100,000 cases a day by August....bloody hell

[ssd]

We're all going to get it eventually it seems

No one should be on here telling other posters to "stop" thats the role of MNHQ, not any of us, scroll on if you find it boring.

[quote Kazzyhoward]**@Indigopearl* I think the key thing is to maintain the measures which don't impact on the economy until vaccination levels improve. Just a couple of months would really help. Herd immunity through vaccination is far preferable to herd immunity through infection.*

All measures WILL impact on the economy. Pubs, restaurants, hairdressers, cafes, gyms, etc etc can't operate at normal capacity if they have to social distance. That means smaller profits (or losses) thus less tax revenue, more furlough claims, more likelihood of business failure/bankruptcy, etc. How much longer can nightclubs stave off bankruptcy if they're not allowed to open? There isn't a single precaution that doesn't affect the economy (maybe mask wearing I suppose but that seems to have minimal effect anyway). The precautions/restrictions which cut and reduce infection rates are ALL about closure of businesses.[/quote]
Not doing anything will also affect the economy. I know lots of vulnerable people now too worried to go out and spend money because people are no longer wearing masks. The requirements for self isolation due to the high case numbers will impact the economy. The extra burden on the health service in the long term from the untreated conditions will impact the economy. The costs of threating long covid will impact the economy. A new variant which is more probable from high cases and partial vaccination will affect the economy, disrupted education will affect the economy in the long term.

I am not saying nightclubs and other businesses should not open at all just that there should be reasonable mitigation measures and clear legislation on these rather than a free for all which allows the government to absolve all responsibily to the population when it goes belly up in a couple of months.

I do hope I am wrong though....

@jasjas1973

No one should be on here telling other posters to "stop" thats the role of MNHQ, not any of us, scroll on if you find it boring.

It's not boring, it's just never ending nonsense from the same posters over and over again who clearly think they have some kind of agenda but are actually just, well, I don't want to put the word cause it'll just get reported. Nothing nannyandjohn says is right, ever. People know to ignore I suppose after so long. So suppose I should. In fact, is there a way to just hide or block users?

@TheVampiresWife Sorry, I meant masks in shops and on public transport (not that I support this but it doesn’t really impact the economy). Agree the hospitality sector has been shafted. Hopefully they’ll do away with social distancing soon.

I am fully supportive of all measures being dropped and if someone wants to carry on wearing a mask then fine. But it’s optional.

@Delatron

The only measure that doesn’t impact the economy is mask wearing.....

Except it does...

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/inews.co.uk/news/politics/ministers-ditched-face-masks-after-being-warned-the-economy-would-lose-billions-1089589/amp

@jasjas1973

No one should be on here telling other posters to "stop" thats the role of MNHQ, not any of us, scroll on if you find it boring.

I agree, but the constant groundless doomy predictions and speculation, even in the face of evidence to the contrary, does get a little wearing. I can't imagine it's particularly helpful to those struggling with anxiety/MH issues at the moment either. It's pretty irresponsible of certain posters (who claim to be so concerned about the wellbeing of others, ironically).

The problem is posters like @NannyAndJohn are utterly prolific. The minute a thread is started they are all over it with their doom and gloom. It leads to a very unbalanced board and many of us like to challenge that (with actual facts and science).

Rather than ‘mark my words there will be exponential growth’ based on nothing.

It’s not a discussion board if we leave these views unchallenged. Though it does get tiresome, I’ll agree with that.

@Indigopearl I am not saying nightclubs and other businesses should not open at all just that there should be reasonable mitigation measures and clear legislation on these rather than a free for all which allows the government to absolve all responsibily to the population when it goes belly up in a couple of months.

We had all that, but it wasn't enforced properly. Local councils and police applied a scattergun approach, i.e. fining people having a picnic in a park but ignoring large gatherings such as black lives matter protests.

It's stupid and counter productive to have laws/regulations that can't be properly policed/enforced.

Pubs, restaurants, nightclubs, etc., can't afford to hire security staff to enforce mask wearing etc., and it's not possible to ask existing waiting/serving staff to do the job of security staff.

Basically, even when some/many of the covid restrictions were legally enforceable, it was still reliant on the goodwill of the people to actually comply with the law. Ergo, voluntary!

Ok I take it back about mask wearing! I don’t even support it anyway!
I had no idea it impacted the economy though so thanks for that.

@Kazzyhoward A lockdown is the last thing I want, but it's probably our only option now.

If we had reintroduced low-level restrictions when cases started to rise (as I kept suggesting), then maybe we wouldn't be in the situation we're currently in.

I don’t go out shopping at the moment because I hate wearing masks. From the 19th July I still won't go out shopping because Delta is out of control and I would prefer not to catch it and bring it home to my family. I won't shop normally until the virus has settled into a more normal endemic pattern. That will take time.

[quote NannyAndJohn]@Kazzyhoward A lockdown is the last thing I want, but it's probably our only option now.

If we had reintroduced low-level restrictions when cases started to rise (as I kept suggesting), then maybe we wouldn't be in the situation we're currently in.[/quote]
Why would low level restrictions (what do you mean by that?) have stopped growth then when low level restriction aren't stopping growth now?

They are effective, @Horehound, but we need 87% fully vaccinated for herd immunity.

We're nowhere near that.

@Delatron

The problem is posters like *@NannyAndJohn* are utterly prolific. The minute a thread is started they are all over it with their doom and gloom. It leads to a very unbalanced board and many of us like to challenge that (with actual facts and science).

Rather than ‘mark my words there will be exponential growth’ based on nothing.

It’s not a discussion board if we leave these views unchallenged. Though it does get tiresome, I’ll agree with that.

My suggestions are all based upon the current data.

@Sunshinegirl82 By low-level restrictions I mean no indoor mixing, pubs and restaurants being outdoors only, and no holidays (including UK holidays).

I agree with @Delatron and @Horehound. I completely understand that some people are very anxious about Covid and “doommongering” is a symptom of that…but the behaviour of @NannyAndJohn is something different. She relishes in her wild predictions and wants to say “I told you so” at every opportunity. That behaviour is very detrimental to those people who are genuinely anxious.

@NannyAndJohn there are currently less than 3,000 people in hospital WITH Covid (not because of) across all of the UK and you think locking down is our only option?

And who did you suggest introducing ‘low level restrictions’ to? Just MN?! Because I don’t think Boris reads here.

You need help.

news out but they are still ploughing full steam ahead, do our Gov really never learn?

inews.co.uk/news/politics/new-covid-19-variant-may-have-emerged-in-north-east-surge-1094420

[quote NannyAndJohn]@Sunshinegirl82 By low-level restrictions I mean no indoor mixing, pubs and restaurants being outdoors only, and no holidays (including UK holidays).[/quote]
Those are not low level restrictions, that is akin to another lockdown. I cannot accept that another lockdown is indicated when 90% of the adult population has antibodies.

Javid is saying now that there will be extra pressure on the NHS.

The NHS has no capacity to handle this, if we had EU levels of HC, then fair enough but we don't.

We have to play the cards we have.

@NannyAndJohn we are unlikely to ever get to 87 per cent vaccinated. Even if vaccinations were introduced for 12+ then many parents would say no. So are you suggesting that “low level” restrictions should stay forever?! And I don’t think that no holidays whatsoever is a low level restriction!

[quote NannyAndJohn]@Sunshinegirl82 By low-level restrictions I mean no indoor mixing, pubs and restaurants being outdoors only, and no holidays (including UK holidays).[/quote]
Those are not low level restrictions.

My suggestions are all based upon the current data

Well, no, that's not true is it. Because when posters present you with the current data which doesn't match your agenda, you choose to ignore it.

@NannyAndJohn where are you getting your figures from for herd immunity???

Well maybe the NHS just isn't bloody adequate then! I do wonder why we Cceot a sub standard level of care and we all had to endure three shitty lockdowns so at not to overwhelm the NHS.
The lockdowns were never about saving lives it was always about not breaking the NHS. If it can't cope after millions and millions of people are vaccinated, then maybe it's time to go.