Should we submit to the lockdown or fight back?

[pontypridd]

Just this.

I feel scared writing it. I know I'll be flamed.

But how long can people live like this for? I've lost so many family over the years - my mum too when I was young. We all get sick and die.

We can't lock up the whole world because of Covid. Are we just all going to submit? Or do we, should we fight for our freedom?

There are some real idiots on this thread. It's not about crying because we can't go to the fucking pub, it's about the fact that we're out of work for who knows how long this time.

All the 10pm curfew has achieved where I am is everyone piling out the pub at the same time with the resultant crowds wandering aimlessly down the road with the alcohol they bought earlier at the corner shop. Not sure how that is better than a gradual exodus which is what normally happens.

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince

Redtoothbrush.

Live your clear analytical way of breaking things down. You say what my poor little brain is thinking, but so much clearer and more effectively!

I just want to second this ^^

@RedToothBrush
Once again you are the voice of articulate reason. Thankyou...it gives me hope. Mumsnet feels a bit like being battered around in a pinball machine at the moment.

I'm going to have a break from Mumsnet, not in a flouncy way, but I'm starting remote learning with ds (medically vulnerable - worked out with school and dr) tomorrow and need to keep a clear head, not get swallowed up in arguments and stay positive.

I genuinely hope everyone wherever they stand and however they feel, stays well and that whatever the next few stormy weeks and months throw at us, that your boats stay intact. Take care lovely people.

@BigB008ies

I'm gonna fight back by putting pencils up my nose, pants on my head and run around shouting, wibble.

A very cunning plan.

Breaking into a pub to pull yourself a pint?

Like 'Dianne and Co'

There are some real idiots on this thread. It's not about crying because we can't go to the fucking pub, it's about the fact that we're out of work for who knows how long this time.

So surely people should then be ‘fighting’ for better furlough schemes. To increase the amount of universal credit people get per week (which people have been asking for way before Covid existed) and to have more rights in the workplace.
Not fighting against the rules of wearing masks or not going to the pub.

I don't agree with this lockdown but then I'm basing this on my own experiences with it.

DH, I and 2 DC all had it. I was quite sick but not enough for hospital.
Aunty, uncle, their son and DIL, 2 GC and other set of GP's all had it. Aunt is 70, smoker and asthmatic. She was on oxygen and survived.
Friend had it, got better.
Other friend, DH and 4 DC had it. She had long COVID. She is very, very overweight.
GP, was in end of life care, caught COVID in hospital and died. It's 3rd on her death cert.
Other elderly relative, amputee, has dementia, caught in care home, is 80, went to hospital and is over it.

So, whilst I appreciate it does kill a very small % if young, fit people, all the people I know who have had it have got better with the exception of 1 who had 3-6 months to live. COVID put extra pressure on their failing heart, it wasn't the COVID that ended it.

Do I think another lockdown is a good idea? No I don't. Based on my own experiences I'd rather get it than screw up my kids futures and lose our jobs, homes and quality of life.

@Flutter12 absolutely.
I think people are being disingenuous here... they are angry at the restrictions placed on them and want to be able to go back to normal. They are trying to dress that up as something reasonable. Its not really reasonable... its understandable... but its not reasonable.

No wonder the uk is a shit show. You guys are more concerned with saying up yours to your government than dealing with the pandemic you're in. Your hospital system is under pressure.

All I've read on here for months is whinging about restrictions and how you won't put up with it any longer. Well now you're fucked, you have to deal with it and stop being such a bunch of bloody whingers. Lots of other countries are dealing with lockdowns and preventing mass deaths - news flash, you aren't special.

'It's not about crying because we can't go to the fucking pub, it's about the fact that we're out of work for who knows how long this time.'

Furlough has been extended. But many people are indeed 'crying because they can't go to the fucking pub'.

I'd rather know the nhs has capacity to treat anyone with ot without covid tbh.

@WokesFromHome
Okay now how much work did all those patients create for the NHS? Now imagine there's loads more of those patients in hospital.. that are probably going to survive but will need oxygen and monitoring.
This will effect EVERYONES standard of medical care for EVERYTHING not just covid.
We have to make sure our facilities aren't overwhelmed with people who need a great deal of medical input. Its not just about taking your chances. By taking your chances it decreases other peoples chances

I knew you wouldn’t get much support here in the bizarre bubble that is Mumsnet but outside of here.. the average person wholeheartedly agrees with you OP. What an utter farce and hysterical nonsense. At least in my local area and wide network of family, friends and colleagues up and down the country anyway.

'knew you wouldn’t get much support here in the bizarre bubble that is Mumsnet but outside of here.. the average person wholeheartedly agrees with you OP. What an utter farce and hysterical nonsense. At least in my local area and wide network of family, friends and colleagues up and down the country anyway.'

Must depend on the intelligence level of your 'network' perhaps? I don't know anyone up and down the country who sees the crisis accelerating and doesn't agree tighter restrictions are needed.

Taiwan is one of the most densely populated countries on earth and look at them.

There's very little tolerance for Covidiots in the countries who are doing well

Whining bullshit is not indulged as much as it is here and in the USA.

Even in Murdoch's Australia, it's unacceptable for people to say they'd rather let thousands of their own people die and let their country's economy, health and education systems collapse than have a Lockdown.

It would be like insisting on having all your lights on during The Blitz.

Entirely agree with @Tier2Minus

And even in certain European countries - eg Greece, Madeira (that have done very well) / you would no more not wear a mask / not sanitize your hands on going into a shop then you would take a dump in the street!

So, whilst I appreciate it does kill a very small % if young, fit people, all the people I know who have had it have got better with the exception of 1 who had 3-6 months to live. COVID put extra pressure on their failing heart, it wasn't the COVID that ended it.

I had it before the first lockdown and I was quite poorly but didn’t need hospital treatment at the time. And although I follow the rules I’ve never been one to worry too much about this virus or any others.

I now have an irregular heartbeat which is not life threatening and there is no proof that it is linked with Covid yet but it is still a bit worrying.
And I previously had only known over 70s to have died but in the past 4 weeks there have been 2 that have died, one was 29 and one was 33, one had no underlying health issues and the other had diabetes. I am within this age range so it has made me realise how serious it can be for some people and I am being a bit more cautious.

@Flutter12 I also work in a primary school, and I'm so glad I'm on maternity leave.

For the record I actually do comply to the rules, but it doesn't mean I agree or 'ignore'.

The 10pm curfew isn't actually an issue for me as 1. I've got a young baby and 2. I don't drink or socialise in bars/clubs. In fact I don't drink alcohol at all. Just think it's ridiculous for everyone to bundle out on to the street all at the same time.

When I was in hospital after giving birth one of the rules was that DH had to go out the ward on to the main corridor and use the public toilet when I had an en-suite in my room. So he was venturing out using a toilet that every could use and potentially bring back whatever to me and our newborn. Absolutely brilliant logic.

I'm not here to get anyone's heckles up, just very fed up. I had a very difficult pregnancy after suffering a previous stillborn and my mental suffered even more because many of my antenatal appointments were cancelled due to covid. Then obviously not being able to have any support with a newborn or grandparents not having any relationship with my son.

And anyone who is living on the bare minimum that is minimum wage then has this cut to 80% my god I feel for you, it is such a worry.

[quote HazeyJaneII]@RedToothBrush
Once again you are the voice of articulate reason. Thankyou...it gives me hope. Mumsnet feels a bit like being battered around in a pinball machine at the moment.

I'm going to have a break from Mumsnet, not in a flouncy way, but I'm starting remote learning with ds (medically vulnerable - worked out with school and dr) tomorrow and need to keep a clear head, not get swallowed up in arguments and stay positive.

I genuinely hope everyone wherever they stand and however they feel, stays well and that whatever the next few stormy weeks and months throw at us, that your boats stay intact. Take care lovely people.[/quote]
I've had a MN meltdown in the last couple of weeks. I have taken time out.

I recommend it. Lots of people at a similar point I think.

I'm sure that the virus will take appropriate notice of all this fighting back and just you know, fuck off or something.
Because it's a virus that's in charge here, not Boris, not the curtain twitcher across the road or the trend setting rule breaker.
The virus has no intent, no will, no thought process. It doesn't choose who to infect, it doesn't choose who to make seriously ill and who to leave alone.
If you are present and it is present then you risk being infected, and in turn infecting others.
I do believe that we can't stop it, that everyone will get it eventually, however personally I'd rather get it when there's enough people and equipment available to treat me to make a recovery than not.
The NHS has been underfunded for years, has struggled through winters with flu already, we don't have a crystal ball but anyone with an ounce of intelligence can see that situation coupled with another virus that has no immunity or vaccine is highly likely to lead to a crisis pretty fast.
I'm angry about that, I wish it hadn't come to that, but we've got to work with what we've got because no amount of fighting back is going to suddenly make the virus stop, or the NHS suddenly able to cope.
I'm angry that us as a collective are paying the price for the poor state the NHS is in and are being rallied to do our bit by government, all governments imo have systematically underfunded the NHS for years, so they're all guilty and us as citizens are paying a price for that.
Doesn't change the situation though, no amount of fighting back will.

@MrsMarrio

I completely agree and in my own school some of the rules are ridiculous and don’t make sense and have massively increased workload but I just have to keep reminding myself that I can’t get annoyed at the head as its not her fault and is trying her best to make everyone feel safer.

I feel sorry for people who have just had babies or are terminally ill.
My friends baby was poorly and the doctor wouldn’t see him and was told to wait and see how he gets on but my friend ended up taking him to a&e and it turned out he had a serious infection.

So I completely get why people hate this situation and everyone whether they are pro or anti lockdown all feel the same that they wish things would just go back to normal.

@alliwanttodoiseatcarbs

No wonder the uk is a shit show. You guys are more concerned with saying up yours to your government than dealing with the pandemic you're in. Your hospital system is under pressure.

All I've read on here for months is whinging about restrictions and how you won't put up with it any longer. Well now you're fucked, you have to deal with it and stop being such a bunch of bloody whingers. Lots of other countries are dealing with lockdowns and preventing mass deaths - news flash, you aren't special.

Yup.

One consistent thing I have noticed in every post against restrictions is that there is an extensive description of personal circumstances.

I think what I resent the most is the lack of space to struggle with this. I have pretty shitty personal circumstances too but I understand that this is bigger than me and my closest and this is going to be really hard for a good length of time yet. But there is no room for that in the chorus of tantrumming and foot stamping and I don’t think I’m alone.

@Lesserspottedmama

I knew you wouldn’t get much support here in the bizarre bubble that is Mumsnet but outside of here.. the average person wholeheartedly agrees with you OP. What an utter farce and hysterical nonsense. At least in my local area and wide network of family, friends and colleagues up and down the country anyway.

What do your family and friends think should be done instead then?

No one wants restrictions, but what is the alternative?

Whilst it may be legitimate to criticise the government and hold them to account over the way they have been handling this... we need to at least acknowledge that it does need to be handled... we can't just pretend its not happening or if we get angry enough with someone we can make it go away.
This is a natural disaster and its a shit time for everyone worldwide.
I think people are in denial.

@alliwanttodoiseatcarbs

No wonder the uk is a shit show. You guys are more concerned with saying up yours to your government than dealing with the pandemic you're in. Your hospital system is under pressure.

All I've read on here for months is whinging about restrictions and how you won't put up with it any longer. Well now you're fucked, you have to deal with it and stop being such a bunch of bloody whingers. Lots of other countries are dealing with lockdowns and preventing mass deaths - news flash, you aren't special.

Completely agree with you, it’s embarrassing

It would be so easy for me to wholeheartedly support a lockdown. I have a big house (by U.K. standards), large garden, kids at a private school which is doing absolutely everything that it can to mitigate Covid and provide the best education it can, I can WFH, my husband has been WFH for the last two years, we have savings, PIL are very comfortable and would help out financially if we needed them to...but no, I don’t support another lockdown. That’s nothing to do with me wanting to go to the bloody pub or the shops...I barely did that pre-Covid anyway. It’s about the long term future of this country and the people that live in it. The truth is that I haven’t felt so empassioned about something since I was shown a video at law school. That video was of the police beating the shit out of miners. Those miners were fighting for their futures and their family’s futures. This absolutely feels the same to me. And to a previous poster, asking the OP whether she was willing to stand as an MP.
Well, I absolutely am. As for who I would stand for, that’s another question as I don’t feel like any of the major parties represent my views at the moment.