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Original poster

Do you think the NHS will really fire all unvaccinated staff?

333 replies

IncompleteSenten · 20/01/2022 10:39

I just can't bring myself to believe that will happen. Surely it must be bully boy tactics and at the last minute they'll back down.

The NHS can barely cope now. How the hell is it going to cope with, what? 80,000-100,00 fewer staff?

OP posts:
WouldIBeATwat · 20/01/2022 19:54

@llanfair11

I think there will either be a load of exceptions introduced or the date will be moved.

March 31st is a few weeks before local elections and there is no way the Tories will want any more staff shortages in the NHS before then.

There won’t be more exemptions because it would open the floodgates for legal claims from others who would have been exempt.
Elsiebear90 · 20/01/2022 20:14

I’m allowed to voice an opinion on it.

Elsiebear90 · 20/01/2022 20:15

Quoting didn’t work for some reason, that was in response to @NavigatingAdolescence

Heatherjayne1972 · 20/01/2022 20:19

Not just the nhs
It’s every business school hospital prison doctors dentist overseen by the cqc

I’m in dentistry and we will shortly be facing a lack of staff too as people will be fired if they’re unvaccinated

It’s going to affect us all one way or another

Buzzinwithbez · 20/01/2022 20:41

I hadn't realised that dentists would be included.
I knew it was bad but hadn't joined the dots enough to understand the full extent.
What a nightmare.

howdiditcometothis666 · 20/01/2022 21:01

@Runmybathforme

I hope they do follow through with this, I am a nurse and experience the consequences of staff shortages every day. However, it's a science based profession, we know vaccines are the way out of this mess, make your choice and take responsibility.
The vaccines have helped get us to this point but according to EMA and some Israel experts these vaccines are not going to take us much/any further
User1isnotavailable · 21/01/2022 09:10

"Runmybathforme

I hope they do follow through with this, I am a nurse and experience the consequences of staff shortages every day. However, it's a science based profession, we know vaccines are the way out of this mess, make your choice and take responsibility."

I understand that some of the non science based jobs in the NHS (porters, cleaners, admin) might have a problem understanding science and vaccines and facts but when nurses spout utter rubbish it is more shocking. Didn't they listen in the immunology lectures.

nojudgementhere · 21/01/2022 09:28

@User1isnotavailable - Didn't you listen in the lectures about informed consent?

Porcupineintherough · 21/01/2022 09:34

No one is arguing against informed consent @nojudgementhere so spare us that straw man. Other professions are available.

FrankieBoyleSezLoveOneAnother · 21/01/2022 11:03

There's a lot of big talk. A lot of people will quietly go and get vaccinated. Some will leave or get fired. Life goes on and other jobs are available, as Porcupine says.

Whatisthepointinthis · 21/01/2022 11:26

[quote nojudgementhere]@User1isnotavailable - Didn't you listen in the lectures about informed consent?[/quote]
No one is proposing holding people down and shoving the needle in.

It’s entirely their choice to have the vaccine, but if they don’t they will need to find another job.

Most of us in the nhs are fully behind the vaccine as we’ve seen what a good effect they’ve had.

QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat · 21/01/2022 11:32

I honestly think they will backtrack quite swiftly on this in the next few weeks. Well, I hope so anyway, it will be an unmitigated disaster for the Tory party if we do lose a significant amount of HCPs and at the moment, I just don't think they'd survive. Either Boris will relent or they'll get rid of him and another Tory saviour will appear, saving all the NHS jobs.

LonglegsMumtheBlacksmith · 21/01/2022 11:36

I feared that the mandate would go through but I am of the understanding that Dr Hilary spoke out against it yesterday so the government should u-turn any minute now...

nojudgementhere · 21/01/2022 11:38

If you're having to threaten someone with the loss of their livelihood to get their consent then I'd argue that it's not freely given. This therefore doesn't meet the criteria for informed consent. Considering it should be one of the cornerstones of medicine in the UK, it worries me that people working for the NHS are not taking it a bit more seriously.

Also, how do you feel about the fact you could very soon be working alongside Covid positive doctors and nurses due to the change in the isolation rules? This would personally worry me a lot more than working alongside somebody unvaccinated.

WouldIBeATwat · 21/01/2022 11:49

@QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat

I honestly think they will backtrack quite swiftly on this in the next few weeks. Well, I hope so anyway, it will be an unmitigated disaster for the Tory party if we do lose a significant amount of HCPs and at the moment, I just don't think they'd survive. Either Boris will relent or they'll get rid of him and another Tory saviour will appear, saving all the NHS jobs.
8% doctors 5% nurses 4% midwives unvaccinated.

Versus how many hundreds of thousands of care workers that would sue them?

wingingmumlife · 21/01/2022 11:54

I don't know if this has already been mentioned as I have not read through the whole thread but those saying they did it in the care home sector, they actually didn't. A lot of care home workers were able to self certify themselves exempt until April 2022. So from April, there will be a lot of care workers leaving as their exemption runs out.

I know Sajid Javid stated the "care home sector" isn't struggling, not yet no, but it will be. Also, there are a lot of patients taking up hospital beds because there is not enough room for them in care homes.

MrsBillyNoJagNoMates · 21/01/2022 12:28

@wingingmumlife

I don't know if this has already been mentioned as I have not read through the whole thread but those saying they did it in the care home sector, they actually didn't. A lot of care home workers were able to self certify themselves exempt until April 2022. So from April, there will be a lot of care workers leaving as their exemption runs out.

I know Sajid Javid stated the "care home sector" isn't struggling, not yet no, but it will be. Also, there are a lot of patients taking up hospital beds because there is not enough room for them in care homes.

Oh so that's what happened. Knew they could self-certify till December 2021, didn't realize it got extended
ancientgran · 21/01/2022 12:33

@wingingmumlife

I don't know if this has already been mentioned as I have not read through the whole thread but those saying they did it in the care home sector, they actually didn't. A lot of care home workers were able to self certify themselves exempt until April 2022. So from April, there will be a lot of care workers leaving as their exemption runs out.

I know Sajid Javid stated the "care home sector" isn't struggling, not yet no, but it will be. Also, there are a lot of patients taking up hospital beds because there is not enough room for them in care homes.

The biggest thing that would help with recruiting care staff would be for LAs and the NHS to pay enough money for placements so that self funders don't have to cross subsidise and staff could be paid appropriately.

Put care homes in a position where they can pay more than Lidl and McDonalds and the staff will come.

QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat · 21/01/2022 12:58

Wouldibeatwat I imagine there are quite a few care workers who already have legal action in anyway. That's a fair few doctors, nurses and midwives who are unvaccinated and could have catastrophic impacts on an already struggling NHS.

Whatisthepointinthis · 21/01/2022 13:12

@QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat

I honestly think they will backtrack quite swiftly on this in the next few weeks. Well, I hope so anyway, it will be an unmitigated disaster for the Tory party if we do lose a significant amount of HCPs and at the moment, I just don't think they'd survive. Either Boris will relent or they'll get rid of him and another Tory saviour will appear, saving all the NHS jobs.
A few weeks will be too late as deadline is 3rd feb.

It would be a risk to leave it and hope that the rules change.

Phelescent · 21/01/2022 13:30

It is completely insane. Insane, no positives to come from it at all, only heartache and huge stress from every direction. The most idiotic idea they've ever had.

s1h2o3na · 21/01/2022 13:37

WouldIBeATwat - thats really interesting, i'd read elsewhere that Dr's were the largest direct clinical group to have people not vaxxed but hadn't seen any stats. I bet Sajid isn't publicising that !

UnmentionedElephantDildo · 21/01/2022 13:49

@s1h2o3na

WouldIBeATwat - thats really interesting, i'd read elsewhere that Dr's were the largest direct clinical group to have people not vaxxed but hadn't seen any stats. I bet Sajid isn't publicising that !
That's because it's isn't true

ONS release thus sort of data periodically, latest one yesterday

Health professionals are the group with the highest levels of uptake, followed by teachers.

I think soneine might be attempting the Big Lie technique to be promulgating the opposite

s1h2o3na · 21/01/2022 13:54

yes uptake amongst health professions in total is understandably high which is great but within the staffing groups there will be differences, no? why do you say its not true?

s1h2o3na · 21/01/2022 14:00

"8% doctors
5% nurses
4% midwives unvaccinated."

this is what the other poster posted, if they can link their sources that would be helpful

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