Anti-lockdown campaigners using children to push their agenda

[noblegiraffe]

I can't be the only one disgusted with how certain groups are using faux concern about children to push the earliest dismantling of lockdown restrictions.

They are loudly catastrophising on the front pages of the press about our kids. The lost generation. £40,000 in lost earnings. Articles about schools full of traumatised kids suffering PTSD caused by lockdown.

And the solution they propose is always to re-open schools as early as possible. Even before March 8th. Regardless of covid.

Now, the situation in schools before Christmas was awful. Some areas of the country had less than 50% attendance due to the new variant ripping through secondary schools. Secondary school kids were the most infected subset of the population by far, and are now the second least infected subset of the population behind the 70+ age group after schools were closed, demonstrating that there was a massive problem with transmission in secondary schools. It wasn't good for pupils' mental health or education to be in a situation when they didn't know if they'd be in school or out at the drop of a hat. But before Christmas, there was complete media silence on the impact that this was having on children.

CAMHS has been devastated by cuts. Waiting lists are intolerable and children in dire need of support don't even qualify. Same for social care around vulnerable children.

Yet you won't hear these people clamouring for schools re-opening as soon as possible talking at all about how to improve safety measures in schools to prevent the scenario we had before Christmas happening again. You won't hear them demanding more funding for children's mental health services and for more support for social care services.

And the reason you won't hear that is that THEY DON'T GIVE A SHIT.

The reason that they want schools re-opened as quickly as possible is because the message was that schools had to open first.

They can't get what they really want open (everything else) until schools are open, hence the massive focus on schools and how terrible things are for children.

This catastrophising isn't good for parents or kids. It's scaremongering and unhelpful.

I know that there are kids (and parents) really struggling with their mental health and worried about their education. Blaring out messages about how terrible things are and how they will never recover because you want to hype up the message about schools going back is irresponsible and sickening.

We need sensible and calm conversations about how to support children and parents. We need funding for schools and massive investment in support services. We need a long-term program of recovery, not 9 months of a Catch-Up Tsar and quick fixes. We need a measured and sensible approach to schools re-opening that won't see kids in and out and in and out due to lack of mitigation measures causing rampant covid spread (particularly with the new variant).

We need these anti-lockdown campaigners to shut up and stop dominating the narrative.

I complete agree with you echt

Give it a year and none of these posters will be asking about why children from disadvantaged backgrounds are behind their advantaged peers in terms of educational outcomes.

They won’t be campaigning for the services which support children and families to be reinstated.

They won’t be reading research on the language gap so they can attempt to plug some of the gaps.

They’ll be back to talking about INSET and snow days.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

I don’t know unless l see the post......

You won't see them, most were deleted by MN... I wonder why?

Teachers are parents too - does that mean we’re fighting ourselves? 🤔

@smileeachday what about off rolling children then or excluding them? There are plenty of schools and teachers actively entrenching problems. Not all schools and teachers but my mum is a teacher and the problems she sees are massive, she works in AP with the children schools have written off.

@Boredsobored

But the school situation before Christmas wasn't awful. Our school has had not one covid case in the whole year. The kids were getting on great then closed again. I don't care who it is, we need to get the kids back into school. Far better than them being ignored because we're working full time as keyworkers but can't get a school place.

@Boredsobored it was in many areas. In my local area schools and also in my DS's school periods of isolation repeatedly happened and they had an increasing number of Covid cases- in the end they closed a week early as they didn't have enough staff and too many students had Covid too

@SmileEachDay

I complete agree with you echt

Give it a year and none of these posters will be asking about why children from disadvantaged backgrounds are behind their advantaged peers in terms of educational outcomes.

They won’t be campaigning for the services which support children and families to be reinstated.

They won’t be reading research on the language gap so they can attempt to plug some of the gaps.

They’ll be back to talking about INSET and snow days.

And you know this how? Crystal ball? Or just being judgemental as usual?

You have no fucking idea what people will be thinking in a year's time.

[quote echt]Teachers unions are there to get the best deal for teachers

That's their job, to represent the interests of their members.

The NEU has campaigned for increased funding for schools and colleges:

neu.org.uk/campaigns/funding[/quote]
Indeed and they are not representing the children’s interests. All this “we want schools back safely” is cover for wanting more funding for schools/ teachers and to further the aims of teachers.

It’s the hypocrisy of claiming that business groups have politicised this for their own aims whilst claiming teachers unions are thinking of the kids. They’re not - they’re manipulating things for their members best interests. No one is representing children’s interests.

@Boredsobored

"Noble shared evidence above that children are usually the index (first) case in a household. Anecdotally this was an asymptomatic child"

@HercwasanEnemyofEducation
I've heard this before and seen a screenshot but it doesn't make sense. Most hospitalisations have been in the sector of society furthest removed from children. I think it must mean in a household with a child, the child is the index case. That makes more sense as most households with younger children are homeworking so school is the only 'risk' but still very small compared to what is happening in the wider population.

Most people with covid have not caught it from a child. Even more true of the thousands of people who have caught covid in the past 2 months when schools have been closed.

Plenty of scientists would doubt and disprove the statement that noble has made so forgive me if I used a bit of critical thinking and listen to qualified people not some screenshot on Mumsnet

It was revealed that 40% of cases are directly from the NHS - are posters really saying that 60% of cases come directly from children? I thought the pubs were getting the blame at one point 🥴

[quote Remmy123]@EnemyOfEducationNo1 the head is allowed to enforce masks - they did in my son's school

If that is what teachers want to happen then ask your head[/quote]
Actually. No. They are not allowed to enforce masks in classrooms. Corridors - yes, classrooms, nope.

Well on the 101 other school related threads, a good number of teachers seem like they want to be back asap and a lot of them even says they have been in school with 25%-50% of vulnerable and key worker kids anyways.
It just seems to be really divisive with one group who completely support noble's cause and the rest of the teachers who actually just want to be back on the 8th of March no matter what.
As far as I am concerned, like I said earlier on DH works with patients who breathes and coughs all over him everyday and all he can do is wear his mask and visor which most teachers have been given the option to do or done it regardless of what the govt said.

And I'd love to acquire SmileEachDay's crystal ball.

All this “we want schools back safely” is cover for wanting more funding for schools/ teachers and to further the aims of teachers.

It would of course be despicable to want more funding for schools, wouldn't it?
And furthering the aims of teachers to what? Not have to buy our own equipment for the classroom?

@SmileEachDay

I complete agree with you echt

Give it a year and none of these posters will be asking about why children from disadvantaged backgrounds are behind their advantaged peers in terms of educational outcomes.

They won’t be campaigning for the services which support children and families to be reinstated.

They won’t be reading research on the language gap so they can attempt to plug some of the gaps.

They’ll be back to talking about INSET and snow days.

Absolutely.

Day after day we strive to help our pupils, it’s what we do. We don’t ‘campaign’ for it, it’s just done. Because we know it’s need to be for the good of our pupils so when some groups say they are the Voice of the Children it is a bit galling.

In 2006 I taught siblings that had arrived in the UK under a lorry. Couldn’t speak English. Thrown into schools. I worked hard to get them through their GCSEs. Where was the Voice of the Children then?

In 2008 I taught a boy who killed himself. He suffered daily abuse at home. Where were those campaigners then?

Personally, I’ve been waiting over a year for my child to see Autism Outreach. Where were his campaigners (aside from DH and me)?

Er what do you think teachers want?
I think I'm bowing out.

Teachers are the ones whose very job and purpose is in the children's interests. They ask for funding for schools for the children. Gosh that cant be separated. It's teachers that will be frontline supporting children /mental health etc.

There's certainly a significant vocal minority on here with an anti teacher agenda. Which if you support children's interests is puzzling...

It's very worrying that some posters think that all will be well in schools because of the testing. Here's a quote from the British Medical Journal which nicely sums up why this does not keep schools safe:

The document then adds, “In the field evaluation in Liverpool, compared with PCR tests, these tests picked up five out of 10 of the cases PCR detected and seven out of 10 cases with higher viral loads, who are likely to be the most infectious.” Deeks said, “These results are devastating—they are missing a third of those with high viral loads. How can these tests be used for safe entry into care homes, for healthcare workers to safely return to work, or for the safe return of students? They are not fit for purpose.”

It's also worrying that some posters think that schools are safe because everyone wears a mask. Many schools do not allow staff to wear masks.

It's also very worrying that some posters are unable to understand the OP. If you read "how certain groups are using faux concern about children to push the earliest dismantling of lockdown restrictions" and think to yourself "my concern for children is very real", then the OP is not directed at you and you don't need to be offended.

TrustTheGeneGenie

I mean, that's something this group specifically did do with the flowers so...

Its interesting that you have forgotten (or are intentionally leaving out) what the flowers were in response to.

smileeachday what about off rolling children then or excluding them? There are plenty of schools and teachers actively entrenching problems. Not all schools and teachers but my mum is a teacher and the problems she sees are massive, she works in AP with the children schools have written off

I agree that there is huge inconsistency in the school system - particularly around children who struggle in mainstream settings - many of these issues could be solved by properly funding early intervention services for children and families. I think there are also a range of arguments about AP and the best way to manage this - I’m the DSLO at my school so I’ve got my professional opinions about this - but probably not for this thread!

If you want to start a thread about this, I’d love to discuss it..

You have no fucking idea what people will be thinking in a year's time

Ha. True. Maybe a positive outcome of covid will be wider society being prepared to really look at how divided we are as a nation in terms of education.
Maybe wider society will be really pushing to fund the state sector properly. Maybe.

Do you think they will?

@smileeachday great answer I'm sure my mum would agree with all you've said. I think it's the argument that schools get everything right and everyone that works in them have the same priorities. That's not the case for anywhere or anything, so in the context of covid we should be aware of that!

It's funny that some people think most teachers are free to wear masks in the classroom despite government instructions not to.
A lot of schools strictly follow government advice. We would be going against our employers strict instructions. That would not go well....

Plenty of scientists would doubt and disprove the statement that noble has made so forgive me if I used a bit of critical thinking and listen to qualified people not some screenshot on Mumsnet

Knock yourself out: assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/948617/s0998-tfc-update-to-4-november-2020-paper-on-children-schools-transmission.pdf screenshot is from page 9.

Obviously households without a child aren’t going to have an index case that’s a child, that’s just obvious. The problem is that with schools open, children are bringing covid home and spreading it to their families. Schools aren’t self-contained and re-opening them with the same lack of mitigation measures as last time will impact the communities around them.

It’s the hypocrisy of claiming that business groups have politicised this for their own aims whilst claiming teachers unions are thinking of the kids. They’re not - they’re manipulating things for their members best interests. No one is representing children’s interests.

I personally think it's in children's best interest to be back at school. Even with cases circulating amongst them, as the benefits far outweigh the costs to them. Even before vaccinations, but especially now.

No one is representing children’s interests

That is the job of government. Oh, hang on......

to your mum, Bored - I imagine she’s been working in school throughout this.

one group who completely support noble's cause and the rest of the teachers who actually just want to be back on the 8th of March no matter what.

What’s my cause? You don’t even know, even though I wrote it in my OP.

Bored Schools are beating the brunt of this because it is in the nature of Covid that if you cram 30 people into a small room it will transmit between them. If businesses did that the HSE would rightly close them down, they have had to implement extensive infection control measures including mask wearing and social distancing. If they don’t they face closure by HSE. As to the risk of getting a coffee it is virtually zero, that figure of 14% transmission in hospitality settings versus 46% in schools was when restaurants etc were still fully open. Teachers and pupils have not even had the protection offered by the infection control measures hospitality staff had in place even before they closed. It has been striking to me that when I go into the GPs the reception staff are socially distanced from you in full PPE whilst my teacher friends, even those who have health vulnerabilities, are expected to share a crowded classroom with 30 children for hours at a time with no protection whatsoever. That is exactly the best possible environment for the virus to transmit. Inside with people say close together for hours at a time. It isn’t a matter of children taking the brunt, it is that the school setting provides such an effective vector for infection.

The reason we are where we are is not that somebody has decided children should “bear the brunt” . It is because the world is in the midst of a pandemic of a highly transmissible virus and the government have failed to implement the public health measures that have successfully suppressed it elsewhere. The result is closed schools, prolonged lockdown, terrible economic damage and the impact on the general and mental health of us all. And yet as OP says we have stale white men co - opting our suffering in their political cause (which by the way is fuck business not pro business unless it is their cronies /disaster capitalists) which if they have their way will add to it.