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Original poster

And so it begins - with pubs?

635 replies

MistressoftheDarkSide · 24/03/2021 22:36

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/mar/24/pubs-should-decide-whether-to-demand-vaccine-passports-pm-says

Some rather good points raised in the article to be fair

OP posts:
5128gap · 25/03/2021 10:23

In fairness, it does say a vaccine certificate or proof of a negative test.

AcornAutumn · 25/03/2021 10:24

@penguin23

My husband said all this would happen a year ago, his family pretty much all stopped talking to him, calling him a conspiracy theorist. Now they're all talking worriedly about it like my husband never said a word about it, no acknowledgement that he was right.

People are sleepwalking into this, the implications of all this will go further than anyone realises. I am not an anti-vaxxer (hate that term!), whole family up to date with them all, but being coerced into medical treatment and having it forced by means of denying you access to employment, leisure, possibly even education, leads me to the conclusion that something is very very off about it all!

I'm not in touch with the people who thought I was nuts but I bet they have conveniently forgotten that I warned them.
Belladonna12 · 25/03/2021 10:27

@poppycat10

It's also quite interesting that a decade ago everyone was going on about how awful an ID card would be. I would have been quite happy to have an ID card if that was all I needed to show to satisfy money laundering requirements etc but no, that was an infringement of liberty.

Yet people think it's fine to have to tell strangers your medical history to buy a glass of wine? Yeah right.

Why does that surprise you? Do you not think that Covid has had a bit more of an impact on everyone's way of life than money laundering? Stating whether or not you have had a vaccine is hardly divulging your entire medical history.
southeastdweller · 25/03/2021 10:28

How’re the pubs going to administer and enforce this? Surely they can’t be relying on us showing those crappy cards that are easy to fake?

Same4Walls · 25/03/2021 10:31

Stating whether or not you have had a vaccine is hardly divulging your entire medical history.

Except if you cant have the vaccine of course and then good luck when you're facing a situation where you're trying to explain to a bouncer why you're not vaccinated but still entitled to enter without divulging medical your medical history...

WhentheDealGoesDown · 25/03/2021 10:32

@AaronPurr

College students are taking their tests before they go in. Takes 15 minutes.

15 minutes? The results take 30 minutes. Confused I know in many cases they appear much sooner, but everything i've seen says you need to wait 30 minutes.

As I said upthread, this would have to be paid time if it takes the person below NMW as it is illegal to pay below this.
dontsaveusername · 25/03/2021 10:33

@RuleWithAWoodenFoot

How are they going to sort out vaccine passports? The ship has sailed on that one. They don't have the wherewithal to sort it out in retrospect- should have been given them with the vaxx.
No, as threat would have caused delays.
Belladonna12 · 25/03/2021 10:34

@Same4Walls

Stating whether or not you have had a vaccine is hardly divulging your entire medical history.

Except if you cant have the vaccine of course and then good luck when you're facing a situation where you're trying to explain to a bouncer why you're not vaccinated but still entitled to enter without divulging medical your medical history...

There are very few people who can't have the vaccine. I think at the moment it is only pregnant women or those with severe allergies. They could just show a negative test or maybe there will be an exemption certificate.
NewModelArmyMayhem18 · 25/03/2021 10:37

Also, thinking about some of our local pubs, 'beer garden' access doesn't necessarily require entry via the pub (and some of space isn't necessarily pub specific). So how will that work? Multiple bouncers? I've met up with friends previously and people have joined us/left this way as it's more convenient to do so.

NewModelArmyMayhem18 · 25/03/2021 10:38

And why do you need proof of vaccination to sit outside a pub in a socially distanced manner?

ChristinaYang10 · 25/03/2021 10:39

@Belladonna12

I think it's a good idea as long as they wait until everyone's had the opportunity to be vaccinated and there is an alternative proving that you have had a negative test they recently. Pregnant women can be exempt initially but eventually even they would have had the opportunity to be vaccinated. That only leaves those with severe allergies and again they would be given proof of exemption.
That’s another thing with boris’s “pubs can choose to do it if they want” comment. If the government aren’t involved in implementing it, it exempts them from having to implement a proper system of confirming someone is exempt from the vaccine. As I understand it only a small number of people cannot have the vaccine, but still, they exist, and presumably have no way of proving to anyone that they are exempt.
canigooutyet · 25/03/2021 10:40

And what about those who have a natural immunity to Covid?
It's one of the many things I don't understand tbh.
Ruebella (sp?) for example, don't know if it's still the case, but when pregnant/ttc you used to be given a test to specifically see if you had this in your system. If you did, awesome, if you didn't then you got the vaccine for it. (Think it was Ruebella)

Not sure why it's such a problem for some people. You have to prove your age to drink in a pub - this isn't that different

You only have to prove your age if you don't look old enough.

Those who choose not to vaccinate to protect others will have to suck it up.
Only the vaccine doesn't protect others does it? It reduces symptoms if you get Covid.

Same4Walls · 25/03/2021 10:41

As I understand it only a small number of people cannot have the vaccine, but still, they exist, and presumably have no way of proving to anyone that they are exempt.

I was just about to reply in a similar manner. There won't be exemption certificates so those unable to be vaccinated will basically no longer be able to go to the pub if this is implemented.

Belladonna12 · 25/03/2021 10:42

That’s another thing with boris’s “pubs can choose to do it if they want” comment. If the government aren’t involved in implementing it, it exempts them from having to implement a proper system of confirming someone is exempt from the vaccine. As I understand it only a small number of people cannot have the vaccine, but still, they exist, and presumably have no way of proving to anyone that they are exempt.

They don't have any way of proving it at the moment but that doesn't mean they won't have a way in the future. There is no vaccine certificate at the moment either.

thefallthroughtheair · 25/03/2021 10:42

@Nerdygirl

Utter lunacy - in a blink of the eye we move more and more to a police stare for a virus that is mild as quoted by whitty for the vast majority

Am I alone in thinking all sense of proportion has gone out of the window. I suspect if we didn’t have social media and 24 he news coverage this would have been a totally different situation

You're not alone!
cinammonbuns · 25/03/2021 10:43

@canigooutyet I don’t know why people constantly bring up ‘natural immunity’, same as the vaccine we have no idea how long it actually lasts. And do you really expect the NHS to fund tests to see if people have antibodies. It’s completely impractical. Also nobody is going to take someone word for it that they have had Covid recently.

pinkearedcow · 25/03/2021 10:43

I don't think there is any need to panic about this. Nothing has even been decided yet and I do wonder if the logisitics would make it impossible and so we will just stick with social distancing for a while.

Even if some hospitality venues did decide to do this instead of social distancing, it did it would only be temporary as the pandemic will not last forever. Once a high proportion of the population has been vaccinated and there are yearly boosters for those who need and want them, there will be no need for social distancing and so no need for vaccine passports for hospitality reasons.

Belladonna12 · 25/03/2021 10:43

Only the vaccine doesn't protect others does it? It reduces symptoms if you get Covid.

What makes you think it doesn't protect others?! The evidence suggests it does.

poppycat10 · 25/03/2021 10:44

Why does that surprise you? Do you not think that Covid has had a bit more of an impact on everyone's way of life than money laundering? Stating whether or not you have had a vaccine is hardly divulging your entire medical history

Because people were up in arms at the prospect of showing an ID card to a bank clerk but are happy to show a vaccine passport to a pub bouncer (which will have the same info on it, but also include covid vaccination status).

And if I am vaccinated, covid won't have a bigger impact on my life than money laundering or flu or measles or rubella. Indeed it should not affect my life at all.

Countrylane · 25/03/2021 10:45

I am pregnant - and I am not sure the "oh but pregnant women won't be allowed in argument" holds up. Frankly, I am really not keen to get Covid at 8 months pregnant, so unless I can be pretty sure - via some sort of passport scheme - that everyone else in the pub has been vaccinated, I probably won't go anyway. We can get proof that we're pregnant from midwives anyway - for sorting mat allowance - so surely we could just use that to go to the pub. You basically just want everyone in the pub to have herd immunity, so if the occasional pregnant and therefore unvaccinated person wants to go, that shouldn't be a problem.

MaxNormal · 25/03/2021 10:45

There are very few people who can't have the vaccine. I think at the moment it is only pregnant women or those with severe allergies

I can't have the vaccine and it's for neither of the reasons you state. Do you have any medical qualifications or are you just stating an uninformed opinion as fact?
My consultant has confirmed there's been no guidance on any exemptions, he said it's political not medical now.

percheron67 · 25/03/2021 10:45

I have a card issued to me when i had the vaccine - surely this must have been the same for everyone. Are these not vaccine passports?

DenisetheMenace · 25/03/2021 10:46

AaronPurr

Ours have taken 15 🤷‍♀️ Result didn’t change.

Belladonna12 · 25/03/2021 10:47

Because people were up in arms at the prospect of showing an ID card to a bank clerk but are happy to show a vaccine passport to a pub bouncer (which will have the same info on it, but also include covid vaccination status).

The great majority of people were not up in arms about showing an ID card to the bank clerk. The main controversy was over being asked to carry an ID card at all times. Regardless, money laundering hasn't had the same impact on society as Covid so hardly surprising that people are willing to do a lot more to get out of the awful situation we are currently in.

Same4Walls · 25/03/2021 10:47

@percheron67

I have a card issued to me when i had the vaccine - surely this must have been the same for everyone. Are these not vaccine passports?
No. My husbands doesn't even have his name on it so it's effectively a piece of cardboard with the vaccine date on it that could be used by or belong to anyone.