Are we sacrificing the young to save the elderly?

[RubyandBen]

Reading another thread where someone was accusing the OP of wanting to sacrifice the elderly re CV. But the longer this goes on the more education and the economy are screwed is it actually the other way round?

You want schools to stay open, who do you propose will look after your children when you are working and schools closed.
Or do you think feral children are the way to go.
Do you ever listen to your ridiculous self. You had the kids, stop expecting others to do your job, school isn't childcare, and kids deserve to be educated not left to look at their screens so parents can work.

so parents can work.

So that they can feed, clothe, keep a roof over their children’s heads, give them opportunities, fund their university.

Not to mention fund all the essential services that keep society going via their taxes.

Total. Dicks.

Yes people have kids in the expectation that a radical concept such as going to school will be available for the clearly optional purposes of education. Is parents working to provide food and housing for their kids optional as well?

@Devlesko

You want schools to stay open, who do you propose will look after your children when you are working and schools closed. Or do you think feral children are the way to go. Do you ever listen to your ridiculous self. You had the kids, stop expecting others to do your job, school isn't childcare, and kids deserve to be educated not left to look at their screens so parents can work.

Refund my taxes then to enable me to take the hit financially and homeschool.

School isn’t just childcare but our society expects parents of school age children to work so by default it does have to provide that element alongside education.

The days before compulsory education weren’t filled with children being educated by their parents it was filled with children looking after themselves whilst their parents earned a living.

State Schools are a socialist concept. Don’t subscribe to it then don’t work in one.

It is not “entitled” to expect your kids to be able to go to school FGS

Is parents working to provide food and housing for their kids optional as well?

Can’t you just forage for stuff? Live in a cave? Aren’t you being hideously entitled to expect to find a house?

Fund a house

JFC I've heard it all now. Hand your kids over to SS because you have to go to work and cant sufficiently educate them from the "safety" of your home - wow!

@Devlesko you are truly something!

TBH @TheKeatingFive i think you are being extremely entitled to expect to have a job so that you can fund a house. There are plenty of caves around, you could just go and live in one of those, forage for food, whilst home educating your kids. You chose to have them after all!

@Devlesko

Parker

That's their problem to sort out, not a problem for those with a parent or both parents working pt to support their childs learning.
It's a choice for parents to make.
Maybe work fewer hours and cut cloth accordingly, school isn't childcare.
parents need to be parenting or if they can't maybe find a service that can like SS, maybe they can stand in for parents who want to work.

What you know about the role and capacity of social services I could inscribe on my left arse cheek and still have room left for a line inviting you to fuck off.

What you know about the role and capacity of social services I could inscribe on my left arse cheek and still have room left for a line inviting you to fuck off.

Literally spitting out my tea!

Roles and capacity change. I know a fair bit, so your arse must be massive .
Of course it's not entitled to send your kids to school when they are open.
It's entitled to expect them to stay open during a pandemic when the child has two parents to care for them. To expect vulnerable teachers and staff to carry on working in school.

I'd like to hear some solutions other than parents having to cope with everything, but there doesn't seem to be any.
So, we just have to get on with it, or not, depending on your view.

The answer to OP’s original question is 100% yes and everyone knows it is wrong but for reason people want to play this emperor’s new clothes game and pretend we see something different to the reality..

@Devlesko

look kids need to be in school they are the next doctors scientists engineers. We need these for society to function in the future.

No they don't. It's not the building that provides the education and why do they all need to be together with other children their own age.
That's no preparation for adult life. Who only ever works with people who were in the same year at school.
Bollocks.

Sorry where am i likely to get a pigs heart to disect at home? When can i get am ample supply of chemicals for chemistry, or MIG welding equipment or even soldering for electronics. There is a reason we send kids to school and university.

Devlesko hates working parents, rh9noa they're sheeple. Don't bother.

@Devlesko

Roles and capacity change. I know a fair bit, so your arse must be massive . Of course it's not entitled to send your kids to school when they are open. It's entitled to expect them to stay open during a pandemic when the child has two parents to care for them. To expect vulnerable teachers and staff to carry on working in school.

I'd like to hear some solutions other than parents having to cope with everything, but there doesn't seem to be any.
So, we just have to get on with it, or not, depending on your view.

I don't know why I'm bothering to engage @Devlesko but as you didn't bother to answer my post- I'll point out again- I'm a single parent who works full time, my DC's other parent lives 3 hours away and plays no part in the bulk of childcare. So what do I do? Oh there irony- roles and capacity change- yes, I never expected to be totally shafted by my ex but that's another story.

Your assertion about children having two parents is also offensive. I know many single mums in my position, some through separation/divorce. A good friend of mine who has an 8 yr old child is a single parent as the child's father died. What do you suggest she does?

Yeah, sure, someone who knows a fair bit about social services really thinks they're going to see "parents work" as reason to intervene with their kids . You're a bit of a joke, you.

Teachers are becoming ill, you want schools to remain open.
If ss are such a bad idea I'm sure "Fairies" aren't a good suggestion.

Rainbow
Just have a look at my comments on the other thread, I'll assure you I think sp are our biggest priority ito keeping some kids in school.

Yeah, I hate working parents, I was one until March, lol.

@Devlesko

Teachers are becoming ill, you want schools to remain open. If ss are such a bad idea I'm sure "Fairies" aren't a good suggestion.

Rainbow
Just have a look at my comments on the other thread, I'll assure you I think sp are our biggest priority ito keeping some kids in school.

Yeah, I hate working parents, I was one until March, lol.

Tbh @Devlesko it's not just about single parents, I was merely pointing out my own circumstances, and I cba to read more goady posts, there's enough on here alone. Your comment that people should cut their cloth, work less- you must really have had your head in the sand to be so ignorant (or at least you are pretending to be ignorant) of the financial hardships so many people are going through, even in a two parent household.

@Devlesko

Ok you hate working parents, so let's try another way.

I am still a stay-at-home, wanted to work this year but that's not happening right now, fairly well educated and with two quite young (Y5 & Y7) children, who are fairly chilled and don't really struggle academically yet.

We did a bit if home-schooling last summer term but oh my god they hated it. They don't see me as a teacher, our relationship was a battle, they didn't, well I was going to say thrive but that's not what I mean, they didn't have their usual spark for learning that they usually have. It was a chore for everyone. And before you assume I didn't try, oh my word I did, everything judgemental middle-class yummy-mummies can suggest we tried. It was soul destroying to think that this could be their education because they can achieve so much more.

And if it was like this for us, and believe me we understand we are lucky pampered pussies, can you just take a step back and look at how it is for people without these resources. If you can't emphasize with others does that make you qualified to teach younger minds?

The social interaction, expertise from teachers, different points of view, team work and sport, independence, competition, resources, variety, opportunities, choirs, chess clubs, responsibilities, discipline and a hundred other aspects of school are what our, and almost every other child, thrives on and contributes to them being a rounded human being able to deal with others in the world, than staying at home with me, online just could not give them. You will end up with a child who starts a job, gets a bit of criticism and bursts into tears.

So saying, and I do hope it's a wind up, but let's presume you mean it, "I hate working parents" automatically makes you unqualified to home teach. Insert another set of humans for "working parents" in that sentence and you can end up in jail for hate speech. Or are you unable to link that concept together?

Working parent or stay-at-home, everyone is trying their best for their children. Sometimes out of choice, sometimes out of necessity.

And hey if schools close you can all drop your kids here at least then there will be enough heads to put on a garden version of The Merchant of Venice (I can remember that one!)

Rainbow

I appreciate that, there are lots of people who will suffer when schools close.
Believe it or not I'd rather my own dd be at school, but in the case of closures we'll just have to get on with it.

Of course I don't hate working parents, but the pp seemed so intent on stating this and quite often does
My son is a working parent, I was one, my dh is one and almost everyone I know and my extended family.
I obviously hate a lot of people then.
Pretty much most of the working population are parents.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

@Devlesko I made no comment on you hating working parents?

The worst thing about your posts is the awful judgement on parents (and let's face it, most likely mothers) who are really concerned about the standard of education their DC will be getting over the next school year, and most likely beyond. Believe it or not I don't want schools open at all cost and for teachers to be thrown the wolves in the way the government are doing so. But if the schools close, I cannot educate two primary aged children, as a single parent, whilst working. And I am lucky, I am able to work from home and have an excellent and understanding employer. What are the many people in a worse position supposed to do? It's your judgement that people clearly are failing in their responsibility to educate their DC that's really disgusting and goady, If I don't work, my children don't have a home, don't have clothes, don't have food, or anything else. I'll choose that instead shall I, so I can teach them the national curriculum, whilst we're all starving?

You mention your son, I presume he went to school. How lovely for you that you never had to worry about his school closing for six months and god knows what is to come.

And @Devlesko did you say your DD was doing A-Levels? Do you really think you will be a fit substitute for her teachers?

The only positive for older DC's parents is no childcare stress. Mine are younger, the challenges are different. Gcse and a level students have no time to catch up from this nightmare.

Things needn't be so bleak for younger children, if we actually had a government and department for education that created a fit education system and responded with some ingenuity to the situation. We all know the problem is that it's completely beyond them.

Rainbow

The top paragraph was in response to your post.
Seems like you and I agree except I know as many fathers who are concerned.
I don't judge people in a worst situation than yourself, why would I?
I'd rather my dd be in school as A levels are kind of important, so we agree their too.
However, if school has to close and dd return home then I'll do the best I can with what I have.
The specs are downloaded, I know where she is up to with her subjects and me and dh will do our best.
Not everyone is fortunate enough to be able to, that's no reason to keep schools open for all.
There are those who would prefer to have their dc at home but can't because they'd get fined.
This would be a good move to lower the risk, with fewer children.
There are lots of different scenarios that could work.
At the end of the day we had the kids and we're in the middle of a pandemic, teachers are ill the same as other groups, some have died too.

Rainbow

I'm a qualified teacher. I taught A level Sociology, and home educated for 4 years. Nothing in teacher training includes teaching your own child one to one or home education.
Believe me I don't want her home. I miss her like mad and count the days, but if school closes we'll manage like many others.
I do feel sorry for people in your position of course I do, it would have been me if it was years ago. I mean juggling the kids and work, not as a sp.
I am like you i that I don't want schools to stay open at any cost, that's all.

@Devlesko you say you feel sorry for people but your posts have come across as having absolutely no empathy at all for people.

Anyway don't waste your time feeling sorry for me- as I said I'm fortunate, I work from home, my children are old enough that I can get on with work and they will be safe and happy. What I am completely unable to do is provide an education for them in those circumstances and you have deliberately tried to make people feel like shit and like they're not trying hard enough for being able to work and homeschool at the same time. For someone who does a job requiring intelligence it doesn't seem bright to suggest people give up work or cut their hours. These circumstances are about picking the least awful option and frankly there is no way I am destroying my physical and mental health trying to work and educate my children. If my children are safe and happy and I have a good job then that's as good as it will get if the schools shut. My children need a mother who can actually function and not a shell of a person. This has taken a toll on me and I make no apologies for it.

I fulfilled my legal obligation by sending my children to school. I would now like to see this shit show of a government actually deal with something in an innovative way to ensure children suffer as little as possible, but we all know they don't give a shit, look at their attitude towards school meals and children in poverty. So there's very little hope of them being able to actually consider what they could do to get rid of the hideous educational deficit our children are facing.