I’m concerned that Mumsnet are not doing enough to tackle misinformation

[Beadebaser]

I might end up getting a ban, or my thread deleted. But I am concerned. I’ve seen more anti-vaxx material discussed here than on any other social media platform.

And the way it is discussed concerns me. A potentially vulnerable person poses a question - and then others appear to ‘jump’ on this post giving advice that is contrary to the NHS guidelines.
I’m all for a debate in ‘normal’ times - but while things are pretty critical for the NHS/schools - shouldn’t we be doing all we can to support them and each other?
Yesterday I reported a post explaining in detail to Mumsnet why it was misinformation. They didn’t respond.
I’ve had a thread removed already saying I’d be messaged personally. I wasn’t contacted.
Mumsnet have a duty of care to their readers. Misinformation and fake news is an online harm.

you're not wrong, there's shit loads of anti vax/Covid denier nonsense on here but you'll get jumped on and told there isn't.

I agree. I think the posters who have said there isn't much misinformatin aren't clicking on the threads where there is a lot of this rubbish.

It depends what you’re classing as “anti-vaxx”. Do you mean full on conspiracy stuff or just people with an opinion with which you don’t agree?
I’m increasingly seeing “anti-vaxx” being used as a slur term to describe any view that is less in favour of restrictions/lockdowns/absolute adherence to the law than the other person’s

Very well put
Posting alleged "facts" which are demonstrably untrue is one thing, but banning mere opinion is a dangerous road to go down

Personally I've found HQ to have handled it pretty well on the whole - for example when they closed "Nanny"'s account, presumably along with the many changing usernames

[quote riveted1]@samyeagar

I find that bizzare.

Myo/pericarditis is a known (rare) side effect from coronavirus infection & the vaccines. Not sure why anyone would try to persuade you otherwise when this link has already been established.[/quote]
I don't find it bizarre at all. The 5G Bill Gates people are not the only group that is woefully uninformed, even after two years of this. For a significant portion of the population, black and white is the only way they choose to look at things, and combined with their tribal adherence, anything that suggests a shade of grey, they must challenge, lest they feel as if their carefully constructed black and white reality is destroyed.

I then explained in more detail - they said their decision was final/that I could turn off posts from specific posters

We've been asking for a Hide Poster function for years how do you do it?

I totally agree there's so much old cobblers posted on here about Coronavirus by self appointed experts that don't like to be questioned about it.

@BoredZelda

how do you prove the right 'information' though?

Ahh, the “alternative facts” defence.

If you get to adulthood without being able to discern what is credible and what isn’t when it comes to information that can be pretty well backed up by science, you’ve got bigger problems.

no? i'm just interested

why so snippy with your 'ahh'.

@Sparklingbrook

I then explained in more detail - they said their decision was final/that I could turn off posts from specific posters

We've been asking for a Hide Poster function for years how do you do it?

I totally agree there's so much old cobblers posted on here about Coronavirus by self appointed experts that don't like to be questioned about it.

yes, i just saw that!

op. did it work for you? can you really turn off posters?

I 100% agree with you. Anti-vax nonsense and misinformation presented as fact, or people just simply trying to frighten people about the “unknown” as they see it. MN should be doing much more. Hardly seen any of this on other social media sites

The problem is that there's fairly little explicit "anti-vaxx" material on MN. There's an awful lot of dopey "my body my choice" comments which point to a very poor level of understanding of risk and science etc. And at a personal level I find it maddening to see posts like this - it absolutely makes me tear my hair out to see this sort of bollocks.

But the problem is there's very little that is really actionable for someone looking to take down dodgy material.

It's tricky but generally I think MN walks the line fairly well. The best thing one can do is educate those people who are hesitant and debunk the myths. But I don't think you can take down all vaccine hesitant comments.

@GirlInACountrySong

how do you prove the right 'information' though?

....things which aren't backed by robust evidence like the claims peddled by people like Robert Malone, McCollough and others regarding vaccine safety, for example.

This is where all the misinformation comes from in the first place, it isn't people doing research at all.

@XenoBitch

Ok - so from my personal experience.

I could say - I had no issues with vaccine at all. Don’t even bother consulting your doctor if you have a potential exemption - you’ll be absolutely fine.

I wouldn’t say that because I know it’s not true and could be very harmful.

The big grey area is the vaccine and side effects and whilst most threads are probably true and honest reflections of their experience , health anxieties and fears this place can amplify those to a huge audience. If I was an anti-vaxxer and looking for the best place to seed doubts then this is it, because it is a level playing field unlike say Reddit where up and downvotes can screen out these kind of 'unhelpful' posts. My post will be deleted as will probably this thread. But there you go,

[quote Beadebaser]@samyeagar while I fully sympathise with your situation - it is anecdotal evidence.

From my anecdotal evidence - not one of my friends and family have had any issues other than a sore arm.
So from my anecdotal evidence I could say the vaccine is 100 percent safe. But I know that’s not true.
That is why we need to look at the global statistics. Which state -over and over again- that your risk from Covid is far far far greater than your risk from the vaccine.[/quote]
So why should I be prevented from telling my factually correct lived experience any more than you should be prevented from telling yours?

What makes my experience misinformation, and yours not?

I agree there is rather a lot of misinformation on here, and I am surprised it is not deleted more quickly as it makes the site look quite wacky.

Agree and it’s always the same old names popping up.

@Newyearnewme2022

Agree and it’s always the same old names popping up.

But OP has been told by MNHQ that we can now 'turn off posts from specific posters' which would be a huge gamechanger on the Coronavirus topic.

OP
So, if someone DID have side effects, what level of proof would you require for them to be allowed to discuss?

Many, many women have experienced issues with their periods. Surely discussing this with others who have experienced the same thing is a good thing?

There is literally no point of a discussion forum if everyone has to have the same opinion, don't you think?

Some posters on here say things that would be classed as hate crimes irl and mn lets them continue posting. False information including false or dangerous medical advice is all over the site and while they can't delete everything they should at least remove reported posts

@Lacedwithgrace

Some posters on here say things that would be classed as hate crimes irl and mn lets them continue posting. False information including false or dangerous medical advice is all over the site and while they can't delete everything they should at least remove reported posts

Again with the hate crimes. Your post are old whine in new bottles.

Posts not post.

@WorraLiberty

Mumsnet have a duty of care to their readers. Misinformation and fake news is an online harm.

Mumsnetters have a duty of care to themselves, to seek information from the NHS.

If they can't do that, they shouldn't be on the internet.

Who decides what qualifies at 'misinformation?'

@Sparklingbrook

I then explained in more detail - they said their decision was final/that I could turn off posts from specific posters

We've been asking for a Hide Poster function for years how do you do it?

I totally agree there's so much old cobblers posted on here about Coronavirus by self appointed experts that don't like to be questioned about it.

Me too, I’m very interested to hear that the OP has had this option suggested!

There is a difference between misinformation and individual opinions. I wouldn't say mumsnet has any more vaccine misinformation than any other site. Most posters that have misgivings quote sources such as the JCVI on the balance of risk and benefit in vaccines for teens, for example. Of course it's annoying when they just post some crap they saw on youtube, but 95% of readers will recognise it for what it is - some crap. The 5% that won't are already antivaxxers.

@spotcheck

OP So, if someone DID have side effects, what level of proof would you require for them to be allowed to discuss?

Many, many women have experienced issues with their periods. Surely discussing this with others who have experienced the same thing is a good thing?

There is literally no point of a discussion forum if everyone has to have the same opinion, don't you think?

I don't see anyone saying that side effects shouldn't be discussed

I've linked many papers on this and research groups looking at the impact of pandemic related factors on the menstrual cycle

This is not the same thing as misinformation

OP, have you created a thread in Site Stuff or are you not at all interested in how to most easily communicate with MNHQ?

@samyeagar

For the same reason I shouldn’t go round telling people the vaccine is 100% safe - just because I had no reaction to the vaccine.

Your/my story are important - but I’m a little fish in a humongous pond. And I need to consider what is the best outcome for all the fish in that humongous pond.