What’s going to happen next? Cases rising?

[Racoonworld]

The Wales lockdown hasn’t worked and it looks like the England one has only had very short term effects. Schools and unis still open and a lot of the public just aren’t following the rules now, it’s cold and wet so meeting outdoors isn’t going to happen so people are going inside. MPs don’t want harsher restrictions in their areas. So what will happen? Is it time just to end most restrictions seeing as they aren’t being followed anyway? Or will they try and impose another lockdown? Close the schools?

@cantkeepawayforever yes it is and it was a dosing error (as things can be in tbh in trials). I need to read more about it, but it will be better than no vaccine even if only 60% effective.

Sorry just to add - I am sure the age range was varied and effective in the older group.

More lockdowns and things will get slowly better towards the spring as millions are vaccinated. Once those in care homes and the over 80s are vaccinated the death rate with plummet. It's all good news but it will be over months and not weeks.

but it will be better than no vaccine even if only 60% effective.

And it may save the lives of the remaining 40%. In the trial no one who got the Oxford vaccine got seriously ill.

@GoodKingWindowshopping

Yes probably both, meanwhile posters on these boards are promoting their anti vaxx agenda. We’re in for the long ride.

Promoting an Anti Vax agenda?

You mean be wary about a vaccine that no one knows the long term implications of?

"Close the schools, more lockdowns, more restrictions" - why bother when it isn't making a scrap of difference and is just ruining people's lives. Let adults decide what is best for them - let those who want to shield shield and make it as easy as possible for them and same with those that want to homeschool. For people who are being adversely affected mentally and financially let them live their lives.

@wizzbangfizz and take the consequences if no hospital bed available?
Genuinely interested in your view not being goady.

Covid and Brexit. The perfect storm.

Tbh I think those who are mixing indoors will have been doing all along and won't have stopped due to any lockdown or tier restrictions

[quote Pomegranatespompom]@wizzbangfizz and take the consequences if no hospital bed available?
Genuinely interested in your view not being goady.[/quote]
I agree with @wizzbangfizz.

Yes, take the consequences if no beds are free. If we did as wizzbang said and If I caught covid and there was no beds then it’s a choice I made.

I honestly think things should just go back to normal. People that need help shielding should get it but everyone else should just get on with it now.

Cases will rise until Christmas, then at least double from that high level after Christmas due to the ridiculousness of the 5 day 'mixing' period

I can't see the 5 day mixing period making a lot of difference when a bunch of arses have flooded the shops the day after lockdown - I mean huge crowds with no masks to be seen and no social distancing. And holding Christmas markets in tier 3 areas.

@3littlewords

Tbh I think those who are mixing indoors will have been doing all along and won't have stopped due to any lockdown or tier restrictions

That’s not true in a cases though. I know a lot of people who stuck religiously to the first lockdown but the second one were breaking little rules here and there and are occasionally seeing people inside now even though we are tier 2. Sensible, professional people who understand the rules and consequences but it’s all too much and for too long now. It will get worse if there’s another lockdown.

I'm fed up of the Yo-Yo approach. Australia had big spikes in various areas, went in really hard, drove down numbers to near zero, and now just have the odd case quickly identified and brought under control. Life back to normal. Current approach here is ridiculous. All the pain for shops and businesses over months and months, never mind huge number of deaths and Long term health effects, and every time it goes in the right direction they open up again. Bet there will be a third wave in January/February because of December easing, shopping crowds, family travel, household mixing. Predictable and avoidable. And desperately sad if you lose a loved one just before the vaccine got to them

@cantkeepawayforever

Just because the government says you can mix does not mean you have to .

I think those who are blatantly not just breaking the rules but totally ignoring them will do what they want anyway.

The sensible ones amongst us will continue to be extremely careful . After all that is what the government has advised .

Just because a speed limit is 50 mph on a country road , you don’t always drive just at that speed do you ?

I see sweden , who everyone held up as an example has higher cases per capita that Spain , france or the uk .

Nothing with this virus is as simple as people make out.

Yes my choice - maybe I will reverse my view if the Nightingales are full of otherwise fit and healthy 40/50 year olds. I'm not being goady at all and genuinely understand peoples fear but I just think when the "cure" (effects on economy, other diagnoses, mental health) has the potential to kill more people than the virus itself you have to question if these measures are worth the price we are paying.

@Pomegranatespompom

Gosh yes the crowds in Oxford St were awful. Would shutting schools a week early and going back a week late help or would it enable people to stick to the rules even less? We need to do something. We've been so lucky at our school with all classes in, not sure if we are few and far between.

Where do you get your ideas? Yes, of course the crowds are awful because no one could go in November.

Yes of course if you close schools early, the Tubes will be full of teens, and parents taking kids out anywhere for a change of scene and who can blame them.

If we’d had no lockdowns, this accumulation of concentrated busy periods wouldn’t have happened. It is not rocket science.

I hate shopping, I hate Oxford street, Covent Garden etc and nearly went myself this weekend because I’m so sick of my flat and I have forgotten what people look like.

@Pepperama

Population density should be a consideration here .

Those of you arguing to get back to normal don't forget it's not just the NHS we have to keep running.

It's farmers, food factories, electricians, the gas network. The infrastructure for the internet.

A lot of these industries live in fear of having a large percentage of a small number of staff off with Covid at once.

@wizzbangfizz

"Close the schools, more lockdowns, more restrictions" - why bother when it isn't making a scrap of difference and is just ruining people's lives. Let adults decide what is best for them - let those who want to shield shield and make it as easy as possible for them and same with those that want to homeschool. For people who are being adversely affected mentally and financially let them live their lives.

This.

I’m with Wizzbang. The first lockdown was justified by saying the NHS was going to be overwhelmed. That didn’t happen and this wave it hasn’t even come close to happening.

This is a disease the vast majority of people need a test to even find out they have. And we shut the country down for this. We closed schools, shat on education, closed small business while allowing the huge ones to continue to profit. We stopped the ill and vulnerable from spending time with their loved ones (in many cases stopped them spending their last months/moments with people they loved). We cancelled weddings, told people to attend funerals by zoom, stopped dads being present at their children’s births.

For an illness entirely indistinguishable from a heavy cold in the vast majority of people (and that’s people who even get symptoms).

They can’t stop lockdowns now because the press will keep publishing daily figures and people with too much time on their hands and too much anxiety in their heads will keep lapping it up. They have no choice but to continue with the rolling lockdowns. To hell with mental health, education, the economy, job security, personal happiness. To hell with it all.

So @Pepperama. Wants strict fast total lockdown

@AcornAutumn

Wants no lockdown at all .

Just about sums up the problem .

@Unsure33

So *@Pepperama*. Wants strict fast total lockdown

@AcornAutumn

Wants no lockdown at all .

Just about sums up the problem .

Yes this is a problem! And MPs all want different things too.

Well the hospitals in Bristol have come close to being overwhelmed in the second wave.

@Elfieishere it’s not just you who bears the consequence of no beds is it? It’s not just you or other Covid patients who were happy enough to catch it that might not get a bed though is it? It’s the heart attack patient, the patient who was in a terrible RTA or the stroke patient who doesn’t get a bed because they are full of COVID patients

@Elfieishere It's quite difficult to manage the balance, if there was no bed for someone who stuck carefully to restrictions, that's unfair but really there is so much unfairness at the mo, beds wouldn't be restricted on that basis anyway, we want to help everyone I have no idea what the right thing to do is.