To be weary of the vaccines?

[PunkyPirate]

Will you be getting it?

Will you be allowing your children to get it?

I'm curious to peoples responses as my social media seems to be full of posts from people mocking those who will get the vaccine.

I'm by no means an anti Vaxer. Myself and my children have had all vaccinations and have the flu jab yearly. My only worry is that not enough is known about the long term side effects.

He like to claim that Jumbo, but that was only because there was no excuse for what he did. He is extremely litigious but never was successful at suing anyone.Even at the gmc he offered no defence. The transcripts are available online and make fascinating reading

I will be getting the vaccine, I can’t wait.

Also in my experience medical professionals are terrified to even vaguely criticize vaccines publicly. Careers get ruined very quickly.

What is your experience exactly because you’re spouting absolute tripe here.

I’m a healthcare scientist and one that works on the flu and asymptomatic testing programme for several Trusts in my area in addition to my day job. There is no reason why many of the doctors and nurses are turning down the flu vaccination this year (as opposed to very high uptake every other year). We can only put it down to an ever changing working environment and people having so much on their plates that a flu vaccination is way down on the priority list. And that’s being generous. Some of them are selfish and just don’t give a shit.

@musicalfrog

then restrictions are placed on those who refuse for no good reason. Nobody should be holding us back unless there is a very good reason (and your 'hunch' isn't a good enough reason)

Why do you want restrictions to be placed on people should have body autonomy and who have the right to be cautious about these new vaccines?

If you had a reaction to a new vaccine (short or long term) it's likely that you are going to be held back as well you know.

Gosh @TheRealJeanLouise that sounded a bit rude. Did you mean to be so rude? ^^^

My experience (exactly!) is none of your beeswax. And no Jean, some doctors and nurses aren't refusing the Covid 19 vax because "some of them are selfish and just don’t give a shit". They're just cautious clever people who can make their own decisions. Some doctors and nurses will have the vax. Some won't. That's how it works in a democracy. Have you read 1984? It's by a bloke called George Orwell. You might like it.

Did you mean to be so rude?

Yep

My experience (exactly!) is none of your beeswax.

And yep, this doesn’t bother me either. Because your what is clearly armchair ignorance experience means nothing against my every day lived experience and the experience of many, many other professionals.

I am a doctor btw. But just keep talking for ALL of us why don’t you.

Sometimes people have different points of view Jean. That's ok. I'm not talking for anyone but myself. I get to decide what I put it into my body and when. You get to the do the same. And so do patients. It's called consent. Quite important in medicine.

I suggest you go back to medical school - Ethics 101

Not Room 101 that's different - little Orwell joke for you

Different points of view aren’t facts. You’re presenting your point of view as fact and you should never confuse the two. Because a) it’s dangerous misinformation. B) you make yourself look stupid.

@Jumbogirl

Sometimes people have different points of view Jean. That's ok. I'm not talking for anyone but myself. I get to decide what I put it into my body and when. You get to the do the same. And so do patients. It's called consent. Quite important in medicine.

I suggest you go back to medical school - Ethics 101

Not Room 101 that's different - little Orwell joke for you

You’re entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts.

By all means decline the vaccine - your body, your choice - but please keep your evidence-free propaganda to yourself.

Andrew Wakefield put his “trial” subjects in harm’s way and deserves vilification for that alone, aside from the damage he did to the safety of countless children by persuading their parents not to vaccinate them.

[quote trulydelicious]@musicalfrog

then restrictions are placed on those who refuse for no good reason. Nobody should be holding us back unless there is a very good reason (and your 'hunch' isn't a good enough reason)

Why do you want restrictions to be placed on people should have body autonomy and who have the right to be cautious about these new vaccines?

If you had a reaction to a new vaccine (short or long term) it's likely that you are going to be held back as well you know.[/quote]
I think the answer is obvious tbh. Sorry that you think i need to explain it.

Sorry this is an open forum and I will have my say. And I stand by what I say about medical professionals being terrified to even vaguely criticize any vaccine publicly and their careers being ruined very quickly.

The name calling and insulting on here from the vaxxer fanatics (and they are fanatical no mistake) just prove how difficult it is to have proper debate about vaccines - and I am pro-vaccination! It is crazy.

And Jean admits her/himself there is only one acceptable viewpoint on every vaccine. That view is "All vaccines are safe always." Every other viewpoint is "stupid" - you might call it the HERD mindset - sorry couldn't resist - but I choose to use my brain and I support those who want to do the same and like to look at the data analytically.

You choose your right to use your brain and look at the data analytically. I'm ok with that. It's a tough tough time. Peace and love and - not sarcastic. It's hard at the moment for most people.

We’re starting to vaccinate on my trust hopefully 14th. Not heard once person say they won’t have it - all very keen.

Morning lovely MNetters, I wanted to add another concern of mine in the words of the Manic Street Preachers, "If you tolerate this then your children will be next."

So NO to mandatory vaccinations and NO to government repression.

And NO to news blackouts. I know journalists watch these pages. Well done to the Daily Mail for some good reporting. The Guardian you should be ashamed of yourself for your total news blackout on the protests in London and Denmark and France.

What we are seeing is an unprecedented co-ordination of repression against freedom of speech around the world.

YES to freedom of speech. YES to peace and love.

I believe the next protests in London are going to be hijacked by violent government "protesters" who want to stop freedom of speech and civil liberties. It's going to be tough on the streets at the next protests.

Some people would like to see Britain turning into East Germany.

But love will conquer all. I think George Orwell said that too - or something along those lines.

Why do you want restrictions to be placed on people should have body autonomy and who have the right to be cautious about these new vaccines?

Because other people also have body autonomy and the right to be cautious about getting exposed to diseases. And some business owners may choose to cater to people from this group.

Personally, while happy to get most vaccines, I happen to be reluctant to get the yellow fever vaccine; and I accept that this means that I can't go to countries that require it. I don't go around saying that this makes me a victim of some evil tyranny.

If you had a reaction to a new vaccine (short or long term) it's likely that you are going to be held back as well you know.

If I get long Covid, I will certainly be held back, and that is far more likely!

We are COVID free

Why should we let in unvaccinated people to the detriment of our elderly population or children who can’t be vaccinated?

Why dose your right to a holiday trump residence?

Do you know what I’m weary of?

I’m weary of all the emotive language and insults directed at people with an opposing view.

Discussion is actually becoming worse than Brexit was.

If you want the vaccine and will be able to have it then do it (if you are eligible)... if you don’t want it then don’t.

Might be wrong here but 1984 is a piece of fiction.

Some people really do struggle to differentiate between fiction and reality. Obvious from this thread.

So, jumbogirl et al, do you believe that Typhoid Mary had the right to freedom to work for a living and not be imprisoned? She, in spite of being a carrier of typhoid, continued to work as a cook and she infected households. She was identified and imprisoned. She was fine - but was an asymptomatic carrier.

In a society you are not a completely free individual. If you want to participate in that society you have to abide by certain rules and fulfil obligations. Otherwise no one would pay tax, would drive on the wrong side of the road at 90mph and - in one example I saw - have kept their lights blazing during the Blitz so they could see better.

How does “love conquer all” if someone is insisting on boarding a plane or visiting a theme park when they could be spreading a disease?

Might be wrong here but 1984 is a piece of fiction.
Really? Not a handbook to government?

Somebody tell Boris, quick! It's a shame Tony Blair never got the memo, with his nanny state, army of spin doctors, and "lies is truth" creed.

The swine flu vaccine was pushed through quickly in the same way and there are people who had their lives and futures ruined when they developed narcolepsy. 1 in 52,000 was the statistic I read.

That didn’t show up in the clinical trials as the trials were not big enough. So, I would rather not be in what is effectively the first mass scale trial for another vaccine that has been pushed through, where the U.K. government have already indemnified the manufacturer against claims if people are harmed (as they also did with the swine flu vaccine)

The swine flu vaccine was pushed through quickly in the same way and there are people who had their lives and futures ruined when they developed narcolepsy. 1 in 52,000 was the statistic I read.
And people who caught H1N1 naturally also developed narcolepsy in countries like China and Taiwan.

@bruffin

How is your comment relevant?

www.sciencemag.org/news/2015/07/why-pandemic-flu-shot-caused-narcolepsy

For narcolepsy it appears that:

.the wild virus can trigger narcolepsy
. Pandemrix vaccine appears to have triggered narcolepsy
.Focetria (Novartis) and Arepanrix (GSK) also swine flu vaccines did not trigger narcolepsy

Of course its relevent . People who caught swine flu in that season who did not get the vaccine also developed narcolepsy. There are a lot of theories behind including double hit of the natural infection before the vaccine