Do unvaccinated people not see they are part of the problem?

[User135644]

I accept it's people's right whether they get jabbed or not, entirely up to them. However, the more people stubbornly refuse a vaccine then the worse it'll be for all of us. The hospitals will be more stretched and we'll have more restrictions, lockdowns or circuit breakers. People who won't get the vaccine are often the most anti-lockdown or restrictions, yet are part of the problem as to why we'll keep getting them.

Where exactly do they think we'd be without vaccines? We wouldn't have had a relatively normal 6 months or so with everything open, that's for sure.

I live in a rural area so a 'booster bus' was arranged to travel to remote areas. Fabulous idea! Except that anti vaxxers held a protest and blocked the bus from leaving and the people who were happy to have the booster were prevented from doing so by a group of people who thought their opinions should be forced on everyone. Selfish c*nts. And I never use that word as a rule.

@OldTinHat

I live in a rural area so a 'booster bus' was arranged to travel to remote areas. Fabulous idea! Except that anti vaxxers held a protest and blocked the bus from leaving and the people who were happy to have the booster were prevented from doing so by a group of people who thought their opinions should be forced on everyone. Selfish c*nts. And I never use that word as a rule.

Again, a small number of extremists. I would also have been furious at this situation -- it's wrong. Please don't become prejudiced against all unvaccinated because of the bad behaviour of a very vocal minority.

@OldTinHat

I live in a rural area so a 'booster bus' was arranged to travel to remote areas. Fabulous idea! Except that anti vaxxers held a protest and blocked the bus from leaving and the people who were happy to have the booster were prevented from doing so by a group of people who thought their opinions should be forced on everyone. Selfish c*nts. And I never use that word as a rule.

That is unbelievable. If you're anti vax, then that's fine, your choice. But to physically stop and denying people access to healtcare.... that's a whole new level and they should of been moved by police..... ir a speeding bus

I doubt many people would try to defend that Chloe. Thankfully, the majority of people who have decided not to have this vaccine themselves would not even consider behaving like that.

Even just by posting online that one is unvaccinated has the potential to influence negatively, easily swayed members of the public who are also reading.

They may or may not go on to do awful things to persuade others not to get vaccinated and therefore, I think some responsibility has to be acknowledged by some posters but they won’t.

I can quite vouch for the despicable behaviour of some anti vaxxers targeting schools and children specifically in the most vile way - no propaganda in the media needed there.

So, if those people turn up ill with Covid at A and E, I quite agree with the OP and also some of the other threads started recently about the subject.

Words on a screen matter, just like actions matter. Far too many tragedies

www.mylondon.news/news/health/i-tried-persuade-her-unvaccinated-22508166.amp

Words on a screen matter, just like actions matter. Far too many tragedies sad

Words on a screen do matter very much @ChloeDecker. I would really like you to take just one minute to think about what it's like to read post after post from people who wish bad things would happen to you. I am sad of reading how people think I should be locked up, not treated in hospitals, held down and forcibly injected etc. etc. for having a different opinion to them. There are posters who do really struggle with their mental health and have mentioned that they are getting to a stage where they don't care if they live or die because they are so traumatised by posts like this. All I can say is please be kind or there could be other tragedies in the future that your words have played a direct part in creating.

[quote ChloeDecker]Even just by posting online that one is unvaccinated has the potential to influence negatively, easily swayed members of the public who are also reading.

They may or may not go on to do awful things to persuade others not to get vaccinated and therefore, I think some responsibility has to be acknowledged by some posters but they won’t.

I can quite vouch for the despicable behaviour of some anti vaxxers targeting schools and children specifically in the most vile way - no propaganda in the media needed there.

So, if those people turn up ill with Covid at A and E, I quite agree with the OP and also some of the other threads started recently about the subject.

Words on a screen matter, just like actions matter. Far too many tragedies

www.mylondon.news/news/health/i-tried-persuade-her-unvaccinated-22508166.amp[/quote]
The young mother mentioned here read social media posts by armchair researchers arguing that the vax would have terrible effects in a few years time. I have seen numerous such posts on MN:
Ooh you never know what might happen in a few years
It is a new and untested vaccine
If you are young you don't need to take it.
And so forth....

Maybe they should consider "being kind." Sadly people will take the advice of random MNetters before they will take Chris Whitty's advice. And pay for it.

@nojudgementhere

Words on a screen matter, just like actions matter. Far too many tragedies sad

Words on a screen do matter very much @ChloeDecker. I would really like you to take just one minute to think about what it's like to read post after post from people who wish bad things would happen to you. I am sad of reading how people think I should be locked up, not treated in hospitals, held down and forcibly injected etc. etc. for having a different opinion to them. There are posters who do really struggle with their mental health and have mentioned that they are getting to a stage where they don't care if they live or die because they are so traumatised by posts like this. All I can say is please be kind or there could be other tragedies in the future that your words have played a direct part in creating.

So well put. This is very true. I am shocked at the vitriolic, hate filled and judgemental attitudes on these types of threads. In general, the tone on these boards has become quite nasty on a regular basis. It is a sad reflection on human nature.

@milkyaqua

I would never tell someone that they should or shouldn’t have the vaccine.

That's what makes your posting style so pernicious.

Yes - I've said similar but keeps getting deflected- it's just the constant drip drip every in post - suggesting efficacy isn't that good, hinting at side effects, downplaying the potential impacts of coronavirus.

Telling someone shouldn't get vaccinated would probably, understandly, get deleted. Posts like this do not, it treads a fine line.

And as I mentioned before is not exclusive to coronavirus.

I am bloody sick of the “please be kind” trope of anti-vaxxers.

Are you kind? If you land up in hospital with covid, are you being kind? If you spread misinformation, are you being kind? If you cause further restrictions and lockdowns, are you being kind?

And don’t pull any cards about mental health . We all have “mental health” and I can tell you that many people are being tipped over the edge with the thought of losing their businesses and livelihoods and a host of other things if this drags on for much longer.

We can all pull together - or not. And if you are a “not” then at least don’t storm all over social media upsetting people yet demanding “kindness” in return.

It’s a PERSONAL choice what someone chooses to do with their own body and health. If you are vaccinated, you should be fine. Either you won’t get it it, or you will have mild symptoms. We live in a democracy thank God. It sounds like many people would like to live in a dictatorship.

My mental health and that of my DD's is in the toilet because of uni lockdown and having family overseas whom we of course can't visit. I haven't seen my sister for over 2 years. DH's job is in danger of being eliminated. WFH is driving us insane in a tiny flat. i can't get medical treatment for a very uncomfortable uncondition. None of us are scared of getting Covid so much. It is the restrictions that are affecting us.

However , the only mental health that apparently matters is of those who refuse to take the vaccine without medical exemptions. I am really tired of it.

Condition not uncondition!

@LookslovelyinSpringtime

It’s a PERSONAL choice what someone chooses to do with their own body and health. If you are vaccinated, you should be fine. Either you won’t get it it, or you will have mild symptoms. We live in a democracy thank God. It sounds like many people would like to live in a dictatorship.

I do agree it's personal choice, but it's short sighted to think it doesn't affect others because it does.

@JanisMoplin

My mental health and that of my DD's is in the toilet because of uni lockdown and having family overseas whom we of course can't visit. I haven't seen my sister for over 2 years. DH's job is in danger of being eliminated. WFH is driving us insane in a tiny flat. i can't get medical treatment for a very uncomfortable uncondition. None of us are scared of getting Covid so much. It is the restrictions that are affecting us.

However , the only mental health that apparently matters is of those who refuse to take the vaccine without medical exemptions. I am really tired of it.

And do you think the unvaccinated somehow live lives that are completely unaffected by lockdowns/restrictions? We have also suffered job losses, lack of GP appointments, seeing our children's mental health plummet etc.etc. I am not responsible for lockdowns. I do not agree with them. I think they are very blunt tool and the reason we are hovering close to another one is because of the government's complete failure to act when it comes to investing in our hospitals.

Yesterday there were reports from South Africa that hospitilisations are 91% lower and deaths are two-thirds lower with Omicron than in previous waves. So please can you anyone tell me me why SAGE are desperately trying to bounce us into another lockdown before we can truly see what the impact on the UK is?

If you've been triple vaccinated against a virus with a 99.5%+ survival rate, likely to improve still further if the early reports on Omicron from South Africa ring true, yet you still want to strip other people of their freedoms and human rights so you "feel safe", then you have a serious problem.

@LookslovelyinSpringtime

It’s a PERSONAL choice what someone chooses to do with their own body and health. If you are vaccinated, you should be fine. Either you won’t get it it, or you will have mild symptoms. We live in a democracy thank God. It sounds like many people would like to live in a dictatorship.

So having made your 'personal choice' Why do you need shout about it and your (usually totally fallacious) 'reasons' for making it all over social media?

That's no longer a matter of personal choice, that is spreading harmful misinformation and misleading others, in a bid to influence their 'personal choice'.

The unvaccinated can do something about it. I have done all I can. Sorry, I have run out of sympathy for the unvaxxed. And no, I do not believe in mandatory vaccination or denying them treatment. But I don't have enough sympathy to go around any more.

I wasn't in favour of vaccine passes earlier when I thought the 80% of people vaxxed in the UK would get us over the line. I am coming around to them now that one in three Londoners is apparently unvaxxed and my own borough has 40% over over 18s unvaxxed.

Someone said to me the other day that now, you just have to develop a thick skin over it.

It is time to stop pandering and enabling people who drag us back one step every time we take 2 forward. Some people just love the drama. I know lots of people like this. On one hand the pandemic is hitting them hard like the rest of us, but on the other they are relishing the attention and concern they evoke in others. I don't know what they are going to do when this is all over. They will be very bored.

If people don't want the vaccine, great. That just means it will be quicker for me and mine to get it. If someone ends up in hospital because they don't have it, that is their problem. They shouldn't have been rolling marbles on the motorway.

What else can we do. No amount of scientific data or gentle persuasion will sway them. So just drop it, let them crack on with it, take care of yourself and yours. Stop being their narcissistic supply.

@MummyPop00

If you've been triple vaccinated against a virus with a 99.5%+ survival rate, likely to improve still further if the early reports on Omicron from South Africa ring true, yet you still want to strip other people of their freedoms and human rights so you "feel safe", then you have a serious problem.

It’s not just about survival rates. People can’t access other healthcare because the hospitals are overwhelmed with covid patients. Need a heart op or a hip replacement? Tough shit.

To the unvaccinated: ok, your body your choice. But do you think it reasonable that planes, trains, theatres, football grounds, cinemas etc and some jobs should ban you?

@MummyPop00

If you've been triple vaccinated against a virus with a 99.5%+ survival rate, likely to improve still further if the early reports on Omicron from South Africa ring true, yet you still want to strip other people of their freedoms and human rights so you "feel safe", then you have a serious problem.

This. I am vaccinated by the way. I also don’t see how every ward and doctor and nurse is now dealing with Covid patients so that routine operations aren’t going ahead. There is no reason GPs can’t see patients face to face either. Teachers have to work. They are just seen as expendable.

Neither "side" does themselves any favours by

1. oversimplifying the data and

2. demonising others

I am pro-vaccination, but I am also pro the government being more upfront about what will be expected of us.

All told, it does look as though immunity acquired through the existing crop of vaccines is relatively short lived.

The CEO of BioNTech this morning - "Sahin said he was waiting for real-life data to assess the accuracy of a German study suggesting a rapid drop in efficacy to about 25% after three months, even after three doses. “There will be a loss of effectiveness against Omicron over time, it is very likely, but we still have to measure the speed.

Even triple-vaccinated people can transmit the disease, and they will have to be tested, especially around vulnerable people,” he said. “With the Omicron variant becoming dominant, protective measures will remain essential, especially this winter."

It does look as though with the currently approved vaccines we will need boosters every 3-6 months. The vaccines we currently have are not a way out of the pandemic, and anger at the 20% or so who have not had a first dose is misplaced imo.

There are difficult questions here around infrastructure for vaccine delivery, processing of tests, NHS staffing, etc.

I am hopeful that newer/more traditional vaccines will give a longer period of protection.

And some of the pile-ons in this post are shameful.

@LookslovelyinSpringtime

It’s a PERSONAL choice what someone chooses to do with their own body and health. If you are vaccinated, you should be fine. Either you won’t get it it, or you will have mild symptoms. We live in a democracy thank God. It sounds like many people would like to live in a dictatorship.

I’m interested to know if you felt the same about banning smoking in public places.

‘It’s not just about survival rates. People can’t access other healthcare because the hospitals are overwhelmed with covid patients. Need a heart op or a hip replacement? Tough shit.’

No the hospitals are not overwhelmed. Covid beds are currently 5 % of total. Even last winter they were not overwhelmed.

Yes, there are knock on effects undoubtedly. A lot of those caused by previous lockdowns.

At the outset of this pandemic, Imperial College predicted 500,000 deaths if we did nothing.

Almost two years on, we have 150,000 deaths & lots of collateral damage anyway eg 740,000 missed Cancer tests.

Imperial probably won’t be too faraway in the end. Meanwhile, economy also down the tubes, existing not living for two years etc.