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Original poster

MIL is an antivaxxer.. and I'm not!

188 replies

mummyoftwotinkers · 20/01/2021 13:05

Help please! My MIL is a fierce antivaxxer and always has been (she's 63 and fit and well). I am 100% pro vaccinations being medically trained and having several friends and family members currently on the front line, exhausted, terrified and stressed about what each day will bring.

She's saying she won't have the covid vaccine because it's 'not safe', 'not tested enough' 'contains metals that are toxic to us' and 'we don't know the side effects yet so she wants to let others try it and get those side effects first before making her decision'.

I am struggling with her selfishness about the whole situation, partly because I don't want her to catch it and give it to us (when restrictions lift- we're not seeing her at the mo), partly because I don't want my kids to give it to her (they go to nursery) and mostly because I cannot comprehend how someone cannot care about our poor healthcare workers having to treat people like this who may end up in hospital just because they 'didn't believe' in the vaccine. That, alongside the people who are ill with other conditions who wont necessarily get a hospital bed because she or other antivaxxers are filling the wards.

What do I do?! She's not eligible for the vaccine yet so I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt to change her mind, but I'm pretty sure that won't happen (my husband only found out he hasn't had the MMR jab when he was at uni and there was a mumps outbreak).

I feel like if she doesn't have the vaccine then I should continue to keep the kids at a distance from her, which I know she will take as me 'punishing her' for her choices (and maybe I am 🤷🏻‍♀️)

I don't want to fall out with her about this but I think this is going to drive a massive wedge in between us, and when our well-being (not just our belief) is on the line, I don't see why I should compromise?

Am I being unreasonable?!

OP posts:
3littlewords · 20/01/2021 15:18

OP just because people are commenting that its MIL choice doesn't mean they are also anti vaxx just that you have to accept her decision whether you feel its the right one or not. I've had several conversations about this with FIL, explained i don't want to lose him, that i don't want the dc passing it on , the unknown on transmission, the effect on NHS etc until im blue in the face its made no difference. The dc want to see their GP when they are able too, GP know the risks involved especially when they go back to school, I'm not going to punish my dc for something their GP has chosen to do or not do in this case.
For my own mental health ive had to admit defeat on this one for now and prey at some point down the line something will change his mind. They arent losing any sleep over it so I'm not going to either, and believe me i was losing sleep over it.

Original poster
mummyoftwotinkers · 20/01/2021 15:21

@Imaginetoday

If you get on well with her (as you say), can you get her to enter into a calm debate with you? Ask her to write down all the reasons she is an” anti Vaxer”, and if based on evidence that source. Ask her to allow you a right of reply to come back with debate on each point. Then take your time to look at her sources or concerns and write out a counter argument. Encourage the back and forth passing of information with arguments and counter arguments, stick to known factors and quote their sources. If she uses dodgy sources give evidence of why they are dodgy ( background of person or links they have) Hopefully over time you could make a few doubts of her decision creeep in and enough for her to go and look more clearly herself But, it does mean you need to do your homework too. Find out about how clinical trials work, how these vaccines were developed, what testing was done, how it was achieved so rapidly) the info is out there. Look for it and arm yourself.

There again if she’s stubborn she might just refuse to even debate, in which case, yanbu to isolate from her.

Yes I think that's a good idea. Her sources are certainly 'dodgy'. Since an initial chat about the vaccine a month ago I've done research. One of her reasons is that the vaccine contains mercury. It doesn't. It's a tricky one to broach without sounding patronising. But I think it needs to be done. She is a very calm person so it certainly wouldn't end in a blazing row, it's hurt feelings that I'm trying to avoid.
OP posts:
Pippa234 · 20/01/2021 15:26

I can see why it must be annoying to you.
I wouldn't stop her seeing the kids though once restrictions are relaxed, If she wants to take the risk let her.
For what it's worth I will take the vaccine if I am offered it.

trulydelicious · 20/01/2021 15:28

@mummyoftwotinkers

I don't want to live with that guilt and no matter what anyone says about 'well it was her choice to not have the vaccine' ultimately if my kids gave her the disease that killed her I'd feel pretty bad

If you continue to manipulate her, she may end up getting the vaccine. Will you also feel guilty if she had an anaphilactic reaction to the vaccine and could not recover?

Watermama · 20/01/2021 15:28

But what if once the R rate is down she doesn't want to see you?
Once you have used the children's against GP the relationship is irreparably damaged.
My BIL did this, to his shock once things calmed down the in-laws held him and the grandchildren at arms length scared to be hurt again by their own son. They have very little contact now they exchange cards and email but no contact.

Is your DH ok will potentially become estranged from his mother?

Chloemol · 20/01/2021 15:29

It’s up to your mil if she has the jab or not. That said it’s also up to you how to protect your own family and if that means not seeing her then that’s your choice to make, and hers to accept

trulydelicious · 20/01/2021 15:29

@lunar1

I don't think I'd want an unvaccinated adult in my home

Medical records are confidential. No one is under the obligation to disclose to you whether they have been vaccinated or not. Do you understand this?

Daddeee · 20/01/2021 15:30

so she wants to let others try it and get those side effects first before making her decision'.

There is no harm in waiting for a few months so there is more data available from the first countries that are rolling out the vaccine. Australia, NZ, Korea, and some other countries that have covid under control are doing exactly that.

But once the vaccine is shown to work in the general population beyond clinical trials, it will be harder to justify. But as long as your MIL is not spreading disinformation and encouraging others not to take a vaccine I wouldn't label her an anti-antivaxxer

Onadifferentuniverse · 20/01/2021 15:33

Having the vaccine doesn’t prevent her from being able to give it to you anyway.

Nobody should be seeing anyone until the majority of us have had the vaccination.

trulydelicious · 20/01/2021 15:37

@mummyoftwotinkers

You are weaponising your children and you are weaponising the NHS against your MIL

You don't sound sincere. It seems you are just flexing your muscle to make her cave in and abide by your rules

trulydelicious · 20/01/2021 15:42

And I don't have a view as to whether she should or shouldn't take the vaccine. It's her body, her choice

Original poster
mummyoftwotinkers · 20/01/2021 15:47

[quote trulydelicious]@mummyoftwotinkers

I don't want to live with that guilt and no matter what anyone says about 'well it was her choice to not have the vaccine' ultimately if my kids gave her the disease that killed her I'd feel pretty bad

If you continue to manipulate her, she may end up getting the vaccine. Will you also feel guilty if she had an anaphilactic reaction to the vaccine and could not recover?[/quote]
The chance of her catching covid is far far far higher than getting an anaphylactic reaction to the vaccine. From what I hear many people are getting adverse reactions to the vaccine such as short term fever, sore arm and headaches. That's one we have to take for the team. And by team, I mean general public. The chance of her getting sick from covid is infinity higher than an actual anaphylactic reaction to the vaccine.

OP posts:
Ebow · 20/01/2021 15:51

I am very pro vaccination but also very pro choice when it comes to these matters. It's fine saying you have done your research but that is exactly what an antivaxxer would say and they would get their arse handed to them on threads like this.
I understand the sheer frustration but it comes down to personal choice. DO NOT LET THIS COME BETWEEN YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR GRANDMA. If anything this pandemic has taught us is that life is too short to hold grudges.
No doubt you will get the vaccination when it becomes available, so will your children. Don't tie yourself in knots over this. You can't control the actions of those around you.

2bazookas · 20/01/2021 16:01

That's fine, her choice.

But you have choices too; like you and DH getting vaccinated then deciding not to have her in your home or near you.

Ebow · 20/01/2021 16:07

But you have choices too; like you and DH getting vaccinated then deciding not to have her in your home or near you.

Really?! Willing to throw a whole relationship away with a parent over something which will potentially have very little impact on their own family if they also get vaccinated?
That's ridiculous.

Hollywhiskey · 20/01/2021 16:28

My parents in law are antivaxxers. They sat me down when I had my first baby and instead of congratulating me and saying she was beautiful, told me Wakefield was a misunderstood genius and that if I vaccinated her she'd get autism.

Covid has encouraged them in their conspiracy theories and there is not a chance they will be getting the vaccine for it. Husband and I will but our kids won't as it isn't licensed obviously. They go to nursery so it's a risk. We haven't had that much contact recently because of the conspiracy theories but if the kids give them covid honestly it's up to them. That sounds awful but what are my choices? I'm not going to pull my kids out of nursery or stop them seeing friends when that's allowed. I'm not going to restrict my husband's contact with his parents or ask him to keep his parents from seeing his kids, that's his choice. And I can't force my in laws to get vaccinated. I'd say they know the risks but I don't think do they get it, given some of the things they say.
So yes, I get it, it's really hard. But you can't make people get vaccinated for their own protection. We don't discuss it with them for our own sanity - we're not going to change their mind so what's the point? If they were just a bit anxious about how the new vaccine had been tested that would be one thing but you can't reason with anti vaxxers.

Timeontimeoff · 20/01/2021 16:37

You have facts and science on her side.

She has ignorance and maybe she is scared underneath. She isn't medically trained and so perhaps she doesn't understand how vaccines are made, what they contain etc... how the immune system works etc.. The trouble is with these anti vaxers some will trot out lines that they have heard ...sheeple.... MSM would say that...Big Pharm tell lies..... etc and they have a button that appears to make them a big thick all around.

Timeontimeoff · 20/01/2021 16:39

At 63 though and fit and healthy she is way down the list so they won't offer to her anytime soon. She just has to say no. There already are millions already vaccinated - they don't all appear to be mutated/dying/turning purple or being controlled by Bill Gates just yet though...

Original poster
mummyoftwotinkers · 20/01/2021 16:42

@Hollywhiskey

My parents in law are antivaxxers. They sat me down when I had my first baby and instead of congratulating me and saying she was beautiful, told me Wakefield was a misunderstood genius and that if I vaccinated her she'd get autism.

Covid has encouraged them in their conspiracy theories and there is not a chance they will be getting the vaccine for it. Husband and I will but our kids won't as it isn't licensed obviously. They go to nursery so it's a risk. We haven't had that much contact recently because of the conspiracy theories but if the kids give them covid honestly it's up to them. That sounds awful but what are my choices? I'm not going to pull my kids out of nursery or stop them seeing friends when that's allowed. I'm not going to restrict my husband's contact with his parents or ask him to keep his parents from seeing his kids, that's his choice. And I can't force my in laws to get vaccinated. I'd say they know the risks but I don't think do they get it, given some of the things they say.
So yes, I get it, it's really hard. But you can't make people get vaccinated for their own protection. We don't discuss it with them for our own sanity - we're not going to change their mind so what's the point? If they were just a bit anxious about how the new vaccine had been tested that would be one thing but you can't reason with anti vaxxers.

I feel for you. My MIL had same chat with my SIL when baby 1 was born. I think she didn't bother with me as she knew she'd hit a brick wall.

I think you're right, I will just have to accept her views are her own and they will not be changed.

However It does make me uneasy knowing that she will be spending time with others who are unvaccinated (her close circle of friends all have a similar mindset). I think I will have to wait until the risk to everyone, her, me, kids and the NHS has decreased before spending close time inside. Of course this could be taken out of our hands anyway with the restrictions as they are.

OP posts:
stonecoldhippo · 20/01/2021 16:43

I’m not keen on vaccination either, but I see it as a civic duty and having done my research I feel it’s a case of damned if you do and damned if you don’t. There may possibly be unknown side effects of the vaccine down the line, but equally getting covid can be extremely unpleasant if not terminal for an older person. If she is adamant, you’ve tried and if your children give it to her, tough.

NeverDropYourMoonCup · 20/01/2021 17:03

@Watermama

So you will use your children as a weapon against your mil to enforce your will upon her? There is very little risk to your children, the risk is your mil surely she has the right to her own body autonomy.
Better than them being unwilling biological agents, which is likely what they would act as if this woman keeps to the antivaxxing stance.

Unless she confines herself within her own four walls for the rest of her life, odds are that she'll catch it from somebody. It just doesn't have to be the OP's children.

(FIL is an antivaxxer of a very similar age. The first and last time we had a discussion - well, him telling me vaccination and medicine was unnatural with their potions and bits of animals and how doctors want you to be ill so they make money pretending to heal you - the conversation ended rather quickly with 'It's not fucking witchcraft, Dave')

withmycoffee · 20/01/2021 17:30

@WorraLiberty

I'm not sure it's fair to label her as an 'anti-vaxxer' because she's scared of being injected with a new vaccine.

My dad had serious reservations at first and thankfully we were able to discuss his fears and put them to rest, meaning he's now had the vaccine.

With regards to keeping your children away from her (whether as a punishment or not), she's a grown adult who is making her own choice whether you agree with it or not, so dragging your kids into this as punishment is a bit low.

She's clearly an anti Vader as she didn't get her own don the MMR when he was young.
3littlewords · 20/01/2021 17:32

@NeverDropYourMoonCup I think we have the same FIL. He thinks I'm mad for wanting it, I've been brainwashed etc etc . I've given up bothering now leave him and his tin foil hat too it

lljkk · 20/01/2021 17:36

If any of my relatives were to swerve the vaccine, I would be swerving them

This reminds me why I'm not planning to tell anyone my vaccination status. Or I'll lie to tell them what they want to hear.

Yohoheaveho · 20/01/2021 17:37

DO NOT LET THIS COME BETWEEN YOUR CHILDREN AND THEIR GRANDMA
yer but, she sounds like the sort of grandma that children need protecting from!!