NHS staff now come after care homes for vaccine

[UnlimitedUnspecific]

The government have just changed their plans - now care homes will get the vaccine before the NHS, which in reality means instead of the NHS at this point since there are only 800,000 vaccines and 1.2 million people in care homes.

I am furious. The PPE provided to doctors and nurses doesn't properly protect them from the HUGE viral load of a patient ill enough to be hospitalised. Only yesterday the government admitted that the rate of Covid-19 infections caught INSIDE hospitals was far too high, and yet doctors and nurses will have to wait, what I expect will be weeks or months for a vaccination. In the meantime, their health and lives and those of their families, and those of other patients in hospital, other staff in hospital, people whose work takes them into hospital or transport workers serving hospitals - all at high risk.

(posted this on another thread already, but it will be lost in the comments)

Care homes can be shielded, NHS staff have a plastic pinny and a paper mask.

And now we can look forward to a winter with hundreds of thousands of NHS workers having to self-isolate, either due to contact with positive care or due to being ill, and thousands more Covid-19 cases still being caught inside hospitals.
So the NHS will continue to be understaffed, patients will get ill while receiving medical treatment, many patients will still feel hospitals are not safe enough to visit and won't see the treatment they need.

Obviously, the original priority list had care homes first. But I thought in recent days, there had been an implicit understanding that the country needs NHS workers vaccinated first, both logistically and for the good of the NHS.

I understand the plight of the elderly stuck in care homes without access to family visits and the tragedy that unfolds if Covid-19 gets into a care home. It is not that I think NHS workers are worth more.

It doesn't make sense to me, surely it would be top priority to vaccinate front-line workers, and care home workers. Care home residents can be shielded.

I completely disagree with you. Firstly, care home residents are suffering more than anyone, through not being able to see family. We know this leads to a decline in their physical and mental health. They need to be given the vaccine in order to facilitate visitation. They are also incredibly vulnerable to serious illness with the virus.

We have been at this since March, we can wait another few weeks. We are still lucky that we will be offered it very soon. I agree the PPE is inadequate, I recently caught covid in work myself so I do understand. But as a group, care home residents are the most at risk from this virus so they must be prioritised. It is the right thing to do.

For many NHS workers and their family, this was a light at the end of the tunnel.
I understand elderly in care homes and their families are thinking the same.
There is not enough vaccine to go around. We only have 800,000 doses now, not the millions we were promised in the jingoistic misinformed Brexit-triumphing speeches by the government yesterday.

I heard this morning that they want GPs to go into the Care Homes to administer the vaccine so surely they will need to be vaccinated themselves at least?

The government hasn't changed its plans - care homes have been in first priority position since JCVI published the division list back in September. The only changes between then and the list now is moving the CEV up from 6th priority to 4th (with 70yos, rather than after all 65yos) and dropping the minimum age from 18 (for CV) to 16 (priority 6)

Logistics might mean that they start priorities 1 and 2 together (care home residents/staff who can attend a hub, or who can be safely reached within the safe vaccine handling procedures, plus any over 80s (also priority 2) who are visiting an administering hospital for any appointment can be done whilst they are there)

No one decided NHS staff were higher priority, the only reason why the order changed was because of the logistical difficulties in transporting this vaccine to the residents.Much easier to bring the batch into a mass vaccination site and bring the people to the vaccine.

@Sparklingbrook

I heard this morning that they want GPs to go into the Care Homes to administer the vaccine so surely they will need to be vaccinated themselves at least?

Yes, our trust have said vaccinators will get it first

@UnlimitedUnspecific

For many NHS workers and their family, this was a light at the end of the tunnel. I understand elderly in care homes and their families are thinking the same. There is not enough vaccine to go around. We only have 800,000 doses now, not the millions we were promised in the jingoistic misinformed Brexit-triumphing speeches by the government yesterday.

Its still the light at the end of the tunnel. More is coming very soon. We have to be patient.

High numbers of Covid-19 caught in hospital:
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/11/03/shocking-nearly-half-covid-patients-hospitals-likely-have-caught/

That is ridiculous. NHS workers should be first. This isn't fair.

It isn't just the elderly in care homes it is also the carers. It was a nightmare earlier this year with far too many elderly people dying, staff off sick and agency staff needed which spread it more.

There was a priority list for a reason. Care home staff and residents upset at again not being put first, then a u turn so NHS staff upset. It bodes well for the whole process.

Our health board is doing nhs staff first. Some colleagues are booked for next week and I am hoping to get it the week after (frontline staff working on covid ward).

Our health board is doing nhs staff first. Some colleagues are booked for next week and I am hoping to get it the week after (frontline staff working on covid ward). Is that changing with the new announcements? DIL is doctor on covid ward, she was due to get it next week but not sure now.

Those in care homes are lost at risk of needing hospitalisation and of dying. Right they should go first. Hopefully NHS frontline workers not far behind.

I'm not liking this whose more important than who rhetoric I'm seeing here.

I'm not liking this whose more important than who rhetoric I'm seeing here. Exactly, a priority list was worked out by experts, they should stick to it.

Only our govt could turn such good news into an argument with everyone upset.

Honestly OP, I think we all have to be patient now.
2 months ago we didn't even know a vaccine would work. Now we have 2 to 3 being rolled out in the next 2 months.
I am so pleased that they will be given the vaccine asap.
I am grateful for the sacrifices our NHS staff have made, but am sure many will be vaccinated concurrently, as some may be involved in vaccinating and the government may decide to vaccinate staffs in ICU and Covid wards as a priority.

But as a group, care home residents are the most at risk from this virus so they must be prioritised. It is the right thing to do.
I agree.

It's a shit situation all round. I wouldn't like to be the one making the decisions on who gets it first, second, third etc. Either way someone will be pissed off. People just need to be patient.

@sproutsandparsnips

Our health board is doing nhs staff first. Some colleagues are booked for next week and I am hoping to get it the week after (frontline staff working on covid ward).

If you are in the UK, that is what everyone was told yesterday. The government issued a list of 53 hospitals that will receive deliveries of the vaccine.

But if the deliveries do not get sent because at some point in the future they will be given to care homes instead, then hospitals will not be giving them to staff next week as planned.

Another problem with the logistics of sending vaccinated GPs into care homes to vaccinate the elderly is that it will take weeks for the GPs to be protected by the vaccine - there are 2 doses.
So it will be weeks before anyone gets the vaccines sitting in storage.
Plus how many GPs is it going to take to vaccinated 1.2 million care home residents when presumably these GPs have other work they should be doing at their surgeries?

Hospitals are staffed by thousands of healthcare workers who can rapidly vaccinate a whole hospital, which is another reason the best use of the 800,000 vaccines is within hospitals.

Everyone needs the vaccine but it's important to remember the situation in care homes that is different from most NHS workers. The main difference is that with covid many are spending the last year of their lives alone, lonely and with no in person contact with their family.

Agree we have to be patient.

I’m in uni and will be on the wards from January but I am unsure where I will fall for a vaccine as il be working for the nhs but technically not an employee; as a student. But I will be ‘frontline’. So who knows.

My partner works as on the frontline and is really battling against depression now. He’s really struggling.

And just FYI, I’m sorry to say this as I’m sure you’re aware it’s just a HUGE bugbear of mine - the NHS frontline staff isn’t just doctors and nurses.

@ancientgran

I'm not liking this whose more important than who rhetoric I'm seeing here. Exactly, a priority list was worked out by experts, they should stick to it.

Only our govt could turn such good news into an argument with everyone upset.

Exactly! How could a carefully worked out plan published yesterday be so completely changed one day later! Total imbeciles.

Now the vaccines will be sitting in storage for weeks while a small band of GPs are given their 2 doses of the vaccine and then gradually work their way through the care homes scattered widely.

Yesterday, there were 53 hospitals listed to receive the vaccines, staffed by hundreds of thousands of qualified staff who could have vaccinated the entire NHS with the first dose within days and then the second dose as soon as the dosing schedule requires.

How on earth can you shield care homes? They have huge numbers of staff working shifts in close contact with the residents - most of them with families and some with other jobs. I don’t think anywhere in the world has managed to protect them effectively.

My partner works as on the frontline and is really battling against depression now. He’s really struggling

yes, in a similar position. There really is very little recognition from the government or the public of the pressure of caring for 100's of people with a highly contagious disease all at once, with the very real chance of catching the illness and taking it home to your family.
I know ICU nurses with PTSD (other NHS staff may also be affected). Very few people recognise this or care.

The announcement should never have been made yesterday that NHS would be first. How cruel to give something then take it away when it means so much to so many.