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The government is about to tell you that schools are safe

999 replies

noblegiraffe · 19/02/2021 14:07

It's being reported that the government are about to embark on a two week PR campaign claiming that schools are safe. We've already seen hints of it in that Warwick report that was widely misreported as showing schools don't fuel community transmission (majorly pissing off the author who advocates a cautious return to schools).

The ONS random sampling survey graphs released today are amazing. They show a huge reduction in the infection rates due to lockdown, but the most incredible reduction is in the infection rate of secondary school children. They've gone from being the most infected subset of the population by far, to the 2nd least (behind 70+). It's clear that despite arguments that secondary kids were catching covid out of school (sleepovers, hanging around in parks etc), this just isn't true and the lack of mitigation measures in secondary schools allowed covid to run riot.

We can't re-open in the same way as in September. That would be madness. I know that people will say that it's fine, vulnerable people are being vaccinated and kids don't get it badly BUT what is not acknowledged is that kids aren't being vaccinated, a lot of their teachers won't be by March 8th, nor their parents and so we still need to keep infection levels down. In addition, rampant covid is incredibly disruptive to education. Teachers off for weeks, kids off isolating, some kids in, some kids out...Sept to Dec was a mess that we should be trying our best to avoid repeating. Vaccinations don't address that issue at all.

Community levels are low, but then they were low in September. Pubs, restaurants and non-essential shops are shut now, but we want to be able to open them. We cannot rely on community levels remaining low to stop covid getting into schools and proliferating.

We need to be careful, because certainly secondary schools aren't safe to re-open in a Big Bang gung-ho way that some are advocating, particularly with a more transmissible variant in circulation. Remember to the week before Christmas when school attendance plummeted in Kent and London? In one LA, secondary attendance was at 17%. And yet the DfE decided to threaten schools that wanted to close early to stop the spread with legal action. The schools were right, and the DfE was wrong. Gavin Williamson can't be trusted to have sensible conversations about safety, he's more interested in bully-boy tactics and setting himself up in opposition to teachers and schools.

What can be done? I think there is room to open schools in some way on March 8th. My personal preference (and I'm no spokesperson for teachers here, other opinions will vary) would be primaries back and exam years back for three weeks, then Easter can be used to examine the impact of the full primary re-opening . I'm not sure that school is such a major factor in transmission at primary as it is at secondary for various reasons, however I'm sure that my primary colleagues have their own ideas about what needs to be done there. If full primary re-opening looks untenable, then I would prefer rotas to only certain year groups in. Some school for all pupils would be better than all school for some pupils as we had last year.

Secondary is a different kettle of fish and should be treated separately. Secondaries were a massive risk for transmission. The word 'bubble' should never be used in reference to secondary schools again, as 'bubble' means a group of people who all have to isolate if one of them catches covid, which went in the bin in secondary around the end of September. There are some easy wins in secondary -
Masks in classrooms would be easy and cheap to implement. Exemptions would apply and clear ones could be provided where necessary for lip reading.
A national programme to improve ventilation.
Testing and isolation of any contacts where positive cases are found to flush out asymptomatic pupils (PCR not LFT).
Moving quickly to remote learning where there are outbreaks instead of trying to keep year groups in and schools open as covid works its way through - the attendance just before Christmas in some schools meant kids would have been better served educationally if they were all at home.

Home LFT testing of kids - I'm not convinced tbh, maybe in addition to above measures, but certainly not instead of them.

So if the government messaging is as it has been: schools are safe and no additional measures to contain the spread in secondary are needed then they are lying and our kids deserve a more consistent and sustainable education than they got from September.

Fingers crossed they are more sensible than we have previously seen.

The government is about to tell you that schools are safe
The government is about to tell you that schools are safe
The government is about to tell you that schools are safe
OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
bbn81 · 19/02/2021 15:14

For those who keep mentioning rotas, what happens to my primary aged child when I am in school teaching half my class every week when he can only be in school every other week. What happens to all the other key worker children. People are so quick to talk about rotas for pupils but not actually about the practicalities.

Dailywalk · 19/02/2021 15:14

@Bluewavescrashing

Yes, I will be teaching 24 children on Monday in my ever growing key worker bubble. I expect a number of them will have been having play dates and sleepovers this week as, quite naturally, they enjoy telling me about this sort of thing.
My kids haven’t set foot into another child’s home, seen family outside their own household, been to a sleepover etc. For a year! Our family live abroad so there’s no support bubble, no meeting other kids. Nothing! I do know kids that have done all these things though and they’re all in school because their parents our key workers. They don’t need the company like my kids do because they get it all day from classmates.
Delatron · 19/02/2021 15:14

@dipdips we are vaccinating at tremendous speed. They didn’t have a vaccination for the Spanish flu yet still the pandemic ended and it became a milder version. So I don’t think it’s comparable when you are vaccinating.

News today is that going at the rates we are, all over 40s will be vaccinated by the end of March. There really will be no argument then about schools. But I am sure some will argue they need to be ‘safe’ and closed until September.

SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS · 19/02/2021 15:14

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

HauntedPencil · 19/02/2021 15:15

@dipdips

What happened at the end of the second wave with Spanish Flu - were there other smaller waves for a while? Is COVID following the same trajectory? Any virologists out there? If COVID really is going to be a 2 wave phenomenon does that mean that the Government are thinking that numbers are now going to drop whatever they do?
What I understand is that it became a more benign annual flu
SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS · 19/02/2021 15:15

[quote Delatron]@dipdips we are vaccinating at tremendous speed. They didn’t have a vaccination for the Spanish flu yet still the pandemic ended and it became a milder version. So I don’t think it’s comparable when you are vaccinating.

News today is that going at the rates we are, all over 40s will be vaccinated by the end of March. There really will be no argument then about schools. But I am sure some will argue they need to be ‘safe’ and closed until September.[/quote]
Some will argue to stay home forever

52andblue · 19/02/2021 15:15

Not all of them, certainly.
My two, both Autistic and vulnerable, went in for their first (and only) afternoon two weeks ago. No hand gel available in School. Of the 12 kids present only 4 wearing masks. I was told I've have to sign consent for lateral flow test which would be done on site. It wasnt. When I queried it I was told they only have capacity to do the morning kids, so if you want it done you'll have to drive back in the morning (40mule round trip school buses dont tally with times).
Just today I got a letter to say I'm CV due to Apnoea. So I'm a CV single parent of two disabled kids and the school has no gel, doesn't enforce masks and doesn't run tests.
Mr Johnson is a liar if he claims all Schools are safe - they are no such thing.

fredred · 19/02/2021 15:16

@SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS

Thank god nurses, doctors, supermarket workers, care workers, factory workers, delivery drivers don't all behave the same way
What way is that?
herecomesthsun · 19/02/2021 15:16

@SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS

Thank god nurses, doctors, supermarket workers, care workers, factory workers, delivery drivers don't all behave the same way
wanting safe working conditions? I think those of us in those professions get risk assessed as well!
Fiona2020 · 19/02/2021 15:16

I have to SD’s one is 5 and one 11. Doesn’t anyone else think they need to repeat the year because I do? Both their schools have been crap throughout this!

Delatron · 19/02/2021 15:17

Yep probably @SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS it’s ridiculous. It’s like we haven’t got multiple effective vaccines or something!

Timeturnerplease · 19/02/2021 15:17

Jesus Christ on a bike.

Teachers on here are NOT wanting schools to be ‘closed’.

They just want the government to put some safety measures in place so that we don’t spend the next however many months playing the isolation Hokey Cokey and cocking up any idea of consistent education.

Redtulipses · 19/02/2021 15:17

I've decided I'm not going in. So none of my classes will have a teacher if they try and force it. Sorry, but my life comes first, and since no one else seems to care about it enough to try and keep me safe, I'll now make the decision for myself. Section 44 ready to go if Boris says all open

Of course you can resign!

sashagabadon · 19/02/2021 15:17

Schools are “safe” though. They are not as “safe” as sitting on the sofa at home ( although for some children in abusive homes this isn’t safe either)
Schools need to go back ASAP. The goal posts need to stop moving. Same applies to universities.

HauntedPencil · 19/02/2021 15:17

@bbn81

For those who keep mentioning rotas, what happens to my primary aged child when I am in school teaching half my class every week when he can only be in school every other week. What happens to all the other key worker children. People are so quick to talk about rotas for pupils but not actually about the practicalities.
I doubt they will do rotas for primary no one else is (In the U.K.)

They are splitting infants & juniors - hence the key worker juniors can attend as normal.

pinkhappy · 19/02/2021 15:17

The numbers in London are starting to look really good. Maybe schools will open there first?

mumsneedwine · 19/02/2021 15:18

@SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS I did resign. But was persuaded to stay as otherwise we'd be losing 4 science teachers at Easter as 3 of my colleagues beat me to it. And no one has replied to job adverts for these jobs. That's never happened before.
If you want your kids being taught by constant supply teachers next year then open the schools. Because a lot of us will resign.

Shesingsshangrila · 19/02/2021 15:18

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

but it is beyond selfish of adults to deprive children of education

They aren’t though, remote education is being provided.

I mean, it isn't is it? Not really. Certainly not for primaries - I don't think setting a few 30 minute videos from Oak Academy or similar and then complete a couple of worksheets followed by a couple of live assemblies each week counts as 'education'. And that's not actually criticizing our school, because I think they are doing the best they can, but the reality is that if it was that easy to educate young children, we wouldn't bother with schools or teachers at all would we? We'd just all use Oak Academy and be done with it.
noblegiraffe · 19/02/2021 15:18

People are so quick to talk about rotas for pupils but not actually about the practicalities.

Certain year groups returned in primary in June and keyworker provision continued. If it was managed then, it can’t be impossible now.

OP posts:
motherrunner · 19/02/2021 15:18

Sorry, my last post sounds like it’s all ‘about me’.

The point I was trying to make is if we open as we did in Sept I’m worried again on the effects of my students - the repeated isolations, the full closures of our school. Our pupils are not oblivious. They saw sick teachers and peers. They were on edge. GCSE years spent more time at home in the Autumn term than in. They were sent home in the middle of the day. People talk about ‘mental health’. How is that level of uncertainty good for mental health?

herecomesthsun · 19/02/2021 15:18

@SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS

Are they op....

One would assume that by now CEV teachers have been vaccinated, CV being done now and many local authority employees also belong vaccinated.
Numbers of cases falling.

Schools need to reopen for all now.

"number of cases falling" in significant part because schools are closed
RMRM · 19/02/2021 15:18

It's not safe for parents, staff or children.

I don't want to send my children back currently. 1 primary, 2 secondary. I'd like to have that choice, but no doubt it will be Williamson bully boy tactics and lies instead.

worried3012 · 19/02/2021 15:18

@SPRINGTIMEBLUEBELLS

Thank god nurses, doctors, supermarket workers, care workers, factory workers, delivery drivers don't all behave the same way
I feel the most sorry for factory workers (I work in a factory but not as exposed as the actual warehouse staff). Many on our 3 huge industrial factories have no ventilation, unable to socially distance due to how the work is processed and many over 50's. They don't want to stop work though because they cannot afford no wage. I feel for them.
Cantaloupeisland · 19/02/2021 15:19

@Redtulipses when I say the same situation as before Christmas I'm referring to the situation in schools not the wider community/hospitals. Neither students nor staff will have had jabs so it's likely the spread will continue. As per my previous post, I'm not talking about people getting ill I'm talking about the disruption to education caused by cases and repeated isolation

Delatron · 19/02/2021 15:20

In September we didn’t have a vaccination program and we were going in to autum/winter:

We now have a very successful vaccination program and are going in to Spring...

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