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What happens about the unvaccinated ?

896 replies

vera99 · 08/03/2021 03:06

There is a lot of speculation about how many will buy into the continuing vaccination program. Some has said 20% won't but I'm sure it will be less than that. We don't know any would be refuseniks. But say it's 10% and suppose Covid will become stronger and therefore potentially more lethal and troublesome will that not lead to many more deaths and hospitalisations amongst this cohort and by doing so threaten the capacity of the hospital's once again ? Hopefully not of course does anyone know of any modelling around that outcome. Therapeutics of course will be of importance to lessen any resultant disease and persuading the currently unpersuaded remains of paramount importance. The stick of no vaccine no travel or no entry will be a great persuader no doubt as well.

OP posts:
WineInTheWillows · 09/03/2021 14:46

[quote MaxNormal]@notrub I think you need a wee lie down.[/quote]
This.

notrub · 09/03/2021 15:58

@ChameleonClara

I take covid REALLY seriously and am definitely verging towards doom monger Wink but I don't view anti-vaxxers as akin to terrorists, no.

Also human rights cannot be traded off like that, you fundamentally misunderstand human rights.

Rights must be balanced.

I'm not "trading" anything. It's a simple fact.

What you are arguing is that it's perfect acceptable for someone to do something stupid that puts the lives of others at risk. THAT is not balanced.

I tell you this, if someone infected someone I loved and they died, and then I found the person who infected them had refused a vaccination, I would kill them (literally). I don't really see the difference between this and someone driving home drunk and killing someone, or a psychotic patient stopping taking their meds and killing someone.

Terrorists are sometimes morally way above anti-vaxxers - many have a valid cause. The ones who don't have a valid cause, they're simply misguided souls, believing what they're told, determined to convert others to their cause and uncaring how much harm they do along the way.... you've just described your average Islamic bomber - OR an anti-vaxxer.

The ones spreading the rumours make a fortune out of it you know. Andrew Wakefield, struck off the medical register for inventing bogus research, now makes a fortune traveling the world preaching nonsense to convertees. It's a cult, and it's just as dangerous to society as any religious extremist group.

reformedcharacters · 09/03/2021 16:03

notrub your previously posted that right to life was above all other rights, on this basis your latest post is contradictory because killing somebody generally removes their right to life.

XenoBitch · 09/03/2021 16:12

I tell you this, if someone infected someone I loved and they died, and then I found the person who infected them had refused a vaccination, I would kill them (literally).

And if it was someone who had been vaccinated? The risk is less but there is still one.

Torvean · 09/03/2021 16:41

I think take up from the sheep will increase when they realise what they may miss out on if they dont vaccinate.
I'm tired of ppl not willing to be responsible members of society by not getting vaccinated.

Why should we continue to have outbreaks and lockdown due to their ignorance.

Latest sheep lie I read on fb yesterday.
" If the vaccine kills you then your life insurance and mortgage wont pay out"
Apparently this is a population reset by the government and it was written on Georgian guide stones.

They dont say who was killed off and how...

Yet they call us deluded Grin

notrub · 09/03/2021 16:51

@XenoBitch

I tell you this, if someone infected someone I loved and they died, and then I found the person who infected them had refused a vaccination, I would kill them (literally).

And if it was someone who had been vaccinated? The risk is less but there is still one.

Of course - just as there is a risk that someone will be perfectly sober, driving carefully and suffer a mechanical failure for example that results in someone losing their life.

One is reckless endangerment, the other is an accident.

NB
Imagine if for example vaccine uptake was only 50%. It is almost inevitable that the whole of society would be under restrictions every winter - perhaps not a complete lockdown, but certainly all mass gatherings banned. Each year at least 50k people would die from covid-19 - that's about 5x the death rate from seasonal flu, and tens of thousands would spend months with disabling conditions. If this is your preferred future, then carry on cheering these "rights".

Personally, I think the needs of the many massively outweigh the stupidity of the few.

reformedcharacters · 09/03/2021 16:52

Maybe if there was a more credible argument than being ‘forced/coerced’ into taking an (experimental) vaccine for a disease that for the overwhelming majority is so deadly a test is needed to even know they have it?

People not wanting to be vaccinated will not kill anyone and if anybody thinks it will then this vaccine being effective is quite frankly untrue.

Perhaps wait until the data supports the effectiveness before before forcing people?

bumbleymummy · 09/03/2021 17:13

@notrub you know that being infected and recovering also confers immunity right? The majority of infections are mild/asymptomatic. If the most vulnerable people - the ones most likely to end up in hospital/die - are vaccinated then we won’t have 40,000 people a year dying every year.

Whu020 · 09/03/2021 17:32

You need to relax several members of my family have had it and they have been fine, you need to stop watching the bullshit on TV

munchkinman · 09/03/2021 17:34

I suspect it will be around 20 per cent who don’t have it. Think it will be normal prevent those who have not been vaccinated from attending large gatherings or access to some countries. The company I work for are considering not employing those who have not been vaccinated from now on.

bumbleymummy · 09/03/2021 17:36

@munchkinman

I suspect it will be around 20 per cent who don’t have it. Think it will be normal prevent those who have not been vaccinated from attending large gatherings or access to some countries. The company I work for are considering not employing those who have not been vaccinated from now on.
Are you going to base your decision on vaccination status or proof of immunity?
RMNMummy · 09/03/2021 17:37

@OpheliasCrayon

I personally am waiting to be stood up against a wall and shot at dawn because I have turned down the offer of a vaccine twice.

And also I think you need to be realistic, there will easily be 20% that don't , probably more. I have legitimate reasons not to have it, but quite frankly if someone doesn't want a vaccine they shouldn't have to have it, whatever the reason

THANK YOU!!!! Ethics lesson number 1. My body, end of.
RMNMummy · 09/03/2021 17:38

@HolmeH

I hope those refusing are one, extremely grateful to those who get the vaccine & make the world safer & open again for them. And I hope they are refused entry back into offices, large events & aeroplanes.
A bit Owellian if you ask me. Bodily autonomy reigns supreme, IMO. And I’m a nurse 😊
doublehalo · 09/03/2021 17:46

@HolmeH

I hope those refusing are one, extremely grateful to those who get the vaccine & make the world safer & open again for them. And I hope they are refused entry back into offices, large events & aeroplanes.
You'd like to refuse people the ability to participate in everyday life whilst at the same time have them grovel in gratitude?? 🙄

Get a grip.

nearlyhellokitty · 09/03/2021 17:46

why do people keep saying that young people won't be that affected? See e.g. www.nytimes.com/2021/03/08/health/long-covid-asymptomatic.html?referringSource=articleShare

I know people my age - ie mid 30s/ 40s who have been incapacitated for months

There's a lot we don't know about COVID, even if you were asymptomatic at the time you might have effects later, in kids this is also quite possible.

MaxNormal · 09/03/2021 17:47

I tell you this, if someone infected someone I loved and they died, and then I found the person who infected them had refused a vaccination, I would kill them (literally)

Will ye aye?
Pish talk.

Timeisavirtue · 09/03/2021 17:47

Tbh, if it wasn’t for my vulnerable father in law I wouldn’t get the vaccine. I managed 15 years of my life with out the flu jab and never got flu. I got it in October so that my immune system didn’t battle with 2 viruses and I had horrible symptoms.

RMNMummy · 09/03/2021 17:47

Oh, and for those soooooo ready to take this jab... Are you actually informed that we are still in trials until 2023, one until December 2023?

Because we are. Still in trials. So what you’re getting is experimental, and passed the INITIAL, EMERGENCY safety tests. NOT the long-term effects I.e. what will happen to us in 5-10 years time. There is no information, so we have NOT been given the required information in order to give our informed consent.

Just wanted to inform those who feel ‘perfectly fine’ after their first doses. I HOPE to God (or the universe, whatever floats your boat) that you are prepared for the sh!tstorm that will be the coming years. Sad :( but hey! Brit’s will do anything for a holiday...

nearlyhellokitty · 09/03/2021 17:48

@doublehalo so what about those that get vaccinated, adn then because others are unvaccinated, new lockdowns occur in the more unvaccinated areas and their freedom is curtailed? Is there not a responsibility to be vaccinated if you can? Otherwise it's just being a free rider. how do we protect those who have been responsible?

doublehalo · 09/03/2021 17:49

@Torvean

I think take up from the sheep will increase when they realise what they may miss out on if they dont vaccinate. I'm tired of ppl not willing to be responsible members of society by not getting vaccinated.

Why should we continue to have outbreaks and lockdown due to their ignorance.

Latest sheep lie I read on fb yesterday.
" If the vaccine kills you then your life insurance and mortgage wont pay out"
Apparently this is a population reset by the government and it was written on Georgian guide stones.

They dont say who was killed off and how...

Yet they call us deluded Grin

You are completly deluded if you think that post on Facebook is representative of all the people who don't want to take the vaccine.
nearlyhellokitty · 09/03/2021 17:50

and again.. of course if you are unvaccinated, you make the herd immunity worse adn those who Can't have the vaccine for various reasons are the ones who suffer. i think it's so profoundly selfish and "i'm alright jack' fuck the rest of you

ewee · 09/03/2021 17:51

For those of you interested in understanding what mRNA vaccines are all about, please search for "Moderna Never Again Plan" which will take you to an interview given by that company's CEO.

In short, there is a much bigger end-game than CV-19, which explains why there is such a push to test these products on children. Again, this has absolutely nothing to do with CV-19; as we should all know by now, children are at virtually no risk from the virus.

For a bit more background: drug delivery has long been a major area of research in pharma. A lot of work has been done on targeting cancerous tumors, etc. mRNA might be seen as an extension of that and explains why these agents have been described as "operating systems". This could be worth hundreds of billions of dollars to big pharma and goes well beyond CV-19.

Just to give you a few of the headlines from the interview: "....mRNA is essentially an "information molecule": It tells your body's cells what proteins to make. And once you have that capability, it's comparatively easy to change the message." "With mRNA, we can turn pharmaceutical problems into engineering problems." "Once we figure out how to make mRNA work in human cells, we can draw on academic and industry research to learn what various proteins do, and then we can turn those proteins into drugs very quickly. With COVID, our team actually designed the vaccine in two days in silico. We never touched the physical virus; we never had a sample of the virus. And we did it in two days."

Now here's a problem. mRNA vaccines have been tried before in relation to SARS and MERS; none made it past animal trails into human trials. One of the issues with the current vaccines is that animal testing showed that the agents cross the blood/brain barrier. That is not a good thing.

I am not anti-vax at all but I will be passing on these particular offerings.

However, people must make out their own minds based upon the core principal of informed consent. That requires that they are given honest information.

museumsandgalleries666 · 09/03/2021 17:52

The unvaccinated will catch covid and probably die or be seriously ill. What on earth do they think is going to happen? That the act of refusing a vaccine makes them invincible?

XenoBitch · 09/03/2021 17:54

@museumsandgalleries666

The unvaccinated will catch covid and probably die or be seriously ill. What on earth do they think is going to happen? That the act of refusing a vaccine makes them invincible?
I honestly think that a of the people shouting the loudest about the vaccine hope that will happen.
hermesandhades · 09/03/2021 17:57

Don't get the vaccination! Or at least get to the back of the queue.
It's at the experimental stage, far too dangerous, you can't take it out once it's in