To think the EU countries are utter fuckwits over the AZ vaccine?

[annonnymous]

Words fail me at the utter stupidity and reckless behaviour of many EU countries over the whole vaccination thing and in particular the AZ vaccine.

40 people with blood clots with AZ ..... which is statistically lower than the average number of people who get blood clots anyway and the same as the Pfizer one! And the twatty french president saying AZ was quite ineffective in the over 65s and the whole of the EU slow the give it to over 65s because there was no evidence (because it wasn't tested on them) that it worked. It does, and sheer logic says it will. Your immune system doesn't fold up at 65.

With covid cases rising, Paris hospitals shipping out seriously ill patients to other areas, Italy in serious problems again, they need to stop this.

On no real evidence they are putting the lives of thousands of people at risk and putting a question mark over an effective vaccine which makes no profit and can be used worldwide cheaply.

The WHO say it's safe. FFS Europe, get a grip and stop the politics.

@LexMitior

This was the medical regulator that was going to poach all the best staff from London, was it not?

EU countries have less vaccine expertise. The UK has a good history with them, and has some really good people with lots of experience involved in AZ.

We can be confident here - the politics are because of pressure within the European Union and probably, to come out shortly that the EU will have a shortage of supply despite their promises for Q2. Wait for that one

It was the EU regulator that used to be in Canary Wharf, but had to move to Amsterdam when Canary Wharf ceased to be in the EU any more. Some staff relocated but mostly it was a jobs bonanza for Amsterdam.

@MarshaBradyo

Man, I could just imagine the snarl made when typing that. Claws out and everything grin bravo man.

Ha people are really going for it. So much vitriol. Plus didn’t the EMA approve it

I know right proper feelings about the UK coming out on this thread. Made me properly laugh.

It said there was no evidence of a link between the vaccine and blood clots.

Lol of course there can be no link if the blood clots were only just discovered! Correlation doesn't imply causation but an investigation can find whether the correlation may have causation. That's the whole point of them doing an investigation - to see if there is a link. Absolutely meaningless sentence.

full You sound very bitter, and I don't blame you at all. I would feel the same if our positions were reversed. We are talking about people's lives, and we are all human and suffering is universal. So I am not taking any pleasure from watching this shitshow, it is very upsetting.

mobile.twitter.com/DarrenEuronews/status/1371869192597700613

...
NEW: Poland will carry on using #AstraZeneca accused others of giving in to “disinformation”

PM’s chief of staff:

“Most countries that have temporarily suspended (AstraZeneca) vaccinations have given in to panic caused by media-fuelled information about alleged complications”
...

Michał Dworczyk suggesting it is political

“In my opinion, it is possible that we are dealing with a planned disinformation campaign and a brutal fight by medical companies, possibly supported by the countries in which these companies are registered”

....

He added: “I am convinced that many of them will soon return to vaccinations using AstraZeneca.”

Said that any decisions made by the Polish government would be “guided solely by hard data” and the recommendations of scientists and doctors

...

Poland have always had the capacity to see through smoke and mirrors and political posturing - it is a perceptive nation. Good for them, their numbers don't look great at the moment, so of course they should not stop the vaccine. It is the last thing they should do.

Amazed this thread is still going.

World at One today reporting that the incidence of blood clots in recipients of AZ is lower than that in the general, unvaccinated population .

The rate of blood clots in recipients of Pfizer is slightly higher but still below that of the general population (Europe wide, both vaccines).

Presumably, the BBC (that institution regularly accused of anti-Government, pro-EU bias just a few months ago) and all UK mainstream media is complicit in the coverup?

There are some out and out fruitcakes on here. (Probably be reported and deleted for that, while dangerous misinformation and targeted falsehoods continue to be peddled and allowed.)

Itsalonghaul’s summation is bang on. With infection rates rising by the day in several European countries, this illogical dithering represents the only potential attempted cover up and will probably cost thousands of lives across the Union.

At this stage, I don't know if these post are complete piss takes. Is the whole thread a piss take?

Does the EU medical regulator regulate EU medicals? Say that fast.

This is a very strange & very jingoistic thread. The gist appears to be that European medicines & vaccines regulators have fallen prey to political machinations but that such political pressures could never weigh on our own vaccines regulator?
I think people need to give their heads a wobble. If multiple regulatory bodies around the world are picking up the same signals, I can’t help feeling it might be worth to have a modicum of caution & not think it’s because “they’re all out to get us”.
I am pro-vaccines, am hugely hopeful that this will be temporary pause & am much cheered by Israel’s data...but too much of the UK’s woeful response has been down to exceptionalism & hubris & British pluck. Let’s not do this time.

I agree denise Desperate times in the EU call for Desperate measures, and Deflection is now in full swing.

@FullofCurryandparatha

Best of luck if you are posting from one of the suspended countries, it must be a very worrying time for you

It really isn't.

Is it that the British are so used to getting everything so badly wrong that they are basking in the notion that they alone have done something right? And by right I mean threw all their remaining money at vaccines, paying massively over the odds and being slightly quicker than everyone else.

Ooh, want some vinegar with the chip on your shoulder?

What the various European countries are doing is criminal, because it will cause deaths and give ammunition to the anti-vaxxers.

And guess what - within a week they'll all have to do a U turn and start with AZ again.

For once, in this whole sorry saga, the EU is acting sensibly. It's the individual countries who are being fuckwits. Still, got to protect their backs and have something to blame that isn't the EU!

The gist appears to be that European medicines & vaccines regulators have fallen prey to political machinations

Ummm, the European Medicines and vaccines are APPROVING the AZ vaccine mac you seem to have lost the thread of what is going on. The member states are deciding of their own accord, for no good reason according to their regulators to suspend the vaccine.

I think you probably need to read it through again to fully grasp the implications of the decisions member states are making, and the deaths that will follow due to misinformation.

I don’t believe for a moment anyone is out to “get us”. Imagine most Europeans were delighted when we buggered off and stopped causing trouble for the sake of it.

Do believe that Macron and others are scrabbling trying to cover their (in this respect) incompetent arses with false narrative though.
So many elections. So little time.

@mac12

This is a very strange & very jingoistic thread. The gist appears to be that European medicines & vaccines regulators have fallen prey to political machinations but that such political pressures could never weigh on our own vaccines regulator? I think people need to give their heads a wobble. If multiple regulatory bodies around the world are picking up the same signals, I can’t help feeling it might be worth to have a modicum of caution & not think it’s because “they’re all out to get us”. I am pro-vaccines, am hugely hopeful that this will be temporary pause & am much cheered by Israel’s data...but too much of the UK’s woeful response has been down to exceptionalism & hubris & British pluck. Let’s not do this time.

But the EMA hasn’t said to pause?

Please don’t let facts in the way of a good yarn, MarshaBradyo

@mac12

This is a very strange & very jingoistic thread. The gist appears to be that European medicines & vaccines regulators have fallen prey to political machinations but that such political pressures could never weigh on our own vaccines regulator? I think people need to give their heads a wobble. If multiple regulatory bodies around the world are picking up the same signals, I can’t help feeling it might be worth to have a modicum of caution & not think it’s because “they’re all out to get us”. I am pro-vaccines, am hugely hopeful that this will be temporary pause & am much cheered by Israel’s data...but too much of the UK’s woeful response has been down to exceptionalism & hubris & British pluck. Let’s not do this time.

@mac12 You seem a little confused. The EMA has told countries not to pause while they look into the baseless hysteria, sorry political chicanery, sorry blood clotting "issue"..

So, either the EU's EMA knows what it's talking about, or it doesn't. Which is it?

I wasn’t clear, I didn’t mean the EMA, I meant the regulators of the European member states (also regulators in other countries outside Europe )
You are right though, I didn’t read the full thread.

EU spends time relaxing with cool drink because they are considered the big boys of the procurement playground, and AZ pharma will fall over itself to serve their needs.

UK runs a sprint and works hard to sign all contracts, breathes a sigh of relief and waits patiently the in queue.

EU realises it is now at the back of the queue, pushes itself to the front, pushing all other countries out of the way with its flick knife out threatening and insisting it needs to be at the front because it is SO important.

AZ Pharma teacher tells EU off, and EU is sent back to the back again kicking everything in its way.

EU Sulks and simmers and plots its way to the front, but nothing is working.

UK is served in timely fashion, EU is incandescent with rage. How dare that little fucker beat them to it. They deploy the minions to cause trouble, telling the rest of the queue that it is rubbish anyway, and how bad it is all is. Pharma AZ teacher remains calm and reminds EU that he need him, so quit the bleating. EU starts a fight in the queue and blames Pharma AZ teacher for all his troubles. It is the AZ Pharma that is terrible not the impatient and angry EU, it is all their fault for making EU so nasty and horrible, if only they had done the right thing and fast tracked them, none of this would have happened.

EU turns its back on the queue, it feels rejected and now says it doesn't want its medicine now anyway. UK and AZ Pharma feel sad for EU, it has a lot of growing up to do.

@mac12

This is a very strange & very jingoistic thread. The gist appears to be that European medicines & vaccines regulators have fallen prey to political machinations but that such political pressures could never weigh on our own vaccines regulator? I think people need to give their heads a wobble. If multiple regulatory bodies around the world are picking up the same signals, I can’t help feeling it might be worth to have a modicum of caution & not think it’s because “they’re all out to get us”. I am pro-vaccines, am hugely hopeful that this will be temporary pause & am much cheered by Israel’s data...but too much of the UK’s woeful response has been down to exceptionalism & hubris & British pluck. Let’s not do this time.

Agreed. If the individual regulators in 17 out of the 41 countries using AZ have all taken similar action then who are we to say that what other sovereign countries have chosen to do is a) wrong and b) part of some dastardly plot by the EU?!

Especially as the EU's own European Medicines Agency says to carry on jabbing

Lol @Itsalonghaul

It seems that in this case, the individual countries' politicians are the ones being fuckwits. Still, they've taken their lead from the EU.

I am so looking forward to when they shamefacedly have to start using the AZ jab again.

Unfortunately, a lot of damage will have already been done.

Is it that the British are so used to getting everything so badly wrong that they are basking in the notion that they alone have done something right? And by right I mean threw all their remaining money at vaccines, paying massively over the odds and being slightly quicker than everyone else.”

Don’t care. AlI I know is after a year indoors with CEV husband, unable to see elderly parents, in laws, offspring and first grandchild we’ve both received our vaccines, feel good and are looking forward to cautiously moving on

We voted to remain in the EU, enthusiastically. Widely travelled and friends in several European countries. The behaviour of some European nations, in a very blatant attempt to cover their failings is this regard, is deeply depressing.

Sky news is reporting that France and Italy have admitted their ban on the AZ vaccine was political.

Leaders of both nations hav agreed they are reading to begin vaccinating with AZ again. They are waiting for the EMA to give the green light on Thursday.

have ready

PrincessNutNuts

The decision of 17 is wrong because it goes against all data.

Why is that so hard to understand?

Can only repeat, again 🤯, the incidence of blood clotting is lower in the vaccinated (be that AZ or Pfizer) than that in the general population (across UK and Europe). That is undisputed.

Hell, the vaccines are practically therapeutic

Can anyone explain why, if incidence of clotting is higher with Pfizer than it is with AZ (though still lower than expected in the general population), Pfizer has not been pulled in these countries?