So the vaccine is going to be compulsory then?

[Gigheimer]

There was a thread ages ago about the fact people were being tin foil hat about a vaccine being compulsory.

Latest news out they are considering “vaccine passports”, which lets face it, on our news cycle throughout this entire thing it’s been ... prepare them gently with maybes, odd leak here or there, test the messaging, oh look the guesses were right

So no one is going to pin anyone down and spear them, but it’s basically the same thing. If you can’t enter a shop/leisure/work place domestically without a vaccine. It’s fucking compulsory.

Where did free will go? Where did vaccine uptake because we have trust go? I’m not anti-vaccine, had them all, even TB. But this isn’t on I terms of civil liberties. Does no one else feel concern at a general use of this crisis into nanny state?

[LangClegsInSpace]

@Coyoacan

I find it odd all this emphasis on everyone having the vaccine, when there are something like nine billion people in the world. I think we'll be lucky if the people who really need it can be vaccinated within the next six months.

I worry that first world countries are planning to buy up all the vaccines so that they can vaccinate lots of people who are minimally at risk and leave the vulnerable in the third world without a vaccine.

Yes, I agree.

[lunar1]

Like every vaccine, the more people who have it the more protection it provides for people who medically can't have it. They clearly have to be given a medical exemption.

[ShrikeAttack]

There's a massive difference between 'mandatory anti-vaxxer conspiracist' and;

'You cannot participate in life if you don't'

I'm pretty sure it's against international law to be forced to take medication. I'd be very interested in a case-law regarding an individual and their right to participate in life without a C19 vaccine.

I'm mot a conspiracist at all, I do fight back against ownership 'creep' all the time. I fought against abortion rights as a young woman, and I've unregistered myself as a donor, just because presumed consent became law.

I think it's very important to recognise ourselves as individuals. It's always informed my politics. People matter. Individuals matter. You matter.

[ShrikeAttack]

Sorry, I fought FOR abortion rights!

[Gigheimer]

Unsure the point of debate is to discuss and debate and challenge before things happen that are indicated, proposed or likely. Not after the fact when we are all going WTF how did that happen?

Well it happened because no one questioned.

I think my questioning is driven in the same way, it just is that we used to have law making and policing by consent. Decisions were made by the mass. I’m ok with that. I don’t agree with all laws but I abide by them because it’s a societal contract.

Now the state decides what freedoms and liberties are good for us, and decide fast. No discussion, it’s a tiny swing towards fascism, but a worrying one.

[GeorgiaGirl52]

In the U.S. we frequently see signs posted:
No shirts, No shoes, No service. (This is a health department regulation anywhere food is served or sold, even office buildings with vending machines.) I guess you could say it is compulsory to wear shoes and shirts. You have the right not to wear clothes at home but not out in public. The government has many regulations for health and safety. Dogs have to have rabies shots. I believe more in the dangers of covid than in the "mind control of the mythical chip." As soon as I can, I will take it and so will my child.
My adult daughters work in health care and they are both required to have flu shots every year. I expect they will be required to have the covid vaccine too. Better that than getting it again or passing it on to a vulnerable person.

[Gigheimer]

Or what Shrike said far better than me!

[ShrikeAttack]

There's no conspiracy, it's just ineffectual governance that cedes power.

I've always been a naysayer though.

If someone tells me to do something, I'll do the opposite.

[pinbinpin]

What id you are say 48 and not offered the vaccine as they do only roll it out down to 50..Do you then just have to show id and prove your age to enter a place that wants proof you've been vaccinated?

[user1481840227]

As said by someone above, the staff in shops, pubs and public transport deserve to have the same "free choice" to be safe in their workplace and not risk catching covid because of people who refuse the vaccine. This is another case of "whose rights trump other peoples' rights".

Does that not mean that the same will apply for other vaccines?

The chances of catching covid are going to be pretty slim when a large percentage of the population has been vaccinated...it might still circulate occasionally on a small scale but the actual pandemic will be over.

The same staff members might not want to catch measles or the flu and so on!

[Notsandwiches]

@AngelicaSchuylerAndHerSisters

The only way diseases can be eradicated is by mass vaccinations. My friend’s teenage son caught mumps a few years ago despite having the MMR. His GP told them that there are more cases now because not everyone vaccinates their children. Luckily he was okay.
COVID is not like Chicken Pox which is low risk so therefore not vaccinated against. This awful infection kills people.

Well that wasn't a very successful vaccination then was it?

[ShrikeAttack]

Eh? He had a vaccine but still caught the disease he was vaccinated against?

[AuntyPonsonby]

Thanks for the thread OP. I agree with you. And I find some of the replies on here rather alarming.

[Nousernameforme]

So what alternative are you proposing op? Everyone else get it and you just be allowed to go on your merry way counting on the immunity of others? Or should nobody take it and we have sporadic lockdowns for years? Or do you have another idea?

[bluebellscorner]

[quote Unsure33]@Gigheimer

Thalidomide was Not a vaccine[/quote]
This was not thalidomide, it was the swine flu vaccine. The same happened in other European countries.

FYI I am fully vaccinated and not an anti vaxxer by any means

[AuntyPonsonby]

Hi @Nousernameforme, people who want immunity get it.

[ShrikeAttack]

I think OP is suggesting that the world may have gone slightly bonkers.

And we really should have volition.

[user1481840227]

The only way diseases can be eradicated is by mass vaccinations. My friend’s teenage son caught mumps a few years ago despite having the MMR. His GP told them that there are more cases now because not everyone vaccinates their children. Luckily he was okay.
COVID is not like Chicken Pox which is low risk so therefore not vaccinated against. This awful infection kills people.

Wasn't there whistleblowers over the MMR vaccine from Merck? that they had falsified the data related to the efficacy and that it wasn't actually effective enough to provide herd immunity?
The last I heard of it was a few years ago when it was still being dragged out in court!

[bluebellscorner]

@ShrikeAttack

Eh? He had a vaccine but still caught the disease he was vaccinated against?

It happens, vaccines do not confer 100% immunity. As an example the chicken pox vaccine gives around 90% immunity

[newstart1337]

My right to go to work, travel & participate in leisure activities safely is greater than the right of an anti-vaxxer to carry around a deadly virus in public and kill people. We do not live in America.

So when the time comes I will support a vaccine passport and a ban on anti-vaxxers. You have the right to refuse a vaccine but you should never have the right to inflict your virus on me.

[480Widdio]

I couldn’t care less whether it is compulsory or not,I want it as soon as possible.What others choose to do is none of my business.

[user1481840227]

@newstart1337

My right to go to work, travel & participate in leisure activities safely is greater than the right of an anti-vaxxer to carry around a deadly virus in public and kill people. We do not live in America.

So when the time comes I will support a vaccine passport and a ban on anti-vaxxers. You have the right to refuse a vaccine but you should never have the right to inflict your virus on me.

There's a difference between being an anti-vaxxer and being cautious about rushed vaccines.

The swine flu jab was very rushed and peoples lives have been ruined by it!

[FoolsAssassin]

@Headspinner2020

I wouldn't class myself as a conspiracist and I'm not an anti- Vaxer, but - I'm definitely feeling something isn't right here.

I was recently at a London A&E. Literally empty. I asked the nurse how busy they were in the Hospitals with Covid patients. She said there are currently only 9!!

Something is fishy here.

It’s going to vary isn’t it and that is good news that they have 9. My friend works at a hospital that isn’t big and they currently have 33 Covid patients . It was 19 not long ago so this rate it will be doubled in 2 weeks. Hopefully numbers will go down soon as the effect of lockdown filters through but if they didn’t and the number of Covid admissions continued the trend they are currently on then less than 3 more cycles of the numbers doubling would take them in excess of the number of beds in the hospital.

The bigger hospitals nearby are pushed, I don’t know the figures for them but it means there isn’t an overspill available.

Don’t make the mistake of assuming your experience at one place is a reflection of what is happening everywhere.

[ShrikeAttack]

Goodness @newstart1337, please vaccinate away.

Do you understand the difference between anti-vax and COMPULSORY vaccination?

It's Dunning-Kruger writ large.

[Didkdt]

Do you have kids, are they vaccinated as per a national schedule
This isn't any different
Some of those most vulnerable to Covid can't actually be vaccinated with the pffizer vaccine you know that right are they to be prevented from mixing publicly because you don’t want a vaccine. The answer is sometimes yes, but for opt in things then why should they? You opt in to a meal out, you opt in to a sports fixture or music gig so you opt in to whether you have a vaccine to enable that.
The compulsory shit maybe not so much. We can use grocery slots and online schools for our children
The reality is nothing like this has been defeated by herd immunity it's either vaccines or people surviving and others dying out.