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The government is about to tell you that schools are safe

999 replies

noblegiraffe · 19/02/2021 14:07

It's being reported that the government are about to embark on a two week PR campaign claiming that schools are safe. We've already seen hints of it in that Warwick report that was widely misreported as showing schools don't fuel community transmission (majorly pissing off the author who advocates a cautious return to schools).

The ONS random sampling survey graphs released today are amazing. They show a huge reduction in the infection rates due to lockdown, but the most incredible reduction is in the infection rate of secondary school children. They've gone from being the most infected subset of the population by far, to the 2nd least (behind 70+). It's clear that despite arguments that secondary kids were catching covid out of school (sleepovers, hanging around in parks etc), this just isn't true and the lack of mitigation measures in secondary schools allowed covid to run riot.

We can't re-open in the same way as in September. That would be madness. I know that people will say that it's fine, vulnerable people are being vaccinated and kids don't get it badly BUT what is not acknowledged is that kids aren't being vaccinated, a lot of their teachers won't be by March 8th, nor their parents and so we still need to keep infection levels down. In addition, rampant covid is incredibly disruptive to education. Teachers off for weeks, kids off isolating, some kids in, some kids out...Sept to Dec was a mess that we should be trying our best to avoid repeating. Vaccinations don't address that issue at all.

Community levels are low, but then they were low in September. Pubs, restaurants and non-essential shops are shut now, but we want to be able to open them. We cannot rely on community levels remaining low to stop covid getting into schools and proliferating.

We need to be careful, because certainly secondary schools aren't safe to re-open in a Big Bang gung-ho way that some are advocating, particularly with a more transmissible variant in circulation. Remember to the week before Christmas when school attendance plummeted in Kent and London? In one LA, secondary attendance was at 17%. And yet the DfE decided to threaten schools that wanted to close early to stop the spread with legal action. The schools were right, and the DfE was wrong. Gavin Williamson can't be trusted to have sensible conversations about safety, he's more interested in bully-boy tactics and setting himself up in opposition to teachers and schools.

What can be done? I think there is room to open schools in some way on March 8th. My personal preference (and I'm no spokesperson for teachers here, other opinions will vary) would be primaries back and exam years back for three weeks, then Easter can be used to examine the impact of the full primary re-opening . I'm not sure that school is such a major factor in transmission at primary as it is at secondary for various reasons, however I'm sure that my primary colleagues have their own ideas about what needs to be done there. If full primary re-opening looks untenable, then I would prefer rotas to only certain year groups in. Some school for all pupils would be better than all school for some pupils as we had last year.

Secondary is a different kettle of fish and should be treated separately. Secondaries were a massive risk for transmission. The word 'bubble' should never be used in reference to secondary schools again, as 'bubble' means a group of people who all have to isolate if one of them catches covid, which went in the bin in secondary around the end of September. There are some easy wins in secondary -
Masks in classrooms would be easy and cheap to implement. Exemptions would apply and clear ones could be provided where necessary for lip reading.
A national programme to improve ventilation.
Testing and isolation of any contacts where positive cases are found to flush out asymptomatic pupils (PCR not LFT).
Moving quickly to remote learning where there are outbreaks instead of trying to keep year groups in and schools open as covid works its way through - the attendance just before Christmas in some schools meant kids would have been better served educationally if they were all at home.

Home LFT testing of kids - I'm not convinced tbh, maybe in addition to above measures, but certainly not instead of them.

So if the government messaging is as it has been: schools are safe and no additional measures to contain the spread in secondary are needed then they are lying and our kids deserve a more consistent and sustainable education than they got from September.

Fingers crossed they are more sensible than we have previously seen.

The government is about to tell you that schools are safe
The government is about to tell you that schools are safe
The government is about to tell you that schools are safe
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8
itsgettingwierd · 19/02/2021 19:56

If someone had said that the schools and universities should shut because I happen to have this particular weakness (which they wouldn't, because flu - rightly - doesn't have the holy status of Covid), I would have thought they were completely mad.

Normal flu season doesn't kill 120k people in a year with frequent lockdowns and social distancing and masks.

Last time flu behaves the way covid is now it was declared a pandemic and lockdowns happened.

So no coronavirus isn't flu - but flu has caused pandemics like this coronavirus.

The same way the 4 corona viruses that circulate freely as the common cold don't cause these shut downs because a few people react badly to them.

HauntedPencil · 19/02/2021 19:57

[quote SpencerGregson]@MrsSpenserGregson Hello back, Aunt Agatha!

Slightly off topic here but throughout this thread, people keep saying it's pointless children only going back for 3 weeks, it would be better to return after 5, after Easter.

Are our holidays completely different to everyone else's?? Because where I live, the last day of term is 1 April, so that's potentially another 3 weeks & 4 days of lost time in school (and it's the lack of socialisation that none are most struggling with). So pretty much 4 weeks.

4 weeks back would make a MASSIVE difference to them. Another 8 weeks at home (which is what it will be) might just break us all.[/quote]
I think they are this year - we half planned to book a holiday as ours were different

I think it makes sense though, our Juniors would be back (if all goes well) 2 weeks on then 2 weeks off to assess and form a natural break.

SpencerGregson · 19/02/2021 19:57

Mine, not none! Oh that none of them were struggling!

BungleandGeorge · 19/02/2021 19:57

[quote SpencerGregson]@MrsSpenserGregson Hello back, Aunt Agatha!

Slightly off topic here but throughout this thread, people keep saying it's pointless children only going back for 3 weeks, it would be better to return after 5, after Easter.

Are our holidays completely different to everyone else's?? Because where I live, the last day of term is 1 April, so that's potentially another 3 weeks & 4 days of lost time in school (and it's the lack of socialisation that none are most struggling with). So pretty much 4 weeks.

4 weeks back would make a MASSIVE difference to them. Another 8 weeks at home (which is what it will be) might just break us all.[/quote]
Yes we’re basically a week earlier. Private schools must be earlier too.

OytheBumbler · 19/02/2021 19:57

I'm a primary teacher and even with reduced kw classes we were still having to isolate bubbles and send groups home before half term.

I can't see how getting everyone back in a 'Big Bang' on March 8th will be any different to how it was before Christmas. People don't seem to realise how incredibly disruptive it is for the children to be in and out all the time.

HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 19/02/2021 19:58

Not for weeks or months at a time, when staff and students are healthy, with no reopening date...

Staff aren't healthy, 30 been off with covid and 7 with long covid, one retired due to the effects of covid. That's just my one school.

There is a nationwide outbreak of coronavirus, hence schools closing. Schools returning with no safety measures will lead to more closures and isolations.

HauntedPencil · 19/02/2021 19:58

School threads on here are Properly batshit aren't they?

HalfPastThree · 19/02/2021 19:59

People are still comparing this to the flu

I'm in no way suggesting it's like flu in an unmitigated pandemic when nobody is immune. Of course it isn't.

But after the elderly have been vaccinated, it will have a similar (or lower) infection fatality rate to seasonal flu. The vaccine changes the game completely.

HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 19/02/2021 20:01

@HalfPastThree It's not just the deaths though. It's long covid, it's repeated isolation periods, it's ICU admissions.

HauntedPencil · 19/02/2021 20:01

@katieloves

When did we forget that unless you’re in a vulnerable category, you are just as likely to die from something else as you are from coronavirus. These considered most at risk have now been vaccinated. Everyone else needs to get on with things including education. You may get coronavirus and get ill, you may be run over on the way to school, you might get stung and have a reaction. Anyone could die any day from multiple things but probably not coronavirus.
The problem with this approach is that that you can accept your own personal risk - but you don't get to decide for others you can't spread a car crash for example. But you can spread Covid.

And I'm not a hard lockdown advocate - I think it is time to start thinking about relaxations but the better they go the quicker we can have a better life.

SpencerGregson · 19/02/2021 20:02

@BungleandGeorge I have one at private and she breaks up the week before, but goes back at the same time as my others.

In normal times, she'd be looking forwards to 3 weeks off. Today she asked to watch The Gruffalo's Child as it reminds her of happy times.

She's 13 Sad

thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter · 19/02/2021 20:04

My DC's primary school is not safe, they have half the school in thanks to keyworker status being abused by employers. 3 bubbles/yrs have had to isolate since January this year. At least half of the staff have had covid with the head thinking that once they've had it they become The Highlander. And in regards to week on/off rotas I'm assuming keyworkers DC will be in full time regardless, meaning classes will be 75% of total pupils - what is the point!

teachermummy1 · 19/02/2021 20:05

I want my y12 DD back in. Her sixth form never had a Covid case before lockdown. Schools are safe in my opinion, yes there is a possible likelihood of catching Covid but it does not mean your child will die.
Neither myself or DD want her wearing a mask all day. Even at 16 it is ridiculous. The kids struggle with 20 minutes at break.
Face coverings aren't even that effective. As you said, primaries in on March 8, then y11, 12 and 13 in after Easter. A (quick) phased return for the other years, perhaps with secondaries on a rota.
I don't care for the government, but nor do I care for false news that schools aren't safe.

Blacktothepink · 19/02/2021 20:05

My nephew is 13 and an athlete with no underlying health conditions and is now in hospital having tests...his kidneys are leaking blood and is causing high blood pressure. There were 25 cases in his year group...

HalfPastThree · 19/02/2021 20:05

Schools were only ever closed because there was a dire emergency and a fear that hospitals would be overwhelmed. That emergency has now ended.

Before 2020 nobody would ever have dreamed of closing schools to stop something like long covid. You'd have been laughed out of town.

Blacktothepink · 19/02/2021 20:06

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HauntedPencil · 19/02/2021 20:06

@HalfPastThree

Schools were only ever closed because there was a dire emergency and a fear that hospitals would be overwhelmed. That emergency has now ended.

Before 2020 nobody would ever have dreamed of closing schools to stop something like long covid. You'd have been laughed out of town.

They'll be open soon - people just want it done properly
Blacktothepink · 19/02/2021 20:07

Schools are definitely not safe!

Tiktokersmiracle · 19/02/2021 20:07

@teachermummy1

I want my y12 DD back in. Her sixth form never had a Covid case before lockdown. Schools are safe in my opinion, yes there is a possible likelihood of catching Covid but it does not mean your child will die. Neither myself or DD want her wearing a mask all day. Even at 16 it is ridiculous. The kids struggle with 20 minutes at break. Face coverings aren't even that effective. As you said, primaries in on March 8, then y11, 12 and 13 in after Easter. A (quick) phased return for the other years, perhaps with secondaries on a rota. I don't care for the government, but nor do I care for false news that schools aren't safe.
So your child is ok, stuff everyone else? As I said, a teacher at our school, a man in his mid 50s, died in January. He caught it before school broke up. Everyone has the right to go to work safely At the moment supermarket staff are safer than teachers. At least they get to sit behind perspex and everyone has to wear a mask in a shop unless exempt
LadyPenelope68 · 19/02/2021 20:08

@AledsiPad
Most of us really don't care - we prioritise our children. They need to be in school. Teachers are free to quit - there are plenty of us training to replace them.
Sorry, I’ll just pick myself up off the floor from laughing. I see you missed your part of the training on being nice.

HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 19/02/2021 20:09

@teachermummy1 Schools are safe in my opinion, yes there is a possible likelihood of catching Covid but it does not mean your child will die.

How callous and ignorant.

It's not just the children dying, it's whoever else they take it home to. Death isn't the only issue either, children and adults are getting seriously ill with covid and having serious long term health problems.

Hammonds · 19/02/2021 20:09

[quote HercwasanEnemyofEducation]@Hammonds He should already be accessing a vulnerable student place at school if that's the scenario.[/quote]
Having a place available at school is all good and well but the problems start when the parent doesn’t want to take them, get out of bed, get them out of bed, get dressed - face the world ect..

Yes the authorities have been round but he is alive, fed, and unharmed so he is at the bottom of a very long list of vulnerable children. The reason he went to school precovid was because it was the law. Now it isn’t.

NovemberR · 19/02/2021 20:10

@AledsiPad

Most of us really don't care - we prioritise our children. They need to be in school. Teachers are free to quit - there are plenty of us training to replace them.
Speak for yourself.

I don't want you teaching my A level child, thanks. You don't have enough experience.

I want his current 54 (ish) year old teacher, thanks. She's excellent. I also want her to be safe.