay freely & be accepted fully in society but this gender agenda is terrifying...
As I mentioned upthread my girls are young & we haven't come accross any of this yet.. Is it more atypical to certain schools? I know some of the educate togethers are more liberal... Are the church run schools or gaelscoileanna also supporting this?

Can only hope this new state sponsored orthodoxy makes kids roll their eyes as much as the old one did.

I do think that will happen in the next few years, the problem is - how much damage will be done in the meantime? How many young people will damage their bodies in the name of this?

Not to mention laws have already been changed to pander to this ideology. Long after it has stopped being cool, there will still be opportunists taking advantage of these bad laws.

It could well be that trans will just quietly drop off the teen radar. We don't hear much about bulimia or 'cutting ' these days.

One of my adult kids said ' non binary is the new Emo ' . Well non binary is safe enough , aren't we nearly all non binary one way or another? It's when they go down the rabbit hole you have to worry.

It's very depressing that schools can't see the safeguarding issues. I've been thinking about giving a copy of Trans by Helen Joyce to our local secondary. Have to be careful though. Choose the right teacher.

You don't hear about bulimia because by all accounts bulimia has been replaced by transgender.

Each generation of girls has reacted to reaching sexual maturity in a patriarchical, sex obsessed, rape apologist, pornified culture in their own way but this to me is clear proof of the damage that is being done

Your post is confusing. How are you avoiding these issues - they are everywhere in Ireland? (Take the recent Liveline / Pride furore, for example).

I also think you've conflated a load of issues, eg mentioning homophobia & transitioning (not related at all)

Regarding the schools, thankfully the gender ideology hasn't, broadly permeated there - certainly not primary schools, while secondary schools tend to deal quite practically & pragmatically with situations where they arise. Quite different to some of the UK school situations, especially where Stonewall has become involved.

I'm afraid that anyone who hasn't come across it in secondary schools yet, will soon. It's very much here. I obviously can't go into a lot of detail on how I know but I work in education, and take it from me, I know.

Saw on twitter that a Government Minister has a trans identified child. Anyone know who that is? Or if that's true?

Surely that child is entitled to their privacy?

Tricky. But it is said a 'trans child is like a vegan cat ; we all know who is making the decisions'.

It would worry me if this Minister was in a position with authority over Health , Education or some related department.