Why do people keep saying the unvaccinated are what’s keeping the pandemic going?

[Keytomyheart]

That would be true if the vaccinated couldn’t catch it and spread it, but they can.

So how are the unvaccinated prolonging this? Because I’m not understanding it.

Btw I am vaxxed, but not decided on booster yet.

It’s because we are all being manipulated with agenda driven emotive messages.
Don’t blame each other. Blame the governments that are causing division and hate.

@HesterShaw1

Because it gives them a completely illusory feeling of control

Of course there's nothing we can do to control this now, short of locking ourselves in isolation from one another, which is of course impossible.

While we can't control the virus, we can reduce its impact and its spread. The things we need to do are:

1. Maximise vaccination.
2. Wear masks correctly in crowded areas.
3. Social distance where possible.
4. Decent ventilation in enclosed areas.

Unfortunately, way too many people are unwilling to comply with these simple measures, which is why we end up in the situation where lockdowns are necessary.

@HailAdrian

Because of the desperate need to blame someone for something that is out of our control. I am vaccinated but I think the attitudes towards those who exercise their rights NOT to be, are quite disgusting. Quite frankly, it's bordering on coercion.

Absolutely.

@HailAdrian

Because of the desperate need to blame someone for something that is out of our control. I am vaccinated but I think the attitudes towards those who exercise their rights NOT to be, are quite disgusting. Quite frankly, it's bordering on coercion.

Spot on! 👏👏

Are they taking up ICU beds though? I watched the news last night and it mentioned hospital admissions but didn’t mention ICU beds or vaccinated or unvaccinated. So what sources are people using to spout this?!

Maybe because it's true. X

Because
A) they are more likely to catch it (their problem)
B) they are more likely to spread it (everyone else is effected)
C) they are more likely to suffer more severely (problem for them and NHS)

I don’t understand why people can’t see the problem with being unvaccinated

It's not only the unvaccinated, but they're not helping matters.

They get infected more easily.
They infect others more easily.
They're more likely to become seriously ill and then need an ambulance/hospital treatment/an ICU bed.
They're more likely to die.

All of these things clearly contribute to the pandemic.

No one solution is going to get us out of the situation we are in.

Many smaller actions will help to prevent loss of life and the NHS becoming overwhelmed. These actions include vaccinations.

I do not believe in manitory vaccinations for the general public and would not support an action to do so.

However, that does not mean I have any respect for an individual's personal choice to not get vaccinated.

Their choice, has a very real, direct impact on everyone else in these very extreme circumstances.

If they weren’t using all the hospital beds being treated for covid then we wouldn’t have to have nearly so many restrictions and almost certainly no talk of lockdowns. It may not be them causing the spread of covid, but it’s them putting strain on NHS meaning we all suffer restrictions and not seeing family etc.

No, Vaccinated People Are Not ‘Just as Likely’ to Spread the Coronavirus as Unvaccinated People

Basically because vaccinated people are much less likely to have covid in the first place, and if infected they are likely contagious for a shorter period of time when compared with the unvaccinated, and they may harbour less infectious virus overall.

Because of the desperate need to blame someone for something that is out of our control. I am vaccinated but I think the attitudes towards those who exercise their rights NOT to be, are quite disgusting. Quite frankly, it's bordering on coercion.

If there was a group of people refusing to wear seatbelts, and lots of them were ending up in ICU following RTAs where they may have been fine if wearing a belt, what would we say and think about those people? Would it be coercion to be angry with them for their decision?

@Nosquit

If they weren’t using all the hospital beds being treated for covid then we wouldn’t have to have nearly so many restrictions and almost certainly no talk of lockdowns. It may not be them causing the spread of covid, but it’s them putting strain on NHS meaning we all suffer restrictions and not seeing family etc.

The argument would only stand if it was just the unvaccinated being treated for covid in hospital but the figures are not showing that, there are vaccinated patients also taking up many beds due to covid.

It’s not just the unvaccinated in hospital, but it is disproportionately the unvaccinated, and in age groups who would probably not need hospital if only they’d got vaccinated.

I find it incredible that people still don't understand the extremely simple facts about the covid vaccine.

Give me strength.

Really?!?! You really don’t get it?

All these people saying ‘because people like someone to blame’

Have you actually considerd the fact that we can’t blame the virus. It has no conscious thought, it does not give a fuck. But I can blame people who based on very poor information are choosing to put themselves and others at risk by not getting them vax or the booster. But then cry ‘oh you’re being unkind’ when we do this.

Man up. If you’re not going to get it at least stand by your conviction and take the (very valid) criticism on the chin.

@Flowerlane - The argument would only stand if it was just the unvaccinated being treated for covid in hospital but the figures are not showing that, there are vaccinated patients also taking up many beds due to covid.

You might have a point if the argument was that only unvaccinated are taking up hospital/ICU beds. However, the argument is that they are disproportionately represented in terms of beds. If they were all vaccinated, it would have a massive impact on occupancy rates, which would hugely relieve the stress on the health care system. If everyone, vaccinated and unvaccinated, also followed best practice in terms of mask wearing, social distancing and ventilation, more stress would be removed from the health system.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/21/icu-is-full-of-the-unvaccinated-my-patience-with-them-is-wearing-thin?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

Unvaccinated take up the majority (not all) of icu and therefore Nhs resources.

Because if near enough everyone was vaccinated then we could treat Covid like a cold due to the fact that the vaccine reduces severity and therefore deaths.

Because so many people are still unvaccinated everyone has to be careful to prevent infecting the people who are doing nothing to protect themselves so that we can try to stop the unvaccinated ending up in hospital and/or dying.

I'd usually try to say that in a nicer way but the fact that people are still not getting it after this long means they are either wilfully obtuse or thick as mince.

There would be capacity in the nhs, we wouldn’t be facing having to lockdown, if everyone were vaccinated and mask wearing, properly isolating etc.

I'm not known for being mean on here I hope.

I'm quite an old lady and fairly tolerant.

I nevertheless suggest that if you went to a fee paying school that you contact them and ask for an entire refund as you have an utter inability to read widely avaliable information and understand it.

You could also purchase a book of comprehension exercises. These were very popular in the 60s and consisted of reading a short paragraph of text and then answering a question based on the text, to see what we had understood.

Finally can I request that until your intellectual abilities have matched those of an average 14 year old that you minimise your appearance on social media. It is very unhelpful.

I will admit. I’m sick of this shit now. The who,e anti ax thing came from a shitty doctor fiddling his study to prove the point he wanted to make.

There’s plenty of data to show just how much vaccinations have done for the world, so many lives saved and so much suffering prevented.
I’m sick of people taking a flawed stance because they think they know better than everyone, including the doctors.

I’m sick of the splitting hairs to justify a stubborn and selfish mindset. I’m sick of entitled people forcing their posturing with me and my life so they can feel they’re not ‘sheep’.

You want to be you? No vaccine? Fuck the fuck off the grid and don’t cherry pick the parts of medicine you choose to believe when it suits you. This is like Brexit all over again, with wilful uneducated glee to make a point against the establishment, by shooting themselves (and all of us with it).

I repeat, go off grid and do your thing, leave us sheep to comply. You think you’re fucking Neo from The Matrix with your superior knowledge - crack on, off you go.

They are taking up hospital beds.

This means that when elderly vaccinated people need beds (because they are vulnerable and still get sick) need treatment, they won’t get it if beds are running low.

It also means that operations and vital treatments and diagnoses, eg for cancer, are delayed.

As the NHS hits capacity measures have to be introduced to reduce pressure, which clobbers the economy, with people loosing jobs, and further bail outs which we’ll all be paying for for years.

There are several reasons the pandemic is continuing but vaccine refusal is a major factor we can control.

Have your booster. Don’t be selfish

@Flowerlane of course there are vaccinated people in hospital, because the vaccines aren't 100% foolproof, and some elderly and vulnerable may still get sick enough to need hospital treatment even with the vaccines.

If everyone who was able to, got the vaccine, there might be a lot less unvaccinated people in hospital and there would actually be room to confine other treatments!

Continue, not confine.