The Psychology of those who look to depress others

[Outseyeder]

This situation has created a unique opportunity for a particular group of people. Those who gain enjoyment and self-esteem from controlling others emotions, specifically people who are looking for reassurance about when the existing restrictions might be eased.
The pattern is now quite clear. First there is an OP saying words to the effect of "when do you think we will have a normal life again". Sometimes there are specific variants like "Am I being optimistic booking a holiday for x date".
You can almost smell the glee in the Controllers' when they see post like this (or are they planting them there themselves??). They pounce with a formulation along the lines of "if you think this is going to be over by y you're going to be sorely disappointed. I think it will be at least z...." with some added justifications and virtue signalling. The Controllers seem to have engineered a sort of reverse takeover of MN, especially this section, and lurk and lurk waiting to pounce.
It is hard not to conclude that these people are absolutely REVELLING in the lost quality of life of others around them, and their great ally is uncertainty. This allows them to make prediction after prediction, once they have assessed the expectations of the other side which they want to undermine. They will never ever admit to being what they are, but they are all over this website at the moment and it is time they were called out.

If you were one of the people who thought in march we could lockdown for a few months and everything would be normal by 2021, how would you feel now? I remember at the start, people judged me for going to a shopping centre when they opened but I told them, covid restrictions would be part of life for the best part of 2 years, I am going when I can. While they thought it would be over in the matter of months and I was being impatient.
It's a pandemic. The virus doesn't care about mental health sadly. We have to take each day as it comes rather than hoping for an end at the end of some arbitrary figure. But if you asked me what I thought, I would say a year of on and off lockdowns. Spanish flu lasted 2 years. We had a year of this and still have so many deaths. It would take a year to give the population the 2 vaccine doses.

@Brunt0n

There’s certainly a lot of this online, and I’ve met people like this in real life. I’ve come to the conclusion that some people just actually like being unhappy!

This is not correct for most people.

All humans want to avoid being upset.

Preparing for the worst is a tried and tested way to avoid future upset.

The clash comes because some want to avoid upset now (by hoping for the best) and some want to avoid upset later (by preparing for the worst).

Ultimately, most people are decent people.

I can at times feel angry with people being too hopeful, because they scare me. I try to remember we're all just shitting ourselves because we can't control anything

If you were one of the people who thought in march we could lockdown for a few months and everything would be normal by 2021, how would you feel now?

If I’d known last March that this is where we’d be now, I’d have contemplated throwing myself off a bridge, so better for me at least not to know.

I do think Nellodee makes a good point. Looking back through covid threads since last March, it would be interesting to see which camp was right.

@TheKeatingFive

I think it depends on the degree. Nothing wrong with having different views on the timelines/not wanting to be overly optimistic.

But there’s a certain type of poster that’s all ‘we’ll never be back, there will never be a festival again, we’ll be having weddings over Zoom from now on’. I just assume those people are mentally unwell and scroll on by.

This. There's nothing wrong with pragmatism on timeframes, but banging on about a new socially remote world here to stay forever isn't realistic or healthy.

It's quite obvious, not many genuine posters start a controversial thread anyway. I don't tend to trust those who start the thread with dramatic or scaremongering title as well meaning these days.

I call them social vampires. They're people who suck all the fun out of life and I say this as someone who struggles with their own mental health. If you know a social vampire then you ought to cut them out of your life it at all possible, if you cannot, then reduce the amount of time you have to be around them.

@TheKeatingFive I would prefer to know so that i have time to get used to the idea. All out of my hands really. But that's just me. Sending you healing.

If anyone says to me (eg) “when do you think we can go on holiday again”, I say “no one knows” because that’s the case. If they ask again, I ignore and avoid them, because I really CBA with stupid questions to which no one knows the answer.

People are entitled to post what they want, although I wonder if some of the negative opinions here don't like the fact that they may recognise themselves and their own motivations in it. It isn't the fact that the opinions are negative or pessimistic that is problematic, it is the perception that these opinions are held back until there is evidence of the opposite, and then unleashed. Because the consequences of disbelieving the negative opinion are worse than those of disbelieving the positive h
there will always be an inherent perceived wisdom ascribed to the "telling it like it is, bitter pill not sugercoated" brigade. Some will also falsely ascribe maturity to such posts as they may see hope or a desire to take pleasure in life as childish or selfish traits. I maintain that this is one of the big things that has emerged on MN during this situation.

People deal with different situations differently. I personally like to imagine and mentally gear up for the worst case scenario, so for me "expecting" that we won't get out of restrictions this year is the way I deal with it because it means I can process it, plan ahead and therefore deal with it calmly if it happens. And if it doesn't happen (and worst case scenarios often don't) then it's a bonus. It's helped me to process me through how it might feel.

Other people (like the poster who said they'd probably have jumped off a bridge if they'd know how long this would last), clearly like to assume the best might happen because thinking long term is too much for them. Great - if that works for them. It's a mindset I find hard to understand hence why I might say "do you really think that?", although these days I mostly just nod and smile.

Same thing when people say they want politicians to give dates for when restrictions will be lifted. I don't want dates unless they are 100% likely to happen (which I think is no date so far) as they just give false hope. It's much easier for me to know there is no end date.

I don't think my way of dealing with things is wrong. If people want to deal with things differently that's up to them, but they also need to realise that their way is not necessarily the right way.

Some people just enjoy chucking buckets of iced water over anyone desperate for a little bit of hope.

I dare say they’re often the same ones who enjoy having a safe, anonymous go at anyone else, about virtually anything.

Or maybe they’re just those naturally gloomy, glass-half-empty types anyway, who actually seem to enjoy wallowing in ‘everything-is-shit’ and aren’t happy unless they can find some shit to wallow in.

Some people just enjoy chucking buckets of iced water over anyone desperate for a little bit of hope.

I dare say they’re often the same ones who enjoy having a safe, anonymous go at anyone else, about virtually anything.

The two often do seem to go hand in hand.

I think people who are depressed by posts need to step away instead of complaining about what other people do that depresses them.

Take responsibility for your own reactions before trying to control everyone else.

I think people who are depressed by posts need to step away instead of complaining about what other people do that depresses them.

Take responsibility for your own reactions before trying to control everyone else.

That’s true. People with such a negative, miserable mindset will never change - it’s pointless and a waste of time even engaging with them.

Saw a paper recently which explained that how, for some isolated people, lockdown had reduced their depression because they felt like everyone else was in the same boat. I get why people in that position would not want this to end.

I was optimistic that I could meet my MIL and have a nice meal over christmas cos the government promised to lift restrictions. london got placed in tier 4 the week before. Learnt that the hard way not to get my hopes up.

I think that people who are defending these joy-suckers are confusing people who join in discussions on the slightly pessimistic side with those who actively seek to bring everyone down, based on no facts whatsoever.

Example: OP: Do you think my holiday abroad will go ahead in June?

Response 1: It's looking hopeful. The number of cases is just starting to come down and we have a great vaccine roll out underway. There's some evidence that the vaccine does prevent transmission and that it will be effective against the new strains. Hospital admissions and death rates will follow to come down and then we should move down the tiers. It's being reported that this could well be from the beginning of March. So hopefully by June most restrictions will be lifted. I really think that once we get the top 4 priority groups vaccinated then we will see the number of deaths much more in line with the flu, and we don't stop foreign travel for flu each year. Remember, people went on holidays abroad last summer so its highly possible that this summer will look the same.

Response 2: I'm not sure, I really hope so, but if it were me, I'd be prepared for it to be cancelled and maybe aim for a UK holiday. We are still not sure if the vaccine prevents transmission, and we won't even have all adults vaccinated until the beginning of autumn if all goes as planned with the roll-out. Most other countries are behind us in their vaccines so maybe 2022 is more realistic for holidays abroad. We may be just starting to come out of this peak, but remember that we thought the same in October and another wave came for Christmas. It is possible we come out of this lockdown too early and get another wave by June. We have no idea what other new strains may bring.

^ both valid options to me, based on some facts, and if scientists and experts can't be certain, how could we possibly know?

Response 3: I'm afraid there's no way you will be going on holiday in June. The government will open up far too early because of their own greed and we will get another wave. Sadly, the vaccine doesn't stop transmission so it will spread quickly again. The priority groups for the vaccine are ridiculous and are just leaving the virus to spread unchecked in the younger working people. If there is any air travel you will have to have a vaccine certificate to be able to fly and if you are a healthy adult under 60 then you won't be getting it for a long time. Unfortunately, even if this vaccine works, there will be a new mutations that the vaccine doesn't work for, so by the time everyone is vaccinated we'll have to start again, so what is the point? Unfortunately, I can't see holidays going ahead until at least 2025. And even then we will still be wearing masks and have social distancing, so it will hardly be an enjoyable holiday will it?

^ number 3 is who the OP means. I'm still not sure if they are mentally unwell and need support or are just very nasty people who have no reason to post responses like this other than to bring others down- maybe to how they feel, or maybe they don't even believe it themselves. There's just no need for it.

There are plenty of worried, anxious or just negative about everything posters. Just like their are look on the bright side, positive thinking or factual reasoning posters.

Both are real or realistic the majority of the time.

However I do also agree to some extent with you. There are posters that are gleefully feeding on other peoples worries. You do see it a lot here. Wide eyed innocents, slowly stirring the pot and drip feeding. It is disgusting.

The site has always attracted a small number of journalists, people wanting to push an agenda and nut jobs. However luckily most people are genuinely real and debating or expressing their feelings. The fact that some seem miserable about everything is something else entirely.

Here's an alternate point of view.

I find it incredibly stressful making plans for life to be normal again when I know it's not going to be. It brings back shades of living with family members with cancer and pretending that there is a future with them in it when we knew that wasn't true. Making plans that get cancelled stresses me. Telling my kids something is cancelled upsets them. Being around people who want to pretend things will magically be okay is not fun for me.

I've had enough counselling to know the reasons for this and stay away from those threads. Not everyone will have.

I think there's a difference between 'I doubt restrictions will be totally lifted by autumn of 2021' type posts, and those along the lines of 'I'm afraid many restrictions are not going to be lifted for years, if ever'.

@Ohcomeallyechristmas

I think that people who are defending these joy-suckers are confusing people who join in discussions on the slightly pessimistic side with those who actively seek to bring everyone down, based on no facts whatsoever.

Example: OP: Do you think my holiday abroad will go ahead in June?

Response 1: It's looking hopeful. The number of cases is just starting to come down and we have a great vaccine roll out underway. There's some evidence that the vaccine does prevent transmission and that it will be effective against the new strains. Hospital admissions and death rates will follow to come down and then we should move down the tiers. It's being reported that this could well be from the beginning of March. So hopefully by June most restrictions will be lifted. I really think that once we get the top 4 priority groups vaccinated then we will see the number of deaths much more in line with the flu, and we don't stop foreign travel for flu each year. Remember, people went on holidays abroad last summer so its highly possible that this summer will look the same.

Response 2: I'm not sure, I really hope so, but if it were me, I'd be prepared for it to be cancelled and maybe aim for a UK holiday. We are still not sure if the vaccine prevents transmission, and we won't even have all adults vaccinated until the beginning of autumn if all goes as planned with the roll-out. Most other countries are behind us in their vaccines so maybe 2022 is more realistic for holidays abroad. We may be just starting to come out of this peak, but remember that we thought the same in October and another wave came for Christmas. It is possible we come out of this lockdown too early and get another wave by June. We have no idea what other new strains may bring.

^ both valid options to me, based on some facts, and if scientists and experts can't be certain, how could we possibly know?

Response 3: I'm afraid there's no way you will be going on holiday in June. The government will open up far too early because of their own greed and we will get another wave. Sadly, the vaccine doesn't stop transmission so it will spread quickly again. The priority groups for the vaccine are ridiculous and are just leaving the virus to spread unchecked in the younger working people. If there is any air travel you will have to have a vaccine certificate to be able to fly and if you are a healthy adult under 60 then you won't be getting it for a long time. Unfortunately, even if this vaccine works, there will be a new mutations that the vaccine doesn't work for, so by the time everyone is vaccinated we'll have to start again, so what is the point? Unfortunately, I can't see holidays going ahead until at least 2025. And even then we will still be wearing masks and have social distancing, so it will hardly be an enjoyable holiday will it?

^ number 3 is who the OP means. I'm still not sure if they are mentally unwell and need support or are just very nasty people who have no reason to post responses like this other than to bring others down- maybe to how they feel, or maybe they don't even believe it themselves. There's just no need for it.

I would agree with this post.

However, there are a lot of category 2 posts that sound like category 3 but end up being true, ie,

"If children return to school in September with no mitigations, it is intevitable we will have a second wave over winter."

"Eat out to help out is a terrible idea that will prevent us supressing cases to a level at which we can cope with them by using test and trace, and in the long term will have a negative effect on the economy."

Category 2 or category 3?

I think a lot of it is projection.

Projection of their own incapacity to deal with the chaos that ensues psychologically for themselves. The pandemic has thrown many peoples' psyches into turmoil - they (naturally) want order, predictability and a 'safe world' and because the pandemic brings none of these things - it is the exact opposite - it creates huge anxiety in them and this is projected out to others who are seen to be contributing to more 'chaos' by rule breaking or even questioning the govt strategy (e.g. lockdowns bring 'order' to them - so even if there are legitimate questions about efficacy this cannot be tolerated as the lockdowns in themselves are a tool to sooth their internal anxiety)

Ultimately, many people find it hard to tolerate chaos and uncertainty and project this out to others. Constantly, it seems on Mumsnet.

I think there's a difference between 'I doubt restrictions will be totally lifted by autumn of 2021' type posts, and those along the lines of 'I'm afraid many restrictions are not going to be lifted for years, if ever'

And what the underlying motivations might be, I should add.

Let's analyse you, op, and tell you what your motivations for posting this were, and consider why you feel the need to control what people say and how they respond and which opinions they share.