Do you still agree with mandatory vaccines for NHS?

[woollymammoths]

Not doing this to goad and completely respectful of people’s choices. But genuinely interested in opinions and any research that people are aware of.

At this point in time I am struggling to think of family and friends that do not have covid right now. Some are triple vaccinated, some are unvaccinated. There does not seem to be any distinct differences between how easily it was transmitted or how ill the individuals are - according to their vaccination status.

Example:
My DP is triple jabbed - he has had covid twice (once after 2 jabs, the second time after booster). More ill the second time, but still mild.

His (NHS) department is currently shut down with the amount of (triple jabbed) staff off sick with covid.

I caught covid from him.

I am unvaccinated - have had covid twice. Been unpleasant but not hospitalised. The second time milder than the first.

I am on mat leave but due to return to my NHS role.

Why am I still being forced to be vaccinated?

please do not say ‘just find another job’. That is not the point of my thread

I am appalled by the prospect of taking away bodily autonomy.

It is refreshing to see Sky news reporting the conversation today between Sajid Javid and a consultant anaesthetist, who disagrees with compulsory vaccination and has chosen not to be vaccinated.

@herecomesthsun my understanding is that the flu vaccine isn’t efficient when they haven’t established which strain will be prevalent that year well enough.

This year for example, the vaccine has been made for a strain that isn’t actually prevalent n the U.K. so it’s efficacy will be low.

This doesn’t mean that the vaccine isn’t effective for that strain it was developed for.

I am appalled by the prospect of taking away bodily autonomy

Flyonawalk no one is taking away bodily autonomy. When working with vulnerable people you need to be able to keep them protected that is why you have to have other vaccines too. No one is forced to work in healthcare

One consultant out of how many ? Very few senior staff have not been vaccinated it’s younger staff that are choosing not to be vaccinated

To answer the original question. Yes I am in favour

No

news.sky.com/story/covid-19-sajid-javid-directly-challenged-on-mandatory-coronavirus-jabs-by-unvaccinated-nhs-doctor-12511224

@Flyonawalk

I am appalled by the prospect of taking away bodily autonomy.

It is refreshing to see Sky news reporting the conversation today between Sajid Javid and a consultant anaesthetist, who disagrees with compulsory vaccination and has chosen not to be vaccinated.

You might describe that as "refreshing". I wouldn't.

I definitely describe it as refreshing too.
Very refreshing. Thank goodness some mainstream media are being a bit more balanced now.
The doctor is eloquent, intelligent and makes total sense.
Javid hopefully is listening to people’s concerns.

[quote boogiebogie]news.sky.com/story/covid-19-sajid-javid-directly-challenged-on-mandatory-coronavirus-jabs-by-unvaccinated-nhs-doctor-12511224[/quote]
I just saw this. Well done to that brave consultant. It seemed to make SJ quite uncomfortable. It takes courage these days to speak up.

I've never believed anyone should be forced to be vaccinated against their will.

I’m tripled jabbed and I think it’s really wrong to force mandatory vaccinations onto nhs staff. Say you have a cancer consultant who’s trained for years, is highly skilled, provides excellent cancer care and literally saves lives on a regular basis. They don’t want the vaccination so they’re forced out of their job. All those patients who would be getting treated for cancer now have to wait longer to see someone else. I’m sure the majority of them would rather see the life saving consultant who’s not vaccinated. I know I would. The reality is that forcing the unvaccinated out of their jobs will cause more deaths than it will save lives. The nhs is already struggling and doesn’t need more staff shortages.

@PAFMO

26% of people in the UK are obese (BMI 30+) 36% are overweight (BMI 25-30) With that kind of statistic 50% of any random sampling of anything are likely to be overweight. The people registered at your dentist The people in the bus queue The mums at school And yes, Covid patients in hospital. Adding to the fact that being overweight leads to cardiovascular problems, diabetes and other nasties, you can extrapolate why slightly more than half of people seriously affected by Covid would be overweight. It's never been the being overweight itself that exacerbates Covid, but the fact that being overweight leads to a host of other comorbidities that does.

The Stanford study suggests that being overweight itself did exacerbate Covid as it attacks fat cells and possibly created a reservoir in fat cells (like some other viruses) that lead to long Covid. I think it still has to be peer reviewed but interesting www.webmd.com/lung/news/20211209/coronavirus-attacks-fat-tissue mclaughlinlab.sites.stanford.edu/covid-19-research

Everyone should be able to decide for themselves whether to have the vaccine or not without fear of losing their job.

I'm CEV & double jabbed (waiting for someone to do No3 as I'm housebound) It wouldn't bother me if I was treated by someone who was unvaccinated, I could just as easily be infected by someone in the waiting room. If numbers drop drastically by staff leaving instead of being jabbed the biggest worry will be how many staff will still be working & how long are patients waiting for treatment & diagnosis.

@Nat6999

I'm CEV & double jabbed (waiting for someone to do No3 as I'm housebound) It wouldn't bother me if I was treated by someone who was unvaccinated, I could just as easily be infected by someone in the waiting room. If numbers drop drastically by staff leaving instead of being jabbed the biggest worry will be how many staff will still be working & how long are patients waiting for treatment & diagnosis.

But realistically there’s no where for them to go.....I’m a Band 7 nurse....I earn 46k basic.....where am I going to work ( still as a nurse) and earn that, plus get 33 days leave plus bank holidays and very generous sick pay and pension? Very few will go..... they will get vaccinated and move on

@Pasithea

Don’t medical staff have the vaccines as part of the contract they sign.

Yes

Sorry (not sorry). But yes. And if people like you are providing health care to vulnerable people, God help them as you are possibly one of the most selfish people and shouldn't be looking after others.

I am CEV undergoing cancer treatment and am far more concerned about delays than staff being vaccinated though think it should be encouraged but if I had the choice of being treated by an unvaccinated staff member or treatment delayed a few weeks/months would definitely opt for treatment now as stage 3 and at stage 4 becomes incurable. As it is delays have probably caused it to have spread to lymph nodes meaning chemo will now be likely whereas without delays would not have been needed - and delays are at GPs more than at hospital but problems at both.

I don’t think any one ‘wants’ mandatory vaccination. I’d say it’s more something that might be considered depending on how critical the situation is. I haven’t read up on it much, but there must be a perceived benefit that is outweighing a risk? Are unvaccinated NHS staff/care workers potentially responsible for a high infection rate in patients? Is there proof of this? I don’t know! I’ve seen studies where mandatory vaccination is proved to increase uptake…

Well us care homes are the 1st guinea pigs, which have fallen foul of mandatory covid vaccine.

@Silkieschickens

I am CEV undergoing cancer treatment and am far more concerned about delays than staff being vaccinated though think it should be encouraged but if I had the choice of being treated by an unvaccinated staff member or treatment delayed a few weeks/months would definitely opt for treatment now as stage 3 and at stage 4 becomes incurable. As it is delays have probably caused it to have spread to lymph nodes meaning chemo will now be likely whereas without delays would not have been needed - and delays are at GPs more than at hospital but problems at both.

You won't be offered that choice.

There is no way that there would be unvaccinated people in the critical parts of haematology or oncology departments, because infection could kill their patients. They are vaccinated, and tend to minimise their contact with others during times of high infection (including when other lesser diseases such as flu are going round) and can be taken off patient facing duties during the acute phase of a common cold.

They can't afford to run parallel units with different staffing. People with a vocation for work in these areas are just so diligent, that they do it. Appreciate thatbsome will just be assigned there are part of necessary rotations, and won't have chosen a specialty where infection control is so very important

@Kitkat151 They could move or commute to Wales or Scotland? I see nurse jobs advertised there all the time up to £70k. I think it is only mandatory in England but maybe I'm wrong?

The RCN says " The RCN has significant concerns that mandating vaccines will further marginalise those who are currently vaccine hesitant and put further pressure on a hugely depleted workforce by forcing people out of employment. Evidence is already emerging of unvaccinated staff being put at risk of redundancy in care settings following recent changes to the legislation."

Yes.

[quote boogiebogie]news.sky.com/story/covid-19-sajid-javid-directly-challenged-on-mandatory-coronavirus-jabs-by-unvaccinated-nhs-doctor-12511224[/quote]
This man is a hero. Boris can hardly accuse him of talking "mumbo jumbo"...

The Scottish NHS is hugely understaffed

Sturgeon could attract a lot of them to Scotland. This would be a smart move for her - unusually!!!