Fed up with being called selfish for having kids in school

[Namechangeforcontroversy]

NC just in case

I’m so exhausted with people laying into other parents for being selfish for sending their children into school. Most of my friends ended up in tears daily, having to be furloughed and later losing their jobs and being fairly confident that having children contributed to that during the last lockdown. Parents cannot work from home effectively while homeschooling one or more children especially EYFS/KS1. These children are being failed. Parents who have important (but not key worker) jobs and who are reliant on both salaries are being thrown under a bus for months on end. I understand why the schools had to close but it’s almost unbearable on a daily basis for parents at the moment. Working every hour under the sun, attempting to keep up with home schooling, cook, clean, get some sunlight to help with MH. My standards have slipped but we still need to eat even if it’s just a sandwich for lunch and something for dinner.

Parents are seen as selfish for being anxious about living in mess, off ready meals, no time for exercise or health for weeks on end with no end point for the greater good. When did caring about your family become selfish. When did we have to think about every other person in the UK before ourselves.

I know it’s a pandemic and it’s shit for everyone. But I have to say day to day it’s got to be hardest for full time wfh parents with young children.

My three are in school as DH and I are paramedics. I see the impact of covid every day and it’s horrendous. But I also so friends who are shells of the people they once were and are weeks away from a complete breakdown. From losing jobs and their home. From their mental health deteriorating to the point that they can’t function. And that’s bloody terrifying too.

@newaroundhere2

And being sat in front of the TV isn't great for them but neither is trashing the economy so everyone suffers. We all have to do our bit.

A as y yuh oh have no kids, I can only assume you have no idea, so I'll ignore your advice thanks

@newaroundhere2

And being sat in front of the TV isn't great for them but neither is trashing the economy so everyone suffers. We all have to do our bit.

BTW it's lock down and school closures that ARE teaching the economy

@newaroundhere2

If less kids were in school, cases would drop quicker and restrictions could be eased sooner. In the long term that would be better for the children than this horrid current situation.

It won't be better for all those kids whose parents lose their jobs and can't pay their mortgage or buy food.

You are also on repeat. It is the same argument over and over of "but I simply can't!". People are dying at a ridiculous rate and if you had a car accident or heart attack tomorrow you may not get treated as the systems are overloaded. But you can't look after your kids because you're such busy important people. Yes, that seems reasonable.

@newaroundhere2

You are also on repeat. It is the same argument over and over of "but I simply can't!". People are dying at a ridiculous rate and if you had a car accident or heart attack tomorrow you may not get treated as the systems are overloaded. But you can't look after your kids because you're such busy important people. Yes, that seems reasonable.

Fantasist

Ok I'll give up working, are you going to pay my mortgage or shall I take the kids on the streets?

As with my DH being a keyworker his wage is shot so I have to work to keep a roof over

@newaroundhere2

And being sat in front of the TV isn't great for them but neither is trashing the economy so everyone suffers. We all have to do our bit.

You clearly have no idea. Even if I wanted to, I couldn't get my 6 year old to sit in front of the tv for hours.

I'm staggered at how many people are essentially advocating neglect. During last lockdown my DS had a nasty fall while we were working and now has a pretty nasty scar on his face. A constant reminder of why you can't leave young children to their own devices.
He was 5 at the time, an age according to many posters, where it's fine to leave him in front of the tv for hours.

Starting to get these vibes from this thread...
Monty Python Four Yorkshire Men

Posted lightheartedly but in all seriousness everyone has it hard to some extent. It is hard. But we do need to do something about the terrible public health crisis we are in. We should be lobbying the Government to make sure employers aren’t making people with children at home work 12 hour days. Call me naive if you wish, but if we make it a race to the bottom we all lose out.
As I’ve repeatedly said on this thread if we collapse the health system it will have a bigger impact on our children than this pandemic has to date.

Anyone keeping their kids in school who is not a keyworker or doesn't have a kid with additional needs has no recourse to complain when cases rise, more people die, and they cannot access healthcare themselves. We all need the healthcare system to keep working. It has to be top priority. One person paying their mortgage is not a top priority. That is the definition of selfish - we all need the NHS to be able to function, but your house is more important than that.

I'm with you, OhBabyBab.

Last lockdown I had all three of my children at home...2, 7 and 10.
I'm a keyworker who works full time and was required to be in the office 1/2 days a week. Not frontline but very much supporting those who are and I was required to be on hand constantly.
I worked longer hours and id say my workload doubled.
My husband (not a keyworker) earns more than me but had to negotiate with his boss to work 6-11 every day then make up time at weekends because it was just not possible to do our jobs and supervise a toddler, plus home school.
It nearly broke us. Last June I went onto steroids because of my ulcerative colitis and I have just been moved onto immuno suppressants because the condition has worsened significantly. Before that I'd been stable for 2.5 years.
This time my children are taking up their keyworker places. It would be even worse this time...my eldest now at high school, all children required to follow the curriculum...it's just not possible. We don't go out, don't see family, don't break the rules. But sending my kids to school is the hill I will die on, my line in the sand. If those places are removed I will go on long term sick leave rather than battle on this time and I'm absolutely confident others would do the same. There is more than just covid to consider. Personally I would never have closed schools at all, it creates as many issues as it solves, but I'm not in charge.

@newaroundhere2

You are also on repeat. It is the same argument over and over of "but I simply can't!". People are dying at a ridiculous rate and if you had a car accident or heart attack tomorrow you may not get treated as the systems are overloaded. But you can't look after your kids because you're such busy important people. Yes, that seems reasonable.

The things is, lots of us did try it last time and we know we can't do it again.

I ended up on medication for anxiety and DS seriously hurt himself. I'm not doing that again. I don't think I'm too important to look after my child but I do have a job to do and there are aspects of that job where doing it alongside childcare and homeschooling is impossible. Therefore I'm using the school place we are entitled to on the days I teach and we've arranged to work flexibly on the other days. That's the best we can do.

They are the ones extending school closures by trying to up group sizes. Two paramedics are not.

They are the ones who are also extending the pandemic and the lockdown. We need to minimise social interaction as much as possible and stop transmission of this virus.

This wave is looking like it is going to worse than the first one. The numbers of people in hospital are scary and it's younger age groups who are now in ICU. I'm working with patients who have long covid - yes, it is a thing, and the impact that is having on them for the rest of their lives.

We are all suffering in some way. The best way to end that suffering is to suck up the lockdown now, stay at home as much as possible, don't sent your kids to school unless you are really a key worker or they are vulnerable.

Personally I would never have closed schools at all, it creates as many issues as it solves, but I'm not in charge

Yes, leaving them open with the new strain affecting children, staff, families and communities and straining hospital services would be far better than parents having to parent their children safely at home

It's disgraceful.
It feels like the whole of MN has found a new stick to beat working parents ( mothers ) with. It's depressing and upsetting.

This.

newaroundhete2 You sound like a very, very young follower of Owen Jones, dipping their toe in the political waters by way of social media.

My top tip, for what I hope will become a journey, in the traversing of which you will accrete understanding and add depth and empathy, would be this:

Consensus-building is a vital component of results-focused political action.

This fact has been somewhat lost over the last few years, with the rise of populism and social media. It seems odd to say that populism is the antithesis of consensus - but I really do believe modern, social-media-driven populism is just that.

Anyway, you'll not get far with consensus by trying to split workers into the worthy and unworthy, with mothers somehow being characterised as largely unworthy.

You'll get further by taking seriously the material reality of oppressions, accepting that people are placed very differently within this pandemic, then drilling down to a point where there may be coherence, and a consensus formed.

Honestly, simply trying to dismiss 'mothers' is a woefully common pitfall - but pitfall it is.

I think schools including nurseries should only offer places for NHS/Care/Police/Fire staff for the next 2-3weeks. As this would stop many people with children from working it would become a very harsh lockdown for 2-3weeks and therefore disrupt the covid transmission. Yes work places will suffer including those that are critical however with the way numbers are increasing it calls for drastic action. This should be known as Total Lockdown,we then revert back to the current lockdown and as soon as possible (End Feb/Mar) move the country back down the tier system.

What happens if all of the teachers, doctors, nurses, food delivery drivers etc etc, just say they simply can’t carry on and take long sick leave or resign? You have no control over their decisions to do the same as you, especially when their decisions are based on a clear and present danger. I have no doubt this is what will happen soon.

You can make the argument that homeschooling is costing you your mental health, but there are many people losing that anyway as a result of lockdown. And you would not have to homeschool if we were not in lockdown anyway. So it is in everyones' best interests to end lockdown as quickly as possible by being more stringent about who we allow to attend school.

It would be interesting to know how many people would have still had children if they knew they would not be able to rely on schools for childcare.

@CKBJ

I think schools including nurseries should only offer places for NHS/Care/Police/Fire staff for the next 2-3weeks. As this would stop many people with children from working it would become a very harsh lockdown for 2-3weeks and therefore disrupt the covid transmission. Yes work places will suffer including those that are critical however with the way numbers are increasing it calls for drastic action. This should be known as Total Lockdown,we then revert back to the current lockdown and as soon as possible (End Feb/Mar) move the country back down the tier system.

It couldn't just be that selection of staff though could it??

For example pharmacists and pharmacy workers in every community pharmacy across the country?

Also, supermarket staff, of course.

And several other truly essential workers I can't be bothered to note.

School IS childcare at the end of the day!

It would be interesting to know how many people would have still had children if they knew they would not be able to rely on schools for childcare

You'd need to caveat that with 'during a pandemic' otherwise it's not a fair question.

@newaroundhere2

It would be interesting to know how many people would have still had children if they knew they would not be able to rely on schools for childcare.

This is not a permanent situation.

@Ohbabybab

Starting to get these vibes from this thread... Monty Python Four Yorkshire Men

Posted lightheartedly but in all seriousness everyone has it hard to some extent. It is hard. But we do need to do something about the terrible public health crisis we are in. We should be lobbying the Government to make sure employers aren’t making people with children at home work 12 hour days. Call me naive if you wish, but if we make it a race to the bottom we all lose out.
As I’ve repeatedly said on this thread if we collapse the health system it will have a bigger impact on our children than this pandemic has to date.

I agree.

Some countries have paid workers to stay home. I’ve not looked into it and I don’t know how feasible it is, but we can’t continue like this. Our numbers are looking like the US but they have hundred millions more citizens.

At what point are people going to realise this is a disaster? 5k dead a day? Will that make you keep your kids home?

@newaroundhere2

It would be interesting to know how many people would have still had children if they knew they would not be able to rely on schools for childcare.

You're right.

We currently have a society where for the vast majority of families you need two incomes to survive- not live the life of luxury, just survive. In order for that to be possible we need schools to be open. People plan their families and careers on the basis that children start school at a certain age. You can't remove that in an instant and expect society to be able to react at the same speed.

Unfortunately what we're seeing is women, in particular mothers, being disproportionately disadvantaged. We are losing all the progress we've made over the last few decades. I'm very concerned about this.

Of course Covid is a huge and serious issue but women are bearing the brunt of the restrictions being put in place and that makes me angry.

Obviously not in terms of this temporary pandemic. It is that horrific to care for your kids all day that you would not have them if you had to? It would give an idea of how bad the situation is.