Page 4 | If the government were honest about the next 4 months

RuleWithAWoodenFoot · 2021-08-27T11:10:57+00:00

They'd say that children are probably going to catch covid, there is nothing to stop this happening. Lots of families will probably catch it off their children, school staff will probably catch it off children too. Education is going to be disrupted again if the above happens. No way around it. But it could be 'over' by November when the bad weather kicks in and older folk start getting ill as per usual circumstances. At that point booster vaccs could start. It's definitely 'an approach', but not telling people that this is the plan is unfair. Do you think people have realised this yet? Or are the Emperor's new clothes still in view?

Cornettoninja · 27/08/2021 14:19

@Peteycat if you can’t explain why you think flu/covid vaccines are different how is anyone meant to answer why they’re the same?

What are you talking about? The molecular structure? The availability of manufacturing? The cost? The logistics? The vaccine efficacy? Societal perception? The number of variants of the virus they target? I mean what exactly makes an annual covid jab different to an annual flu jab (theoretically)?

Petardos · 27/08/2021 14:21

Boris has already said that we need to start living with the virus. I really do not know what else people wants. If they say something is because they said and it was a lie. If they do not say much if because they are being not honest.

Most people I know are trying to make the most of how it is.

BittaOrange · 27/08/2021 14:21

@Peteycat

Why are you talking about booster vaccs like its normal? They said two jabs, all sweet. It's not though is it?

Another doom mongering thread....

By ‘doom mongering’ do you mean realistic?

dworky · 27/08/2021 14:22

@Peteycat

Why are you talking about booster vaccs like its normal? They said two jabs, all sweet. It's not though is it?

Another doom mongering thread....

They've said a lot of things that have turned out to be incorrect. It's hardly OP's fault.

NannyAndJohn · 27/08/2021 14:28

@Peteycat

What I don't understand is that you trusted the government enough to take the vaccine I assume? But now you don't agree with their approach going into Autumn. I'm finding this so bizarre.

The government aren't the ones who made the vaccine.

herecomesthsun · 27/08/2021 14:41

@Frederica852

The reality is we've done everything we can to slow the spread and protect the vulnerable. We have to just get on with life now - it's sad but it's true, humanity has been defeated by nature

We're doing very little compared with similar nations. Apparently, Germany has mandated use of medical grade masks until next year. Their infection rate is currently about 1/6th of ours. There are very few mitigations in our schools generally. We could do a lot more than just throw in the towel and watch the hospital admissions rise.

Peteycat · 27/08/2021 14:55

Yea well I just get bored of all the armchair politicians, scientists, everyone on here seems to work in that field or have inside knowledge etc etc. The truth is, none of you know anything, your just speculating.

I stand by my point of doom mongering.

Original poster

RuleWithAWoodenFoot · 27/08/2021 14:59

I would be very worried if I lived with anyone ecv or had a child that was ecv.

Yes, but they've now said that children aren't CEV or CV. Or something like that.

I work in estates so obviously there are impacts getting space prepared for this.

Interesting.

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herecomesthsun · 27/08/2021 15:05

@Petardos

Boris has already said that we need to start living with the virus. I really do not know what else people wants. If they say something is because they said and it was a lie. If they do not say much if because they are being not honest.

Most people I know are trying to make the most of how it is.

"Living with the virus" could mean getting the full vaccination rate above 62%, advising use of masks more strongly, working with schools to increase ventilation.

Or it could mean just pretending covid doesn't exist and watching as vulnerable people get admitted to hospital and die.

Can I choose "living with the virus" like the Germans, please?

herecomesthsun · 27/08/2021 15:06

@Peteycat

Yea well I just get bored of all the armchair politicians, scientists, everyone on here seems to work in that field or have inside knowledge etc etc. The truth is, none of you know anything, your just speculating.

I stand by my point of doom mongering.

your "doom -mongering" = having some grip on reality

Peteycat · 27/08/2021 15:09

Herecomesthesun, my interpretation of reality is clearly different to yours. Again, you have shown on many threads that you want restrictions in place etc. We cannot continue to live like that. In my world, that is having a grip on reality.

herecomesthsun · 27/08/2021 15:13

@Peteycat

Herecomesthesun, my interpretation of reality is clearly different to yours. Again, you have shown on many threads that you want restrictions in place etc. We cannot continue to live like that. In my world, that is having a grip on reality.

I don't "want" a lot of " restrictions in place". If people behaved more intelligently off their own bat, we would need far less government intervention.

And yes, we could live like Germany, for example. They seem to be doing quite well right now.

Original poster

RuleWithAWoodenFoot · 27/08/2021 15:17

Just seen this bit of info:

UK civil servants have been told to "work on the assumption" that no more "significant restictions" either on economy or society will be imposed - so long as COVID deaths "do not consistently exceed 1 000 a week".

That's 143 a day. Which we're already pretty near. So...

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turnshavetabled · 27/08/2021 15:19

@RuleWithAWoodenFoot yes I saw that. Wondered if they released it so we could all do the maths and work out what's coming. Very annoying!

SonnetForSpring · 27/08/2021 15:23

Interesting. Where did you see that?

Original poster

RuleWithAWoodenFoot · 27/08/2021 15:24

so we could all do the maths and work out what's coming

That bit is the interesting bit for me - I'm just wondering who has worked out what probably/possibly/might happen. They could just be honest with us, although honesty is not a feature of this government.

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Cornettoninja · 27/08/2021 15:26

@Petardos for me I want more of an honest idea what the plan is for living with it.

We live with norovirus and that entails 48hrs off work/school and in particularly bad outbreaks can mean schools closed for deep cleaning or hospitals closing wards to visitors. We live with chicken pox and keeping those infected isolated until their spots have scabbed. We live with MRSA which means precautions before surgery that didn’t used to exist in my experience.

Given how prevalent covid is in society it’s going to have an impact until it’s burned through the majority of those most susceptible to it, even with vaccinations. That amount of illness will have an impact. How could it not? I’d quite like to know the plan for covid and how healthcare services are going to be expanded to accommodate it.

In a ‘normal’ pandemic we still feel the effects. I think it was swine flu (2009ish?) where they raised the self-certify sickness period to 14 days instead of 7 and a load of people lost their grips trying to get hold of Tamiflu… to my mind, the vaccinations for covid have lowered the threat level of this pandemic, lowered not completely erased and now we’re at a more previously practiced point that still requires active management and monitoring.

Peteycat · 27/08/2021 15:30

Herecomesthesun, your post is indeed insulting. People behaved more intelligently. Oh dear, so you seem to think you are superior. Well I'm here to tell you that you are not. There are other factors in this pandemic to consider. I won't list them here as it gets tiresome.

Most people have had enough and like I say to everyone, if you want restrictions go away and have them. Stop virtue signalling about how fabulous and unselfish you are.

SonnetForSpring · 27/08/2021 15:30

Just seen this in the guardian- Two UK government advisers reportedly said that prime minister Boris Johnson has privately accepted an average of 1,000 Covid-related deaths in the UK per week and would “only consider imposing further restrictions if that figure looked like it could rise above 50,000” per year.

Cornettoninja · 27/08/2021 15:35

@Peteycat

Herecomesthesun, your post is indeed insulting. People behaved more intelligently. Oh dear, so you seem to think you are superior. Well I'm here to tell you that you are not. There are other factors in this pandemic to consider. I won't list them here as it gets tiresome.

Most people have had enough and like I say to everyone, if you want restrictions go away and have them. Stop virtue signalling about how fabulous and unselfish you are.

Given you posted very early in this thread that you were self-appointed spokesperson of the people this post is practically dripping in hypocrisy.

You only speak for yourself.

PicsInRed · 27/08/2021 15:41

@Peteycat

No it's not for a virus that's very mild to children.

Literally we do this for flu.

Healthy children mass vaccinated to protect the elderly and vulnerable. In school. En masse. Annually.

Literally we already do this.

turnshavetabled · 27/08/2021 15:43

@SonnetForSpring @RuleWithAWoodenFoot

I wonder if he wants to start from scratch it 2022. I hate to break it to him but think he's missed the target for this year!

Original poster

RuleWithAWoodenFoot · 27/08/2021 15:44

“only consider imposing further restrictions if that figure looked like it could rise above 50,000” per year

That's the number of excess deaths in a bad flu year, so seems about 'right' to suggest as a limit. I wonder if that would be in addition to flu though - because if so, the NHS is overwhelmed. It already is in a heavy flu year.

We live with norovirus and that entails 48hrs off work/school and in particularly bad outbreaks can mean schools closed for deep cleaning or hospitals closing wards to visitors. We live with chicken pox and keeping those infected isolated until their spots have scabbed.

Considering that, it would make sense that the 10 day isolation stays in place. Let's hope it does.

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NotMyCat · 27/08/2021 15:45

@lightand immunocompromised are to definitely be offered boosters I understand (any age)
I'm 36 and my consultant said I should be offered one fairly shortly

Peteycat · 27/08/2021 15:47

Given you posted very early in this thread that you were self-appointed spokesperson of the people this post is practically dripping in hypocrisy.

You only speak for yourself.

Well someone has to challenge the crap on here. Honestly people are tired of the nonsense.