To think the EU countries are utter fuckwits over the AZ vaccine?

[annonnymous]

Words fail me at the utter stupidity and reckless behaviour of many EU countries over the whole vaccination thing and in particular the AZ vaccine.

40 people with blood clots with AZ ..... which is statistically lower than the average number of people who get blood clots anyway and the same as the Pfizer one! And the twatty french president saying AZ was quite ineffective in the over 65s and the whole of the EU slow the give it to over 65s because there was no evidence (because it wasn't tested on them) that it worked. It does, and sheer logic says it will. Your immune system doesn't fold up at 65.

With covid cases rising, Paris hospitals shipping out seriously ill patients to other areas, Italy in serious problems again, they need to stop this.

On no real evidence they are putting the lives of thousands of people at risk and putting a question mark over an effective vaccine which makes no profit and can be used worldwide cheaply.

The WHO say it's safe. FFS Europe, get a grip and stop the politics.

There are many facts missing at the moment which makes it difficult to have a clear view.

How old were the people who died or had blood clots after receiving the jab? They may have been a 74 year old overweight smoker, or maybe a 40 year old otherwise fit doctor. Statistically, a 40 year old fit person should not die or have a stroke because of a blood clot.

I think it's wise for countries to have a process that will pause a drug or vaccine if there is a dangerous side effect. I don't see Norway and Denmark as having crazy impulsive political leaders who would stop the vaccine to score political points.

" It's definitely political and the EU are cutting off their nose to spite their face and slowing down vaccine delivery even further in an effort to discredit AZ and by association the UK."

This doesn't even make sense. It's not the whole EU making a bloc decision, it's certain countries, and it's not just EU countries, it's Asian and African countries too. Are they also pissed off the UK left the EU?

And as pointed out above, what about the Swedish involvement in AZ? Why is the EU punishing Sweden too?

There are some really confused thought processes in your post, @Bakeachocolatecake2day.

But seriously, at least here in Denmark the UK is not really unpopular. Perceived as slightly batshit mental perhaps

That’s fair

apparently it's a type of blood clot but even then the rate is smaller in the vaccine comparing to day to day (

but theres still incidences of blood clots with pfizer yes some deaths were close together but surely out of how many people vaccinated its just a coincidence

I think we should look into how many car accidents have happened to people who've taken the AZ vaccine too.

Also, has anyone died choking on food after having the vaccine?

After all, can't be too careful, need to take precautions!!!

@bagamoyo1 same at my local GPS too. No Pfizer except for 2nd doses.

Again the presentation by the media is what’s responsible for whipping up emotions imho. They could easily present this in a non-alarmist, informative manner but they chose not to.
Totally this , irresponsible as always

I think it is perfectly reasonable for individual countries to make their own decisions. It’s quite ironic the amount of Brexiteers who appear disagree with this.

The idea the the EU is anti AStrazeneca is absurd in the extreme. As other posters have rightly pointed out, Astrazeneca is not a solely British company. In addition, at least two of the scientists instrumental in developing the vaccine are Irish.

Personally I find it reassuring that concerns are being investigated. I fully expect the findings to show that it is safe but it is important that any concerns are investigated - surely this will increase confidence in the vaccine as opposed to governments saying ‘oh yes, there have been some issues reported but it’s not worth looking at, i’m sure it’ll be fine....carry on’

Jabs have only been stopped in some countries, temporarily, as a precautionary measure. What is wrong with that and why do you care so much?

Because this abundance of caution further feeds vaccine hesitancy and more people will die as a result.

@MythicalBiologicalFennel we care because the rhetoric is dangerous and will cause delays in people taking up the vaccine. Here and abroad. And most of is would like life to become normal as fast as it can.
First the EU said AZ wasn't safe for over 65s, even though ourselves and Israel have proved it is highly effective at reducing cases and deaths. Now it's not safe at all as 37 people out of 17 million have experienced blood clots even though this incidence rate is the same as Pfizer and less than what would be expected in the general population.
A few months ago EU was threatening us with boycotts because we weren't handing over our supplies.
I voted remain and have found this all v strange. I hope people in the UK just carry on and get vaccinated as fast as possible.

The whole vaccine fiasco has turned me from a passionate remainer (half forrin) into somebody who is grateful that we can act independently of the EU

I never thought I’d say that!

[quote BuggerBognor]@Cornettoninja it’s already available privately in other countries - e.g. allowing private vaccines of pharma sales staff ahead of the “queue” because they need to be in hospitals a lot. Personally I think that is ethically questionable at the moment, but it’s already a “thing”.[/quote]
I know, that’s why I specified the UK.

@NewLevelsOfTiredness we can live with batshit mental

After reading more about the German cases, I have more sympathy with their position - there is a cluster of very rare events, but as statisticians know, probabilities are streaky - the average might be X per year, but over a long period you will see many streaks that break that average.

I have seen the estimated cost of delay, in terms of lives lost, stated at around the order of 15 lives per 100k vaccinations per day, as a very rough order-of-magnitude calc.

This doesn't take into account the increased uptake hesitancy the delay will also cause.

No easy decisions here. But I do hope the decision making authorities are held as accountable for deaths caused by delay as they are by deaths caused by the vaccine - because it is very quantifiable.

according to the OP these people are fuckwits and she/he knows better: In its statement advising the government to pause vaccinations, Germany’s Paul Ehrlich Institute said its experts had observed “a striking accumulation of a special form of very rare cerebral vein thrombosis … in connection with a deficiency of blood platelets and bleeding” following a small number of AstraZeneca vaccinations.

The head of the institute, Klaus Cichutek, told Die Welt on Tuesday that it had uncovered “one abnormality - namely six cases of sinus vein thrombosis in women between the ages of around 20 and 50 years, two of which tragically had a fatal outcome.” www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/16/coronavirus-live-news-keep-using-astrazenecaoxford-vaccine-says-who

@Sallydally91

I think it is perfectly reasonable for individual countries to make their own decisions. It’s quite ironic the amount of Brexiteers who appear disagree with this.

The idea the the EU is anti AStrazeneca is absurd in the extreme. As other posters have rightly pointed out, Astrazeneca is not a solely British company. In addition, at least two of the scientists instrumental in developing the vaccine are Irish.

Personally I find it reassuring that concerns are being investigated. I fully expect the findings to show that it is safe but it is important that any concerns are investigated - surely this will increase confidence in the vaccine as opposed to governments saying ‘oh yes, there have been some issues reported but it’s not worth looking at, i’m sure it’ll be fine....carry on’

You find it reassuring that completely unfounded scaremongering about the vaccine is taken onboard against the advice of almost all scientific professionals? You find it reassuring that politicians in Europe are giving in to antivaxxers at the cost of thousands of lives and untold billions of pounds?

You find that reassuring?

What is wrong with you?

The EU did not say AStrazeneca was not safe for over 65s. The concern was that there wasn’t enough evidence to say that it was as effective in older people as not enough of this age group were included in the trials to give conclusive date.

Couldn’t agree more. Complete smear campaign and I feel for people missing out because of politics. Huge wave of high cases over certain parts of Europe right now too, it should be up to the individuals offered it to make their own decisions not a blanket ban by politicians. I have been offered the vaccine and my paternal grandmother died of DVT in her twenties, despite a small number of people (37 individuals in 17 million) I have done lots of research and I’m happy to go ahead with the vaccine, it’s an informed choice and one I’ll stand by

OK said previously but I'm saying it again in capital letters this time:

EUROPEAN COUNTRIES ARE MAKING THEIR OWN DECISIONS TO STOP THE VACCINE, NOT THE ENTIRE EU BLOCK. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE EU.

there, sorry I shouted, but some people can't read properly.

Namechanged- there is nothing wrong with me....apart from the fact that I have a different opinion to you.

I'm furious about it too. It will cost lives in the EU and in the UK if people don't take it up. And it will prolong the horrors of lockdown.