Wtf is going on??!!

[NearlyDown]

I actually think it’s quite scary and a bit strange the amount of people who are happy to have their human rights taken away.

For the record I’m fully vaccinated and I think that the vaccine is brilliant, but it is a medical procedure and I don’t think people that have made the decision not to have said medical procedure should then not be able to participate in society.

This is not at all normal, I can see the hospital beds are getting overwhelmed but this is likely because of viruses that haven’t been able to run through the population normally are making people very poorly.

Which means that this will happen every winter forevermore if we don’t let humans, vaccinated or not just get on with life.

I don’t get it. You know there are people in iron lungs, don’t you? When Salk and Sabin came on the market, I don’t think anyone asked about human rights. They just took the first vaccination offered to them.

You do know, don’t you, that polio hasn’t died out? It’s just held at bay. Look around you. How many people with it do you see? Do you not realise that everyone who follows an approved vaccination schedule from birth receives a vaccination for polio? And diphtheria? And a whole heap of others? Look up post-polio syndrome. Some of the effects can be life long.

This

I have an aunt who suffered with polio as a child. Still suffers with the consequences today both physically and mentally.

The government seem to be making laws without carefully considering any minority opinions

Will those with minority opinions vote for them in a couple of years time at the next GE ? Will they be able to persuade more of the majority that their opinion is right ? If not, then I can't see them giving a stuff to be honest.

Wonder how people would have reacted if this affected children only like it has elderly and sick and obviously healthy adults.....

The thing is Mumsnet is deleting posts and throwing out posters that counter these extreme bigoted views that are saturating posts like these.

Mumsnet itself is providing a breeding ground for bigotry. They should be reported. Who do we alert about this?

I'm with you OP.

The worrying thing that has struck me about this, is how it’s brought into focus the massive difference in rules for “us” and “them”.

While desperate single parents were being fined for taking their toddler to the park and daring to have a snack (being labelled a picnic!), the likes of Dominic Cummings were travelling around the country sightseeing.
While people were prevented from visiting their loved ones at Christmas, Downing Street had parties.

At times it’s felt to me as if we’re being laughed at - us stupid peasants following the rules, while Boris strides around a hospital without a mask on.
I’ve always known that senior politicians looked after number 1, but I never imagined they would simply break laws with absolutely no meaningful comeback. That is what truly terrifies me.

@Potwoman

The thing is Mumsnet is deleting posts and throwing out posters that counter these extreme bigoted views that are saturating posts like these.

Mumsnet itself is providing a breeding ground for bigotry. They should be reported. Who do we alert about this?

Report the post

Interesting first post OP or 1st post following name change there.
I wonder why?

, this goverment rules by instilling fear , the minute they start issuing mandates again , vast members of the public obediantly comply again , it is turning into a dictatorship , and we are being ruled by tyranny ,

And we know that half of Johnson's Government won't bother to comply with the rules. Wasn't Rees-Mogg sounding off a few weeks back about how they didn't need to wear masks because they were all jolly pals together? Or Boris Johnson not wearing a mask in a theatre - well, OK, no one needs to go to the theatre, but taking it off in a hospital, inexcusable. Then again last year, when people were not having elderly relatives round for Christmas lunch, but just going to stand in their garden and greet them through the window, Downing Street was holding boozy parties.

So yes, when we see them setting an example - that will be the time to make it compulsory.

I think Germany will regret this decision.
I am happy to have any jabs offered but making them mandatory changes things a little.
Nudging people to get vaccinated may be more effective in the long term than forcing them.

Has anyone else noticed that the people merrily going on with their lives and accepting the odd restriction and popping on a facemask are being told they are living in fear by people who are 'terrified' ?

Cross post with Bagamoyo there.

Obeying the rules has caused people real distress with not being able to see relatives, some of whom have subsequently died, and to see Johnson and cronies just taking the piss really annoys me.

Who are “they” - always seen people say “they” are taking away our rights/forcing this/covering up that/lying about covid numbers

But who the bloody hell do you cuckoo pots think THEY are?!?

It’s a global pandemic, if you think there is some massive collusion between all world leaders, scientists, news reporters etc so we can be “controlled” or have our “human rights” removed you are simply bonkers.

And on that logic what are we going to be controlled into doing? Working and paying our taxes? Because I have some news for you if you think that’s bad....

@Hairwizard

Agree op. About time someone said it. Those of you thinking its different its another country we dont do that here, i would say dont be so sure. Look at what has been going on this last 2 years, would you have believed anyone had they told you 2 years ago we would be at this point? Scares me the amount of folk on here who are ok with whats going on. Its not ok. Its not right.

People have been saying this on MN and elsewhere for ages. The government does not seem to be short of very useful vocal people providing a distraction about public health measures while it quietly dismantles U.K. democracy. And those people have been guiding it’s pandemic policy since the start. It’s why everything is too little, too late and we came out of a lockdown way too early last November and ended up screwing Christmas.

The Tories are busy creating an elected dictatorship but it has nothing to do with anything they’ve put in place for Covid.

I agree, OP. It's scary. Australia too.

@Xmasprrssiehelp

Who are “they” - always seen people say “they” are taking away our rights/forcing this/covering up that/lying about covid numbers

But who the bloody hell do you cuckoo pots think THEY are?!?

It’s a global pandemic, if you think there is some massive collusion between all world leaders, scientists, news reporters etc so we can be “controlled” or have our “human rights” removed you are simply bonkers.

And on that logic what are we going to be controlled into doing? Working and paying our taxes? Because I have some news for you if you think that’s bad....

I have wondered this. I think people put 'they' because they're not sure who they need to be angry with, it covers every possibility of anyone that could have wronged them...

On one hand, I agree that authoritarian shifts in government is a concern that should be monitored and restricted in power even in these trying times.

I do not know about Germany, but I worry how this would be managed in the UK particularly when the only way to prove status involves an app that isn't universally accessible. The government could end up trapping our most vulnerable whether or not they've had the vaccine.

On the other hand, human rights is a human concept which shifts around and it's fair enough to debate about what we think should be included. I mean, a man's right to his wife's body is still considered true in some circles...

all the conspiracy nuts have been saying for years "they" will soon have us carrying ID card with us everywhere we go, we aren't too far away from that now with covid passports.

As already said this already happens in other countries without much consequence, and the UK has had non-EU immigrants doing so for several years (not sure if EU migrants have now been added to that). I paid over £300 twice (some required to "private partners") to regain my rights to employment, housing and access to public services that I had for years before those cards came in.

It sucked, but I kinda miss that ID card now my new citizenship means I've lost the right to have it, a universally accepted ID that isn't a passport or connected to driving. Many countries have had universal state ID not connected to those for years, even ones that don't require it. The UK is far behind on this - I think in a world where we're continuously asked to prove who we are, accessible universally accepted ID should be a right.

Governments are 'damned if they do, and damned if they don't'.

They have to tread a fine line between protecting their citizens and respecting their freedom of choice.

When the first lockdown came there were people yelling that it was implemented too late. Had it come sooner the 'human rights' lobby would have been yelling about erosion of their freedom of choice.

There is always an increase in respiratory illness in winter, especially among the elderly. Hospital mortuaries become full, so additional refrigerated storage has to be obtained. This cost of this is humungous and is added to the bill.

The following is from just one London Borough last year - imagine that repeated across all Boroughs ;

"Report summary
This report outlines the contribution required from Lambeth to meet the costs of London-wide temporary
mortuary provision and mortality management for a possible second wave of Covid-19 deaths over the
winter of 2020/21. Westminster and Camden are leading on the arrangements and financing.
Finance summary
The total cost of temporary mortuary provision for London for the period to March 2021 is £16.150m.
Lambeth’s share of this is £588,928, which is required for payment to Camden by 4 September 2020. The
cost would be met from the Bereavement Services revenue budget and the Council will seek to recover
this from central government"

Which Magic Money Tree should be used to pay for this OP?

I had my two jabs but never expected to be called again for a booster after only three months. Somehow with the high uptake in this country may me wonder if it is the unvaccinated?

The U.K. has a weird objection to ID cards and I don’t know why. Even weirder is that I suspect that objection might still be there when I.D is required to vote.

@beastlyslumber

I agree, OP. It's scary. Australia too.

How is it scary in Australia?

@AllisoninWunderland Brilliant post from you at 08.11

@AllisoninWunderland At 08.12, so true what you say about people giving up rights by allowing vaccines to be compulsory. The precedent is very dangerous.

Which Magic Money Tree should be used to pay for this OP?

From the same Magic Money Forest which found £37 billion for the failed track and trace system and which paid eye watering sums to Johnson and Hancock's chums for useless PPE equipment.

It’s scary how many people think it is ok to segregate society like we are starting to see in a few European countries. It is true that in the Uk in main the restrictions are not a huge problem but how many countries are now going to go dow the route of making the vaccine a legal requirement or you are excluded from society. What happens to those who don’t get jabbed? Do they lose their jobs, their right to a place in society and ultimately surely their lives? I don’t know how you continue to support yourself and family if you lose your job.

Of course currently it is a small proportion of jobs that require vaccine but if Germany say unvaccinated can only have 2 contacts outside of household surely that means they can’t work?

But this is all ok????