96 dead today...

[Homeontherangeuk]

But Boris knows what he's doing...

@Manista

In 2018 there were 27,142 deaths from influenza and pneumonia in England alone. If we accept that covid is going to become part of life, like flu, sadly there will always be some deaths.

No way comparable.

Not that many fewer - nearly 20,000 - people are dead from Covid in London alone.

More than 150,000 in total across the UK.

And, this is a novel virus (that is potentially engineered in a lab - the Wuhan Institute of Virology). The risks have never been just about death. We're still only learning about the damage that it can cause. Long Covid.

@Staffy1, I haven't read the full thread, but asking for all kids to be vaccinated won't solve much, if anything. Vanishingly few people under 20 have died of COVID, and most of them would have been CEV for other reasons. As a % of the UK's population, the deaths would be within a normal range once RTAs and drowning on inflatables, climbing, falling off ladders, or in swimming pools are included in the equation. There are deaths across the age range in every single age group every single day: each one is a personal tragedy, but as statistical evidence of trends, largely irrelevant and useless as a guide to shape government decision-making.

Its time for people to get a grip. If they dont want to work - dont. Change jobs etc

Agree.

I think Nanny only learnt the word ‘exponential’ in March 2020.

And the expression ‘baked in’.

Nanny - you say ‘we’ aren’t going out? Does that mean your family / children? They are going to have much longer lasting psychological effects than Covid could inflict if you are this doom and anxiety inducing in front of them.

"Not that many fewer - nearly 20,000 - people are dead from Covid in London alone.

More than 150,000 in total across the UK."

Yes, you're right. The point I'm making is that if the vaccination programme is working (as it appears to could be from the infection and death rate) then the death rates at the moment, when compared to influenza, are not significantly high. If they climb a lot more then of course it's something else and we'll probably end up in some sort of lockdown again. But when flu death rates are at this level they aren't even commented on.
I know - it's bloody horrible if anyone dies. It will be terrible if covid does increase dramatically. I'm saying that even when we think it's been cracked, there will be infections and deaths.

@NannyAndJohn

No surprise to anyone who understands the concept of exponential growth.

What about those that know what 100k is?

If I were BoJo, I think I would end the school year now. It only means losing three or four days.

@Blessex

Look. For all those who want to live a life locked down and masked then please go ahead. For the rest of us who have done this for 18 months and are now double jabbed, we are through with it. My parents want to spend their last few years playing with their grandchildren. Young adults want to find their soulmates and party. Kids need education and social skills. Everyone needs company and hugs. Covid is shit yes. But now we are vaccinated there is little else we can do. Cases will rise and will keep rising. But this virus is here to stay. So those who want to live a life of lockdown then carry on. For those who want to start living again in what is already a short life - then please let them.

this. we are all doubly vaccinated and i will continue to avoid large crowds especially indoors. I wear my mask when going into shops even though v v few cases in my area now. However, life is short and the effect on mental health, employment and relationships is significant. So really there comes a point when we have to start going out. I am in favour of vaccine passports but imagine variants could go on for years. and masks are a good idea. what are the death rates of car journeys? yet we get into them all the time instead of walking/cycling/public transport. I have strictly obeyed all rules with no complaints and indeed gone further but I am done.

OK @Homeontherangeuk

There were 8808 deaths registered in England and Wales for the week ending July 2, 2021, fewer than the average for this week between 2015 and 2019. Now today you say 96 from or with covid. The highest in a while. Now put that against the average weekly death rate from all causes. When you do that you gain PERSPECTIVE and understand that people die every single day of the year from ALL CAUSES - it isn't only covid deaths that matter - got it yet?

@Tealightsandd

American data strongly suggests that Pfizer and Moderna work very well at preventing hospitalisations and deaths

They're calling it the pandemic of the unvaccinated over there.

Do they? Just wait for another week or two twitter.com/camus37/status/1417483543102566408?s=21

www.statista.com/statistics/1111804/weekly-deaths-in-england-and-wales/

above figures were from

@LemonSwan

*I repeat again, many 30 (and 20) year olds, despite booking their jabs at first availability, are not able to get their second until late August or September.

Despite this they are expected to go into work, use public transport etc with no mitigations in place, when cases are rising dramatically*

Hate to be blunt but so what. They are not CEV or they would have been double vaxxed. I worked through the whole of this thing in a high risk environment on minimum wage. Like many other essential workers.

Its time for people to get a grip. If they dont want to work - dont. Change jobs etc.

So what indeed?

Continuing some mitigations like masks and SD would make a difference in reducing transmission whilst still allowing the roadmap to progress as planned whilst the vaccination programme continues.

It's not lockdown or no lockdown, which seems to be lost on a lot of posters

Ultimately, the lockdowns were because the NHS was overwhelmed and couldn't cope.

Now they're not overwhelmed, the Government are happy to open everything up again.

I saw this on the news earlier, it said in smaller writing "from any cause" or words to that effect. Not all will be due to Covid. Without knowing the breakdown it's hard to say

@Heyhohi

Yes breakthrough mild infections.

In America double jabbed can experience breakthrough infections - but they are rarely anything other than mild.

The CDC is saying that fully jabbed are rarely needing hospital. And almost 100% of the deaths (in America) are in the unvaccinated.

Continuing some mitigations like masks and SD would make a difference in reducing transmission whilst still allowing the roadmap to progress as planned whilst the vaccination programme continues.

It's not lockdown or no lockdown, which seems to be lost on a lot of posters

I think some to some posters the economic and other impact of SD is lost.

While 150,000 deaths caused by COVID is a shocking statistic, especially if one of them was a person you loved, it remains a fairly moderate population loss compared to past pandemics. In 1367, the Black Death slashed the UK's population by one-third or slightly more. And as a result, England dumped serfdom to allow mobility of labour and incomes and livelihoods improved for the majority.

@duffeldaisy

It's not only elderly, frail people dying. (Though they do make the majority). Today there were 5 people under the age of 60, and it's increasing all the time. Yes, it's low figures, but it's not acceptable.

0-9: 0% (0)
10-19: 0% (0)
20-29: 3.13% (1)
30-39: 3.13% (1)
40-49: 3.13% (1)
50-59: 6.25% (2)
60-69: 9.38% (3)
70-79: 25.00% (8)
80-89: 37.50% (12)
90+: 12.50% (4)

Is in only acceptable to you when no-one dies of covid?

You don't know the comorbidities of the individuals that died in your stats.

Thousands of people die every single week in the UK from a range of causes yet people like you only seem to focus on COVID - there are other killers you know - have a google.

@XingMing

Staffy was asking for vulnerable children to have been offered the vaccine. So forthat group, it could be statistically relevant.

In general, getting kids as a whole vaccinated is less about cutting deaths in kids and more about cutting transmission and the evolution of new strains that the vaccines may not work against. And so protecting the population as a whole. But when we're talking about CEV kids, cutting deaths is also an issue.

@MarshaBradyo

Continuing some mitigations like masks and SD would make a difference in reducing transmission whilst still allowing the roadmap to progress as planned whilst the vaccination programme continues.

It's not lockdown or no lockdown, which seems to be lost on a lot of posters

I think some to some posters the economic and other impact of SD is lost.

Again, it's not SD or no SD

Basic things like masks and distancing in supermarkets doesn't impact the economy. Distancing in other areas like hospitality does, which is why these areas need to be prioritised for the lifting of such measures.

There are steps that can be taken that can reduce spread, it's not all or nothing, which is why "freedom day" is so frustrating.

Continuing some mitigations like masks and SD would make a difference in reducing transmission whilst still allowing the roadmap to progress as planned whilst the vaccination programme continues.

These are all within your own/ an individuals control. Honestly no idea what you want here.

@namcybotwinbloom

I saw this on the news earlier, it said in smaller writing "from any cause" or words to that effect. Not all will be due to Covid. Without knowing the breakdown it's hard to say

Equally we need to know how many died more than 28 days after a positive test.

Also, study a while back found that a significant proportion of patients - around 1/3 - of apparently recovered and discharged from hospital, died in the next couple of months. Of course because they were no longer testing positive, the deaths were recorded as heart attacks or strokes or blood clots.

French serfs didn't get the same freedom until 1789. By which time England's Industrial Revolution was in full swing.

@LemonSwan

Continuing some mitigations like masks and SD would make a difference in reducing transmission whilst still allowing the roadmap to progress as planned whilst the vaccination programme continues.

These are all within your own/ an individuals control. Honestly no idea what you want here.

eh?

These measures aren't within an individuals control, there needs to be clear government guidance.

Measures such as masks and SD in some contexts need to be advised on a population level. They have little adverse effects compared to other NPIs, but help reduce spread.

Basic things like masks and distancing in supermarkets

I haven’t been to supermarket yet but have been to local store and on train each day.

Masks at over 85% on train and local store still only four people and masks.

It hasn’t changed in many places so it is close to what you’d like, here in this area of London anyway