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Original poster

Under 40s may also be advised to avoid AZ

168 replies

MimiPigeon · 09/04/2021 10:35

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/04/08/vaccines-advice-could-still-change-30s-jcvi-suggests/

Sorry I don’t have a share token. But it looks like JCVI is suggesting that people in their 30s may also be advised not to take AZ. This could be a game changer for 30 somethings who are still trying to make a decision about whether to get vaccinated in the near future.

OP posts:
rbe78 · 09/04/2021 11:50

I saw some stats on FB (I know, I know) last night regarding the risk of blood clots from the AZ vaccine vs. the risk of blood clots from the combined contraceptive pill.

You are several thousand times more likely to get a blood clot from the pill than the AZ vaccine.

Undecided whether this highlights the relative low risk of the AZ vaccine, or the relative high risk that huge numbers of women are expected to undertake without anyone blinking! Both I guess.

Bottom line is, the risk of the AZ vaccine is tiny.

Oh, and a slightly more reputable source than FB! www.theguardian.com/society/2021/apr/09/contraception-blood-clot-risk-public-need-better-access-to-advice

Daisydoor12 · 09/04/2021 11:51

@Roonerspismed I’m with you. I can’t believe a 2 way conversation with the government isn’t taking place. If they came out and said AZ not to be used in under 50s our vaccination programme grinds to a near halt. So far it’s potentially the only thing the government have done well but time will tell maybe we’ve been far too quick off the mark and ignoring another negative unlike say Norway.

Daisydoor12 · 09/04/2021 11:53

@rbe78 it’s not just the blood clot issue that I find convening but the other blood related side effects being reported but not necessarily discussed. The blood clot risk is the “worst” case scenario but many other reports of low platelet levels and internal bleeding.

GrumpyHoonMain · 09/04/2021 11:53

People are being so stupid. AZ only has this level of media coverage because AZ is working to be as transparent as possible and it’s the vaccine that has been used the most so far. J&J, Pfizer, Moderna, all have different clot risks (if these risks can be judged at all considering the vaccination data isn’t as high as AZ) and are also less effective at preventing Severe Covid.

My guess? Everyone knows AZ prevents severe covid and want to reserve it for the old, and end national programs asap. Many countries like India don’t even want to vaccinate the under 30s at all (or if they do, not for free). I guess all countries may eventually say under 30s shouldn’t have it fas part of the national roll out and it should be up to them whether they want to vaccinate at all.

moochingtothepub · 09/04/2021 11:54

30 year olds have died from covid! All medicines have a risk, the question is whether it is a risk worth taking and in this case it is generally unless you have an underlying blood clotting disorder. We've all had AZ, DD's are late teens and 20's, all fine (plethora of reasons why they qualified, I got mine as a carer)

Januaryissodull · 09/04/2021 11:55

Can people please stop calling others with legitimate concerns 'stupid'.

I say this as someone who has had the AZ jab.

It's about risk vs benefit. People need to be sure that benefits outweigh the risks.

It isn't really comparable to driving a car. I have to drive a car to be able to work and generally live life. It is a benefit to my quality of life.

Given the risk of serious illness with Covid is smaller in your 20s and 30s, and that there may be other vaccines available. It isn't stupid to consider that the AZ may not be the best option for you personally.

Dolciedolly · 09/04/2021 11:56

@LemonTT

The article is firewalled. But the JCVI or MHRA could change recommendations at any time about any vaccine and who it should be used for. They do it with other vaccines all the time.

What point are you trying to make ?

Exactly it is a 4 in a million chance ... getting out of hand
Kimye4eva · 09/04/2021 12:02

Which under 30s are eligible for the vaccine now? Seems to be taking forever to get to below 50s where I am.

StrawberryLipstickStateOfMind · 09/04/2021 12:05

Of course it's not stupid to have legitimate concerns- I wanted to know more about the AZ risk of blood clots myself. But the evidence is very much showing that it is much safer to get the vaccine that to get coronavirus. Yes the risk of the virus is smaller for those in their 20s and 30s but it's still a lot more than the vaccine, maybe not of death but is enough known about ongoing post viral illness yet? I'd really rather avoid that.

So I get why people think it's stupid to believe that potentially catching coronavirus is less risky. Unless someone has a genuine medical reason for not wanting to get the vaccine I don't understand it? Not that I believe in forced vaccination at all, each to their own frankly. But still honestly think it's not particularly clever. And I'm not happy if it delays the vaccine reaching people who really want to receive it.

QwertyGirly · 09/04/2021 12:06

Unpaid carers, NHS workers, those with immunodeficient issues, those with asthma, and other conditions such as heart problems, those that have had organ transplants, etc.

jupitermars1345 · 09/04/2021 12:07

Unfortunately this pandemic has made us think everything has to be 0 zero risk imo

No medication or vaccine is ever 100 per cent not going to cause anyone severe side effects

QwertyGirly · 09/04/2021 12:08

But (and it's a big but) wouldn't you try to avoid that 4 in a million chance if you could? If the answer is as easy as 'give them a different vaccine' wouldn't you try to take that chance to zero out of 4 million?

Kimye4eva · 09/04/2021 12:08

Thanks @QwertyGirly. I assumed most of those groups had already been covered in the nhs, carers or clinically vulnerable groups.

Kimye4eva · 09/04/2021 12:10

@QwertyGirly

But (and it's a big but) wouldn't you try to avoid that 4 in a million chance if you could? If the answer is as easy as 'give them a different vaccine' wouldn't you try to take that chance to zero out of 4 million?
I don’t think it’s that simple though because the longer you go without being vaccinated the more chance you will catch covid. If it was a case of pick another one on the day that’s one thing but at the moment it will likely be a case of having to wait longer.
QwertyGirly · 09/04/2021 12:10

Carers who work in homes have already been offered the vaccine, but not unpaid carers (parents of a child with cancer, for example, or people caring for an elderly relative). Also I forgot, there are those who had chemotherapy in the past (as apparently those who have had chemo in the past have a statistically higher risk of developing severe Covid)

Kimye4eva · 09/04/2021 12:11

No medication or vaccine is ever 100 per cent not going to cause anyone severe side effects

It will be interesting to see if many people stop taking the contraceptive pill.

QwertyGirly · 09/04/2021 12:11

@Kimye4eva it is as simple as this, for countries that have sufficient doses of the other vaccines. We haven't.

Original poster
MimiPigeon · 09/04/2021 12:13

Which under 30s are eligible for the vaccine now?
About ten days ago the government decided that if you’re healthy but you live with someone who is immune-compromised then you will be eligible for vaccination immediately. So people of all age groups were suddenly added to group 6. Plus there are some carers etc in the lower age groups who are eligible for vaccination.

If you're not willing to get AZ also pls stop driving your car, as your risk of being involved in a fatal car crash is 1/5000 MUCH higher than the the 4/1000000 blood clot risk.
People aren’t comparing those risks though. They’re comparing the risk of Covid with the risk of the AZ vaccine and the risk of an alternative vaccine. Most people do want to be vaccinated, they just want a lower risk vaccine instead of AZ. Why take a 4 in 1m risk if you could have a different vaccine which is (for example) only 1 in 1m risk.

OP posts:
UnbeatenMum · 09/04/2021 12:14

I think people in their 30s who have had Covid already will definitely think twice. I am in this category, I'll probably get the vaccine anyway but I would feel more comfortable if I was offered Pfizer.

Boringlynormal · 09/04/2021 12:16

And we just happened not to have noticed 74 cases of this clotting issue until a few weeks ago.

DAYS ago. Just two weeks ago they were saying no link, LESS risk of blood clots than in the general population and no cases in the U.K. That’s what I don’t trust - the emerging situation. In another two weeks what more will have emerged? Cases after second vaccinations? And did you read that a journalist who broke the blood clot/U.K. story was called by a senior government minister and accused of ‘tabloid sensationalism’ and asked ‘as a mother’ not to break the story. Doesn’t that concern you? It disgusted me.

QwertyGirly · 09/04/2021 12:16

The argument with the contraceptive pill is interesting. If you are on (a specific type of) pill, the risks of blood clots are a bit higher. If you are overweight and on that pill, chances get higher. If you are older and on that pill (which GP tend to not prescribe so much for women over 40), chances are higher. If you are overweight and older, forget it, they shouldn't prescribe the combined pill.

With Covid, the risks of blood clots are so far only age based. NO other correlation has been established.

When I took the pill, I was explained very clearly what the risks were, repeated every single time I had my prescription renewed, explained what the symptoms were. GP didn't renew prescription when I got to 40 because of increased risks. I was weighed, to check the correlation overweight/increased risks.

Had AZ jab last week and not a peep about the risks of blood clots. I am hoping this has changed already.

Boringlynormal · 09/04/2021 12:19

@QwertyGirly Exactly. I can’t even get the pill if I wanted to as I was taken off it after having a couple of migraines over 15 years ago. They don’t just tell all women to roll up their sleeves if they’re not selfish and have it injected into them with no discrimination.

Boringlynormal · 09/04/2021 12:20

Quote from the article:

When Channel 4 News broke the story on Monday about regulators considering stopping the Oxford-AstraZeneca jab for the under-30s, my editor and I worried about running it. We didn’t want to be responsible for creating a public health scare at the height of a pandemic. We had a lengthy internal debate about the merits of the story, and thought long and hard about whether to go ahead.

Just a few minutes before we went on air, a leading government figure picked up the phone to urge us not to broadcast the story.

He accused us of “tabloid sensationalism” and implored me “as a mother” to think again.

We stood our ground. I knew how senior and well-placed my sources were. And as a public service broadcaster we have a duty to uncover all the facts about the safety of the vaccines, not least for the families of the 19 people who have died.

Angel2702 · 09/04/2021 12:23

What will happen then for those of us in our 30s who had had our first dose of AZ and are due to have the 2nd shortly?

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