Govt plans re unvaccinated feels like a change is afoot

[whenwillthemadnessend]

Anyone noticed the govt and news sources seem to be covering more and more stories regarding the unvaccinated (by choice)
I feel they might be ramping up support for restrictions for unvaccinated people.
It's feel very much like propaganda and warm up the masses.
Anyone agree or noticed this in the last 3/4 days?

[quote Headingnorthwoste]@userperuser oh no, it’s not hatred at all. People are just perplexed and feel sad for anyone who’s been taken in by conspiracy theories. It’s time for government to coerce action if they won’t do it for themselves and the wider public. Shocking really when you think it’s all free. I knew of one unvaxxed heathy 30 something who ended up in ICU. I can’t understand why anyone would take that risk.[/quote]
I’m sorry you feel this way but the absolute vast majority of people choosing not to have the vaccine have done so for many and often complex reasons and not because they have been taken in by some conspiracy theories as you seem to think they all have. There will always be the odd person spooked by something they read online but for those people it’s important to point them to facts in order tho help them.

If you think it’s time for the government to ‘coerce’ people into taking a vaccine they have declined then that’s a very dark path you have gone down and unfortunately it’s one that’s no better than the conspiracy theories you’re so concerned about.

Young people die/end up in ICU every year from flu too it’s not exclusive to covid.

[quote Headingnorthwoste]@userperuser oh no, it’s not hatred at all. People are just perplexed and feel sad for anyone who’s been taken in by conspiracy theories. It’s time for government to coerce action if they won’t do it for themselves and the wider public. Shocking really when you think it’s all free. I knew of one unvaxxed heathy 30 something who ended up in ICU. I can’t understand why anyone would take that risk.[/quote]
I'd kind of understand what you're saying if the vaccine really did protect people even by 90% and it would be 90% that by everyone being vaccinated we could put an end to this.

But...the amount of vaccinated people still ending up poorly is concerning, don't you think? Not all vaccinated are only dealing with mild illness. They always say "if I didn't have the vaccine I would have ended up in hospital" but they don't really know that. When the vast majority of healthy people only have mild illness whether they're vaccinated or not. They will now never know if it really is the vaccine preventing them from becoming seriously ill, or if they naturally would have had a mild case of it.

The attitude of people surrounding all of this, is far more frightening than any virus.

Theyre not all involved in conspiracy theories, either. But it's easy for the media to encourage everyone to believe that is the case, just to shame those who are concerned for whatever reason.

I really feel for those who are truly frightened of the vaccine, be that from needle phobia or just because its all fairly unknown. The shame they're bombarded with and expected to feel is disgusting. It has led people to feel suicidal and people, like yourself, are in agreement with pushing that even more!

The way people are reacting is far more frightening than any virus, IMO.

This whole thing on rates / absolute numbers of vaccinated and unvaccinated people is perfectly simple.

We can all see from the government published data that the rate of unvaccinated (and partially vaccinated) people hospitalized per 100,0000 of the population is higher than that of vaccinated people.

We can also all see that the actual number of vaccinated people hospitalized with covid is higher than the number of unvaccinated people.

We can also all see that a higher proportion of the population is vaccinated than unvaccinated (or partially vaccinated).

Therefore we can see that vaccinations reduce the risk of being hospitalized and we can also all see that when people say the hospitals are overwhelmed with "the unvaccinated" that that simply isn't true.

I don't think the law should be changed to make vaccination compulsory for everyone. However, I do think that it should be in some jobs- anyone who works in any medical-related job, care jobs, transport. That's because absences in these jobs will overwhelm national systems.

The NHS is not being over-whelmed by more people in hospital but by more staff off either with Covid or isolating - and the unvaccinated loom large in both groups according to Radio 4.

...the absolute vast majority of people choosing not to have the vaccine have done so for many and often complex reasons and not because they have been taken in by some conspiracy theories as you seem to think they all have.

ONS Surveys show it is not that complex for the "vast majority". People in the main are simply unsure about the long term health impacts, which is understandable - but if they listen to the official advice from the official experts globally it is clear the side effects are very low risk in comparison. The main problem is they are being misadvised or think they know better than the scientists.

Blanketpolicy

That’s a bit harsh to dismiss a persons concerns as being misadvised as data is still emerging.

Did the ONS ask every person why they didn’t want the vaccine?

@Potatodrivers

The way people are reacting is far more frightening than any virus, IMO.

Yes, I am also fairly frightened by the number of people who truly don't care about older or vulnerable people, because that allows them to dismiss hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths.

Also the people - often the same ones - who choose to either ignore scientific evidence, or just decide that they'd rather rely on others having to have medical treatment - but also assume that it should be entirely allowed to head out into crowded places in a peak wave of a pandemic.

Yes, I am also fairly frightened by the number of people who truly don't care about older or vulnerable people, because that allows them to dismiss hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths

This is another misconception. It’s absolutely untrue that those not wishing to vaccinate don’t care about the elderly and vulnerable and it’s also quite manipulative. Flip that around and do the elderly not care about the (smaller) risk they’re demanding the younger generation take?

Many of those not vaccinated are being extremely careful around the at risk but the media want to peddle the lie that they’re all irresponsible idiots.

@userperuser

Yes, I am also fairly frightened by the number of people who truly don't care about older or vulnerable people, because that allows them to dismiss hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths

This is another misconception. It’s absolutely untrue that those not wishing to vaccinate don’t care about the elderly and vulnerable and it’s also quite manipulative. Flip that around and do the elderly not care about the (smaller) risk they’re demanding the younger generation take?

Many of those not vaccinated are being extremely careful around the at risk but the media want to peddle the lie that they’re all irresponsible idiots.

👏👏

In my experience of those around me, it appears to be those who are fully vaccinated that feel that they can go into crowded places. Some of them feel invinsible now.

Yes and it’s disgusting.

In my experience it’s the other way round. I’m being careful about where I go and who I see in the run up to Christmas whereas my retired parents have just come back from a trip to the German Christmas markets and my Nan has said if no-one else will go with her, she’ll be getting a taxi to the pub for a meal after Christmas!

The change in tone is because vaccination is key to preventing serious illness and death, unnecessary hospital admissions and impacting on a challenged NHS and exhausted NHS staff. That’s the reality, it’s not propaganda.

Yes!!!! (punches air) and good! Unvaxed people should all stay at home so they can't infect those of us who give a damn about others - ditto those liars and bullsh*tters who won't wear masks

@Redleavesfalling289 those that have had reactions to it can also get an exemption when they are advised not to get anymore. Possibly those with phobias etc too.

@Bertiebiscuit

Yes!!!! (punches air) and good! Unvaxed people should all stay at home so they can't infect those of us who give a damn about others - ditto those liars and bullsh*tters who won't wear masks

Your post may be justified if you couldn’t be infected by the vaccinated.

@Beachcomber

This whole thing on rates / absolute numbers of vaccinated and unvaccinated people is perfectly simple.

We can all see from the government published data that the rate of unvaccinated (and partially vaccinated) people hospitalized per 100,0000 of the population is higher than that of vaccinated people.

We can also all see that the actual number of vaccinated people hospitalized with covid is higher than the number of unvaccinated people.

We can also all see that a higher proportion of the population is vaccinated than unvaccinated (or partially vaccinated).

Therefore we can see that vaccinations reduce the risk of being hospitalized and we can also all see that when people say the hospitals are overwhelmed with "the unvaccinated" that that simply isn't true.

As l said before, yes the rate of vaccinated patients is higher. That’s because there are nearly 3 times as many people vaccinated as unvaccinated.

It's about time they used the army for something like this. They are there to protect our country and it's people, that's what they sign up for. So we're fighting a war, albeit an unseen one, so why can't they back up the police. I think people would take more notice of the army in uniform.

flashback to MN coronavirus threads March 2020.

@Bertiebiscuit

Yes!!!! (punches air) and good! Unvaxed people should all stay at home so they can't infect those of us who give a damn about others - ditto those liars and bullsh*tters who won't wear masks

You do know the vaccinated can still infect others as well don’t you?

For those that don’t want the vaccine because long term effects are unknown. Would they also refuse the new Covid treatments that are technically still in trial phase if they end up needing it? I doubt it.

So you really believe all the numbers are unvaccinated? My Neice works in school she had worked the whole time of covid. Isn't vaccinated and caught it first time round and wasnt ill with it. She has been fine while all around her the vaccinated staff are dropping like flies. Please don't be so keen to hand your lives over to others cos once we go past that point there will be no turning back. One day you may not have the choice over what happens to your child or parent if this goes through.

@notoldjustpastyoung

It's about time they used the army for something like this. They are there to protect our country and it's people, that's what they sign up for. So we're fighting a war, albeit an unseen one, so why can't they back up the police. I think people would take more notice of the army in uniform.

Use the army for what?