A 2-week 'circuit breaker' could be coming after Christmas

[dancingstars]

Reported by The Times and The Guardian which means another NYE stuck indoors...

I gave up seeing my son who lives in Germany for Christmas as we were to drive through France. I have only seen him once after 2 years of COVID restrictions. I also have friends and family who are Drs and nurses. One who works in a COVID ward. They are who I think about when I decided to cancel my Christmas . Not your selfish thoughts of your New Years Eve being cancelled. It is our hospitals and their staff that will suffer from overcrowding with this new variant. Quit being selfish.

Aaaaand here come the Thursday night clapping virtue signalers.

It is possible, you know, to want to enjoy a night out or a break away with pals AND still care about others. You can’t spread a virus you don’t have. Going away to a cottage in the country is hardly on the scale of a premier league match or the Glastonbury festival.

@Kokeshi123

3) WTF does 'move forward' mean? Leave the NHS to get overwhelmed so there is a wider health shutdown - how does that impact all other conditions such as cancer, heart attacks etc?

My position is that if this were to happen, it's the NHS's job to start triaging by "vaccine refusal status" as an emergency measure, and in the meantime build up healthcare capacity for next winter. The UK cannot go on like this year after year.

it's the NHS's job to start triaging by "vaccine refusal status" as an emergency measure This is lala land. Doctors would presumably resign before they refuse treatment to dying people, it is simply not what is done in a civilised society and it is not reasonable for you to use covid as an excuse to destroy the standards that underpin our society.

The UK will bloody well have to go on year after year, if covid goes on whilst we have a government that refuses to do anything to help. What you propose is an end to a functioning and decent country, that is too high a price for me.

@Kokeshi123

3) WTF does 'move forward' mean? Leave the NHS to get overwhelmed so there is a wider health shutdown - how does that impact all other conditions such as cancer, heart attacks etc?

My position is that if this were to happen, it's the NHS's job to start triaging by "vaccine refusal status" as an emergency measure, and in the meantime build up healthcare capacity for next winter. The UK cannot go on like this year after year.

That’s not what medicine is all about. They don’t refuse lung cancer treatment to smokers, heart disease treatment for the obese, trauma surgery for people who injure themselves doing extreme sports and so on. As a society, we are better than that.

hopefully shield the vulnerable

I think if this was a realistic idea, it would already be the plan.

I don't think you can expect doctors to refuse treatment to non-vaxxers imagine how much that would fuck with your head if you had to do that. Even if you were at your wits end with them.
I feel like many of the anti vaxxers should be considered to have fallen for a cult and treated as such not punished for their vulnerability.

@PieMistee

I don't think you can expect doctors to refuse treatment to non-vaxxers imagine how much that would fuck with your head if you had to do that. Even if you were at your wits end with them. I feel like many of the anti vaxxers should be considered to have fallen for a cult and treated as such not punished for their vulnerability.

Yes quite.

Leaving people to die in the street would destroy our society, and the medical staff involved.

I agree it is like a cult, they really believe it.

Medics are absolutely at their wits' end with anti-vaxxers. But the only way they can do their job is to care for everyone, to be compassionate.

@Pixxie7

Something has to be done,my granddaughter has just caught Covid despite being vaccinated fortunately she is fine, but it does make you you wonder just how much efficacy the vaccines have.

Fortunately she is fine That's the efficacy! And what on Earth do you mean 'something has to be done'? Vaccines ARE the something!

Vaccines ARE the something! Vaccines are a very big something, but the UK's 'vaccines only' approach is not working.

@rrhuth

Medics are absolutely at their wits' end with anti-vaxxers. But the only way they can do their job is to care for everyone, to be compassionate.

At this stage it looks like they shouldn’t have mothballed the Nightingale hospitals. If they could just find the staff to run separate Covid facilities in these it would surely help keep the hospitals open to treat cancer, heart attacks, strokes and acute care. I don’t know what can be done about people who don’t want the vaccination. It’s clear that the unvaccinated are taking most of the beds in ICU Covid care, l really feel for the staff going through this again. The Government are doing a terrible job of persuading people that vaccination is both safe and the only way out of this circle of shutdowns.

@Tabbacus

A circuit breakers just kicks it down the road, what's the point? Surely low level restrictions over a longer period are more effective than harsh ones for a short time.

I think that might be the whole point.

They want to spread (and therefore flatten) the curve.

Because that is how the pressure on NHS is withstood. Goes on for longer, but is not overwhelmed

if omicron is that transmittable i dont believe we can stand up to it

@PieMistee

I don't think you can expect doctors to refuse treatment to non-vaxxers imagine how much that would fuck with your head if you had to do that. Even if you were at your wits end with them. I feel like many of the anti vaxxers should be considered to have fallen for a cult and treated as such not punished for their vulnerability.

Make the vaccine mandatory, then you could get the army on the streets, get their address from the NHS. Find some rather strapping soldiers pin them down job done. Even one dose would help the NHS considering vaccine mandates in other countries (Greece) I don't see this causing much issue for the government down the line.

Thank you @StruggleStreet. Had my moan now and feeling better for it.

I think lower level restrictions would be better than a circuit breaker. But it’s businesses like hospitality/retail/leisure I feel sorry for because the government doesn’t want to fund any help.

People have reduced their socialising in the last week but I think the bulk will be because of Christmas and not wanting to get Ill/spread to family members.

Not sure how many people would follow a lockdown banning household contact tbh. I’d probably have friends around for a brew/drink( not a party load) we are all vaccinated, would test and distance a bit.

this is Sage scientists predicting that we need the tougher action

I think finding staff for the Nightingales is wishing for unicorn.

But .... separate Covid facilities ...... would surely help keep the hospitals open to treat cancer, heart attacks, strokes and acute care is correct. Two London trusts got together in the first wave and cooped somehow the local private hospital (with an ICU) and kept cancer services going by moving them over there. Not everywhere will have that as an option.

So yes, I think it is likely that we shall need to see the return of infectious disease wards/wings/hospitals. Which will need access to all services - because you might not get covid only when you don't need treatment for anything else or are not pregnant.

@BlackCatz

Not your selfish thoughts of your New Years Eve being cancelled. It is our hospitals and their staff that will suffer from overcrowding with this new variant. Quit being selfish

Selfish, selfish, selfish.

That word has gotten so fucking boring now.

Yes, it's really boring for those of us who have to do extra shifts in the NHS

Do you think there will be any more press conferences etc from the government before Christmas now?

@Pixxie7

Something has to be done,my granddaughter has just caught Covid despite being vaccinated fortunately she is fine, but it does make you you wonder just how much efficacy the vaccines have.

So she's fine? So the vaccine worked yes?

@Kate3150

Do you think there will be any more press conferences etc from the government before Christmas now?

Depends what going on. Better if they don't have then unless there's something to announce (further homilies on getting booster jab not making that threshold now, surely)

But when cases hit the 100,000 a day - not so far off - and are still rising (doubling every 3-4 days?) then they might feel they have to say something

And yes, it's going on a long time, and what was selfish as the start is selfish during each and every wave it's not boring, the timelines of pandemic. It doesn't go away because people think it's too long. Right at the start of wave 1 they noted that timing of restrictions was chosen with behavioural aspects in mind, as keeping going wouid not come easily. Still true

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/two-week-omicron-circuit-breaker-would-ban-meetings-indoors-pdg0bntjt

Schools and shops won’t close. This circuit break involves not meeting people indoors (good luck with enforcing that 🤣), pubs and restaurants limited to table service outside. Shielding will be back and weddings and funerals limited to 15 to 30 people.

@rrhuth

Medics are absolutely at their wits' end with anti-vaxxers. But the only way they can do their job is to care for everyone, to be compassionate.

Why not impose a lockdown on the unvaccinated?

They make up the vast majority of those who are most ill with covid in our trust.

They need to start realising there are consequences to their actions.

[quote PieMistee]@Crimsonripple it's a cold for most but a small percentage still end up in hospital and a small percentage ofseveral million will block up all the hospitals. Leading to crisis.
God if they shut the schools again I will cry.[/quote]
Children are 20% more likely to be hospitalised with this variant.
I am a teacher and terrified of being back in

Class ( primary) with no children vaccinated and windows open to stop me catching an airborne virus (50 plus here)

Terrified of being back in the classroom where after all the families mixing!( not me as I won't be)