Is Lockdown generally something favoured by those who are generally left of centre/public sector?

[Treesofwood]

I would say I am definitely left leaning, and am also not in support of lockdowns as a strategy. Infact in some of my dealings on here I have been accused of being pro brexit, hard right. Why would that be? Can you be left wing and pro freedom or are the two actually mutually exclusive? And what does Brexit have to do with any of it?

I'm public sector as is DH and I do not believe for one second we should have another bloody lockdown.

I think what people seem to forget is most of the public sector was actually still working in the midst of the last one! No making memories for our family!

I'm young, left leaning and in the private sector. I support lockdowns when other measures aren't working.

That wasn't directly caused by Coronavirus but it's likely to continue unless the funding deficit is addressed

This is a strong argument in favour of opening up the economy. There can't be funding increases unless the economy produces enough wealth to tax.

I myself have no idea how to balance the disaster that is lockdown against the disaster that is the virus spreading. I guess the real answer is that we should become Germany somehow.

It has seemed that way to me. I think it is mostly because the Tories are the ones in power and the generally accepted assumption that the lockdown was too late - and the cries back in March that the herd immunity strategy is akin to endemically hence labour are pro lockdown and it is a position they can’t really back down from now as they are very invested in it. Plus Keir is now calling for a harder lockdown!
I’ve always thought it is a strange position for labour to take, very in labourly if you like as surely labour are there to protect labour/ jobs. The opposite of a lockdown!
But politics is back to front at the moment ( I blame brexit for this )
I was thinking if labour were in charge now, I wonder what position the tories would take as their older MC base are likely to be pro lockdown but their business supporters are generally anti.

What has really surprised me is that the urban/ student young seem to be pro lockdown despite them the most affected financially but least affected health wise. That might be because they are labour supporters / anti Tory - I not sure.But it is an interesting dynamic

@hopsalong

I've been very surprised by the lack of vigorous left-wing opposition to lockdown. I'm a left-of-centre floating Labour/Lib Den/ Green voter. I agree with many of the arguments about the long-term economy but it's the immediate impact of lockdown on the poor, vulnerable, and those ill with diseases other than covid that terrifies me. I also find the nation-state-monocular-vision aspect of lockdown policies depressing, because I don't understand why I should care more about an 80 year old in a care home in Northumberland than a hungry 10 year old in Africa. I don't know either of those people. I feel human sympathy for both, but I don't have more sympathy for someone because they're British.

A friend told me that in Nigeria (where she was born, and all her family live) Covid-19 is seen as a disease of the rich, a sort of decadent health problem like obesity and gout!

You could imagine a 2x2 matrix plotting benefit from lockdown (high or low) against cost of lockdown (high or low). There are a lot of people in the high benefit / low cost box (those Tory pensioners in their lovely houses on their big pensions) and a huge number in the low benefit/ high cost box (almost all healthy people under 40). I think this tends to ossify political debate, because those with something to gain have little appreciation of the sacrifices involved, and those making sacrifices have so little personally to gain. But because about half of the people in the low gain/ high cost box don't have the vote, and v few of the others have an influential voice in public debate, I think this group is not being well represented. Look at the cabinet/ constituency of SAGE. They're almost all much older than the median age, as well as being richer and more privileged.

I would put myself in the low gain/low cost box, because I'm young enough not to be worried about the illness (and already have antibodies) but old enough to have a fairly small mortgage and a very stable income. But my children are in the low gain/ high cost box, as are my students, so I sympathise with that position. I know only one person (very vulnerable teacher) in the high gain/ high cost box and perhaps this is the smallest?

I completely agree with your analysis. Labour should be Anti Lockdown, not pro. I too was surprised and still surprised they take such a pro lockdown position, wanting more of it!! As I said it seems backwards to me. Some left wingers e.g piers Corbyn take the position I would have thought labour should naturally take. I do think it goes back to the “herd immunity = eugenics “ outcry back in March and the lockdown was too late posturing by labour mp’s. they can’t really row back from this now as it would mean there analysis in March was wrong. But labour are there to support jobs and working people so should be anti locking down or at least minimising it. Their urban young supporters are pro lockdown though plus the public still seeMs to be so maybe that is the gamble for them

I myself have no idea how to balance the disaster that is lockdown against the disaster that is the virus spreading. I guess the real answer is that we should become Germany somehow.

This. Or New Zealand. They also have penguins, which would be a bonus.

I hate lockdown. I feel particularly hopeless at the moment being on the Wirral. It will cause terrible harm... yet in the absence of a functioning test, trace and isolate system, and with no vaccine yet, it seems to be the only hope of retaining any kind of functioning health service. When the ICUs are full, what will we do with people gravely injured in RTCs or after major surgery?

I’m left wing, neither authoritarian nor libertarian, socially liberal, second wave feminist, very, very anti-Brexit, NHS worker. Middle class, comfortable, WFH, not allowed to see my son, grandson, mum or dad.

@Janevaljane

Lockdown is not difficult for me. I can work from home and have lots of advantages that make Lockdown bearable.

But I am very aware of the threat to the economic health of this country, and I'm old enough to know what having a fucked economy is like. It's not pretty.

All of this.

The other point I think about why lockdown is anti working class as it is working class jobs that have to keep working and don’t have the luxury of staying home. Supermarket roles, bin men, emergency workers, nurses, utility workers, public transport workers, delivery drivers etc. What about them?
They enable the middle classes to sit at home having all their needs serviced demanding more lock down.
Such a privileged position to take

I myself have no idea how to balance the disaster that is lockdown against the disaster that is the virus spreading. I guess the real answer is that we should become Germany somehow

Sadly it's spreading in Germany quite quickly too.

Sadly it's spreading in Germany quite quickly too.

True but you just have to look at relative number of deaths to see the huge difference between Britain and Germany when it comes to covid.

@notevenat20

Sadly it's spreading in Germany quite quickly too.

True but you just have to look at relative number of deaths to see the huge difference between Britain and Germany when it comes to covid.

Oh I agree. They've handled it well so far.

I’m a left leaning business owner.
I’m not in favour of more restrictions because I’m already deeply concerned about what’s happening to those least able to cope.
Also with my legal hat on, I’m utterly horrified that this government are being given emergency powers with almost no examination.

@DdraigGoch

I'm interested to see all of the comments about "Tory retirees wanting lockdown" when I've come across plenty who would rather spend their remaining years with their grandchildren than be lonely until further notice.

Totally agree. Most (if not all) of the elderly, right-leaning, people I know are the same. They do not want to be locked down, when their remaining years are limited.

They are worried about the economy, not from a selfish standpoint ( they'll financially be OK) but because they fear for their children and grandchildren.

Totally agree. Most (if not all) of the elderly, right-leaning, people I know are the same. They do not want to be locked down, when their remaining years are limited

I know plenty who are now very keen on Nigel Farage as they think covid is a ridiculous fuss about nothing!

I do NOT agree ("well, we'll have to agree to disagree!") but that sentiment seems to be growing!

Left leaning and public sector and absolutley not in favour of a full lockdown.

I also think many are more accepting of death. My parents and ILs ( in their eighties) have watched many friends suffer a slow and undignified decline from neurodegenerative diseases. I think they fear that more than the virus.

I'm center left and although I was pro-lockdown back at the beginning of the pandemic, I don't see how it would work to have another one unless it was a very short 2 week lockdown. I am not 'anti-lockdown' per say, I won't protest, I won't make a fuss, but I just don't think the economy can take another long lockdown.

We needed a plan, clearly defined, now 'maybe' not wishy washy. At the moment there is no clarity and that's probably even worst than total lockdown as people are losing their jobs locally and have little or no support.

@Juniperandrage

A lot of lefties work in the third sector though, which is going to tank

Definitely. Charities are shedding jobs at a scale I've never seen. In my own team we've lost 2/3 of our staff. I think my job is safe until January 2021 but who knows.

I'm anti lockdown. The effects on the economy, on mental health, unemployment and increasing poverty are shocking.

The main pro lockdown groups seem to me to be (generalisation alert, in no particular order or judgement)

1. Middle class middle aged- happy working from home, Ocado deliveries, enjoyed lockdown in the spring, financially unaffected in fact have saved money
2. Genuinely vulnerable due To health or have family members in this position, financially ok due to receipt of benefits, pension or wealthy.
3. Urban young, students, pro labour supporters- may be unaffected financially e.g living at home with parents, working from home so still earning, on student loans.
4. NHS workers particularly working front line Covid, although my experience is that this group do take a more nuanced position
5. Some retirees / elderly either due to ill health or Fear factor due to reading sensationalist press, watching gmb. Generally financially unaffected due to pension, benefits, own wealth

There is a difference between left wing/right wing and libertarian/authoritarian and you can have a combination of one of the first two with one of the second two.

So you can have left-wing libertarian or left-wing authoritarian, or right-wing libertarian or right-wing authoritarian.

(there is an online quiz you can take to determine how much of each you are).
I

Polling from Yougov yesterday had 71% of Labour voters thinking there should have been a circuit break lockdown, 37% of Conservatives thought the same. Tory shires type areas have been less badly hit this autumn so far (compared with the nationwide impact in the spring) so maybe different results would have been found if it wasn't mostly Labour heartlands that had been affected with rising cases right now.

Somewhat true...

I think definitely I've seen some very insulated (and insular!) people absolutely baying for more restrictions. Confusingly they are quite left wing and go on about "lives are more important than the economy". It's easy to talk this way when your job and income is secure and you have no dcs or young people to worry about.

I would say I'm very middle of the road, and my views are very middle of the road too! I swerve between thinking, Fuck it, it's out there, there's nothing we can do, if I cop it then so be it (i am in shielded category as was) and wanting to batten down the hatches and eat my stash of baked beans for two years.

I have dcs who are very much suffering (eg ds's graduate training job cancelled and dd missing a lot of exam-year school). Several relatives have had not just jobs but long careers go pooof! because they are in the entertainment/hospitality sector.

So I can't be selfish. With no vaccine until July 2021 at least, locking down for around another year would ruin us all.

@sashagabadon

The main pro lockdown groups seem to me to be (generalisation alert, in no particular order or judgement)

1. Middle class middle aged- happy working from home, Ocado deliveries, enjoyed lockdown in the spring, financially unaffected in fact have saved money
2. Genuinely vulnerable due To health or have family members in this position, financially ok due to receipt of benefits, pension or wealthy.
3. Urban young, students, pro labour supporters- may be unaffected financially e.g living at home with parents, working from home so still earning, on student loans.
4. NHS workers particularly working front line Covid, although my experience is that this group do take a more nuanced position
5. Some retirees / elderly either due to ill health or Fear factor due to reading sensationalist press, watching gmb. Generally financially unaffected due to pension, benefits, own wealth

Are students and the urban young pro lockdown? Not in my experience, well not now anyway, and they're not behaving like that

Where the F is the track and trace? If we had an efficient system we would know in far more detail if places like pubs and hairdressers are places where people catch it. If school children are a driver. If pubs are a high risk. There is no freeking leadership.

I also feel that if the current rules were implemented we would be far better off. We walked past one of our local restaurants over the weekend and it was absolutely packed. It's a small space, no distance between tables, no panels, staff not wearing masks. If people and businesses complied more with the rules, we would be safer.